Speculation: Damien Cox on CBC: Wings willing to move 1st round pick and/or Mantha at draft

[Henkka]

http://www.sportsnet.ca/hockey/nhl/30-thoughts-defencemen-a-hot-commodity-at-draft/

Byfuglien or Phaneuf, both are mean.

 

[Bench]

byfuglien is one of the only possibly available mean defenders that i want.

With the IC stamp of approval, this has to happen now.

 

[supersonic jet]

With the IC stamp of approval, this has to happen now.

If you guys get Buff I will be cheering for your team. We are 3 yrs away from being a contender. Trading Buff will probably mean we miss playoffs but we have a lot coming up through the pipeline. When is your new arena going to be ready, looks awesome.

 

[Heaton]

I'd like Byfuglien, though. More than Phaneuf, actually. He'll have a more reasonable contract moving forward, same age, way more offense.

I know he's not the coveted 25-year-old stud we want, but he'd go a long way to making the Wings blueline look better in key areas of weakness. Size, offense, physical play.

I still don't think Phaneuf is nearly as bad as people think. What player hasn't gone from looking good to looking terrible on Toronto?

 

[newfy]

I still don't think Phaneuf is nearly as bad as people think. What player hasn't gone from looking good to looking terrible on Toronto?

I agree the hate for Dion is almost pathetic on here. Hes a quality top pairing dman that gets hung out in Toronto.

Beauchemin became one of the top defenders in the west after moving out of Toronto. Their system does not help the D at all and people hate on Dion because of him being a captain. Come to Detroit and play 3 less minutes a game and not have as much media attention and he would look great. Other teams would be scared of Kronwall and Phaneuf out there patrolling as well

 

[Cyborg Yzerberg]

byfuglien is one of the only possibly available mean defenders that i want.

IC, I'd like for you take a trip down fantasy land with me and picture a Red Wings top 4 consisting of Kronwall, Big Buff, Dekeyser, and one of Paul Martin and Andrej Sekera. And revel.

 

[Cyborg Yzerberg]

I still don't think Phaneuf is nearly as bad as people think. What player hasn't gone from looking good to looking terrible on Toronto?

Phaneuf is a legit top 4 defensemen, the problem is both the term and the cap hit as well as his rate of regression.

 

[newfy]

Phaneuf is a legit top 4 defensemen, the problem is both the term and the cap hit as well as his rate of regression.

If Weiss is going back the wings are barely taking on any salary at all for Phaneuf and gain a top pair dman instead of having Weiss in the bottom 6. Cap hit shouldnt matter

 

[SoupNazi]

The way Babs used Weiss, though, I'm not sure if Weiss would go back in any Toronto deal. He has an NTC, right?

 

[DRW204]

as a detroit fan living in winnipeg- would love to see Buff in Detroit and Mantha in the Peg whether it be on the NHL or AHL level

 

[InjuredChoker]

IC, I'd like for you take a trip down fantasy land with me and picture a Red Wings top 4 consisting of Kronwall, Big Buff, Dekeyser, and one of Paul Martin and Andrej Sekera. And revel.

ha, D would suddenly go from weakness to a big time strength. top 2 in the east.

If Weiss is going back the wings are barely taking on any salary at all for Phaneuf and gain a top pair dman instead of having Weiss in the bottom 6. Cap hit shouldnt matter

not a top pair dman at least on the right side. he gets exposed there due to his lack of mobility and PMD abilities. he's better on a more offensive role too, so it would be better to use him on the second pairing. issue on top pair RD still exist.

cap hit definitely matters. it's not 4.9 mil vs 7 mil, it's 7mil vs whatever weiss' buyout caphit is.

 

[Heaton]

The way Babs used Weiss, though, I'm not sure if Weiss would go back in any Toronto deal. He has an NTC, right?

They could just buy him out. Getting rid of Phaneuf's contract and then being on the hook for a fraction of Weiss' contract might be enticing enough.

 

[sarcastro]

I'd like Byfuglien, though. More than Phaneuf, actually. He'll have a more reasonable contract moving forward, same age, way more offense.

I know he's not the coveted 25-year-old stud we want, but he'd go a long way to making the Wings blueline look better in key areas of weakness. Size, offense, physical play.

Fugly only has one year left on his deal. Can't give up very much for him knowing he'll probably walk.

 

[HockeyinHD]

When we said we wanted you to make a trade, we didn't mean to trade these assets! Trade a damn winger. Trade one of those lump of coal defensemen. Don't trade the first or the money prospects, Holland! Honestly.

Trade the things that don't have much value so that when you make the trade we can then criticize you for not being more aggressive in the type of trade you did. Which we just told you we didn't want, until you don't do it, then we do want it, but you better not do it.

If Detroit is trading a #1 or Mantha or both, the available targets expand a bit to possibly include vets with 1-2 years remaining on current deals, or perhaps RFAs on teams who know they will struggle to retain them after this year, or even for this year. Or they may just be looking to move up in the draft.

It will be interesting to see what becomes of this, if anything.

 

[WingedWheel1987]

If the Wings trade for Phaneuf, it can't be the only move. Trading for Phaneuf is trying to win now. If you are trying to win now, you can't half *** it.

I think Phaneuf will be a quality addition to the blue line. Easily the second best defenseman on the team.

 

[HockeyinHD]

I still don't think Phaneuf is nearly as bad as people think. What player hasn't gone from looking good to looking terrible on Toronto?

7 mil a year.

Until 2021.

Yeah, no thanks. Now, if Toronto would retain some significant portion of that salary (what's the rule 50% max? I'd settle for 25%) then maybe. 4-5 per year instead of 7 for Phaneuf makes a ton more sense.

I'd only want to go straight up with Mantha though. Toronto holds 2+ mil a year of the deal and gets Mantha, we take Phaneuf off their hands.

Phaneuf's probably in the Kronwall Zone. Overmatched as a lead dman on a contender but still around the top 30 at the position. 7 mil for that, ouch.

 

[wings95]

Lets hope Holland does not give up on Mantha already. Maybe they are soured on him, hope not. That size and skill and skating with his scoring potential is hard to find!!

 

[Claypool]

Hilarious that people believe Weiss will still consider waiving his NTC to go to Toronto to ride the bench even more (or that Babcock would even want him back in the first place). The Toronto deal made sense at the time in that each team got to dump a bad contract. Now that Babcock is in Toronto the deal is dead. They are no longer good trade partners.

 

[Kronwalled55]

Just sign Paul Martin. Trade Mantha and 1st, so we obtain a higher draft pick.

That's not a bad idea actually... I mean, Martin is pretty old but if it means we can use Mantha and our first to gain a much higher position that would be pretty beneficial. I think we're in a better position to rebuild for the future rather than trying to win a cup right now.

 

[DRW204]

how much higher can we get realistically by packaging the 19+Mantha?

is there that much of a drop off from werenski to roy,chabot, zboril etc.

 

[Run the Jewels]

Exactly! If it was true than I believe Friedman would have included it in his 30 thoughts today. All he said was wings are looking for a defenceman with a bit of mean in them. No mention at all of Mantha or the 1st being available.

The Kings are ****ing stacked. Didn't make the playoffs, but their AHL affiliate just ran roughshod over the entire league - the second best league in the world!

1. Teams looking for defence are also eyeing the Kings’ AHL franchise, Manchester. The Monarchs won the Calder Cup on Saturday with a 2-1 Game 5 victory over Utica. “Colin Miller is ready to play in the NHL now,†said one NHL exec. Miller, 21, a fifth-rounder in 2012, was third in regular-season scoring for Manchester with 19 goals and 52 points in 70 games. He had 10 points in 19 playoff games. The other is 22-year-old Derek Forbort, taken 15th overall in 2010. There have been mixed reviews in the past, but he impressed in this run. Is it Los Angeles for Miller and Forbort, or somewhere else?

5. Hearing Detroit is looking for a defenceman who can take some of the physical responsibility from Niklas Kronwall. While the Red Wings like their prospects, they see too many similarities to what is already there.

He says mean but I think the truth is mediocrity.

how much higher can we get realistically by packaging the 19+Mantha?

is there that much of a drop off from werenski to roy,chabot, zboril etc.

You have to move into the top 10. Hanifin, Werenski and Provorov are the only guys seen as locks to be really good NHL'ers. Anyone else has question marks and drafting them at 19 seems like a reach.

 

[Bench]

Fugly only has one year left on his deal. Can't give up very much for him knowing he'll probably walk.

Why would he walk? The Wings would certainly make him a fair deal. They've been throwing big money to all the decent defenders in free agency.

 

[johnnyarmstrong]

Just sign Franson.

 

[Heaton]

Hilarious that people believe Weiss will still consider waiving his NTC to go to Toronto to ride the bench even more (or that Babcock would even want him back in the first place). The Toronto deal made sense at the time in that each team got to dump a bad contract. Now that Babcock is in Toronto the deal is dead. They are no longer good trade partners.

What if he was guaranteed that Toronto would buy him out? If I were Weiss, I'd want another shot to pick my team.

 

[Bench]

I agree the hate for Dion is almost pathetic on here. Hes a quality top pairing dman that gets hung out in Toronto.

Beauchemin became one of the top defenders in the west after moving out of Toronto. Their system does not help the D at all and people hate on Dion because of him being a captain. Come to Detroit and play 3 less minutes a game and not have as much media attention and he would look great. Other teams would be scared of Kronwall and Phaneuf out there patrolling as well

Agreed with both you and Heaton.

I was always in favor of getting Phaneuf. I like Big Buff a little more, but honestly both would improve the defense a ton. They both have flaws to their game and neither are that ideal defender we've been dreaming of, but whatever... Detroit is going to have to draft their new franchise defender. In the meantime, if they feel like competing at all, you bring in guys that help even if they aren't perfect.