Olympics: China...

[Pabst Plays Westboro]

The last thing I heard about Chinese hockey was that Claude Lemieux was playing there. Coincidentally, that was the only thing I've ever heard about hockey in China. So why in the world are they in the Olympics? Did they actually beat out Belarus, Latvia, Kazakhstan or Denmark?

How do people see them doing? I know that in all likelihood they'll get wrecked, but is their inclusion in the Olympics going to help hockey in china?

Click to read more...

 

[GKJ]

I assume you're talking about Womens' Hockey.

It's probably a sign of how underfunded some of the other programs are. China has been in the Olympics since they brought in womens hockey

 

[Pabst Plays Westboro]

Well I'm a moron, I just saw the Chinese flag in the Olympic schedule and didn't both to see if it was men's or women's.

Don't mind me.

 

[Ohashi_Jouzu*]

Well I'm a moron, I just saw the Chinese flag in the Olympic schedule and didn't both to see if it was men's or women's.

Don't mind me.

Well, in your defense, hockey (while the furthest thing from a main stream sport) may be catching on in China. I believe Japan, Korea, and China have mens teams that play each other with more regularity every year. I wouldn't have known if I hadn't help coach a team in Japan for the last 5 years.

If you can handle the abysmal English translations, this will give you an idea of what's going on over there in "recent" years:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/China_men's_national_ice_hockey_team

http://www.beijinghockey.com/

http://www.chinadaily.com.cn/sports/2008-01/28/content_6425257.htm

 

[glovesave_35]

Despite being a non-traditional hockey country, part of me says that China could be great in 20-40 years time. If they grow from the ground up, there's no reason a country like that couldn't ice a team equal to Slovakia or Czech Republic (no offense intended to those countries).

 

[Fork]

Despite being a non-traditional hockey country, part of me says that China could be great in 20-40 years time. If they grow from the ground up, there's no reason a country like that couldn't ice a team equal to Slovakia or Czech Republic (no offense intended to those countries).

yeah, just look at curling

 

[lifeisruff]

all I can tell you about hockey in Asia is that there is some league where Derek Plante played for a couple of seasons

 

[finchster]

It would be nice if China went 'Soviet' and spent lots of time and effort to show up the western world haha. Imagine a hockey power in Asia? It is just what hockey needs to become a global sport rather than the traditional European/ North American base

 

[Bixby Snyder]

It would be nice if China went 'Soviet' and spent lots of time and effort to show up the western world haha. Imagine a hockey power in Asia? It is just what hockey needs to become a global sport rather than the traditional European/ North American base

everything else comes from china these days so why not hockey players?

 

[frostyflo]

everything else comes from china these days so why not hockey players?

yeah, why not?
and the commies want to be among the best at everything they do, especially sports (just look at how they drilled a whole youth for the last summer-olympics)
and with japan have already a pretty good hockey team thats even more motivation for them

 

[God Bless Canada]

Their women's program has been okay for a lot of years. For a while, they were No. 4. (Granted, it was a distant No. 4. The U.S. and Canada have obviously been tops since they started have Women's World Championships and women's Olympic hockey). Back when China was No. 4, they were also a long ways behind Finland. (Finland used to have a lot of one-goal games with Canada).

Now, China's fallen back in the rankings. Sweden has passed them. I think the Russians have passed them. A lot of people thought the Chinese might be able to make serious in-roads in women's hockey. But it never happened. I don't think the players are worse than they were 10 years ago. And I don't think women's hockey is less popular. It's just that other countries have passed them.

 

[Hennessy]

Speaking of Chinese hockey, a few weeks ago I was on their national site and sent an email using the address provided asking for some general info. It came back undeliverable.

 

[InglewoodJack]

Hockey is catching on in Asia, especially in Korea, China and Japan. Even Mongolia has a team! And I read hockey is one of the fastest growing sports in the East. But I do see a problem in making these countries respectable on a world scale- Size.
Look at these statistics comparing height and weight between several hockey powers vs. Asian countries.
Average height:
Canada - 5'9
America 5'10
Sweden 5'11
Finland 5'11
Germany 5'10

China 5'7
Japan 5'7 1/2
Korea 5'8

See? Asiatic people are historically small. Not to say that there aren't any 6'2 200 asians but size in Hockey countries is considerably larger than Asian averages. I can't find weight averages, but By just looking at the height, there has only been 5 players in the past 10 years under 5'8. One is Brian Gionta, the other Theo Fleury plus 3 marginal NHLers. So on average Asian players would be smaller hockey players, and imagine any of the Canadian or American players who take advantage of this? You need NHL/KHLers to succeed, and Asian nations won't get many. I do wish them success though.

 

[Karl Hungus]

Hockey in China is buried under a lot of other, more accessible sports. However there is one city famous for ice called Harbin (also has a beer named after it). This is where most of their hockey players and coaches are coming from.

Shanghai is part of an Asian league has a team called the Sharks that is most made up of players from the Chinese national team and a few North American imports. I think Wade Flaherty is, or was, their playing coach. If you're in Shanghai in the winter you can catch their games on TV.

 

[Karl Hungus]

Hockey is catching on in Asia, especially in Korea, China and Japan. Even Mongolia has a team! And I read hockey is one of the fastest growing sports in the East. But I do see a problem in making these countries respectable on a world scale- Size.
Look at these statistics comparing height and weight between several hockey powers vs. Asian countries.
Average height:
Canada - 5'9
America 5'10
Sweden 5'11
Finland 5'11
Germany 5'10

China 5'7
Japan 5'7 1/2
Korea 5'8

See? Asiatic people are historically small. Not to say that there aren't any 6'2 200 asians but size in Hockey countries is considerably larger than Asian averages. I can't find weight averages, but By just looking at the height, there has only been 5 players in the past 10 years under 5'8. One is Brian Gionta, the other Theo Fleury plus 3 marginal NHLers. So on average Asian players would be smaller hockey players, and imagine any of the Canadian or American players who take advantage of this? You need NHL/KHLers to succeed, and Asian nations won't get many. I do wish them success though.

There's also a billion people in China. I bet you there are more large, athletic people in China than Canada, Sweden, Germany, or Finland.

 

[james bond]

NYI owner, Charles Wang, has recently been bogged down in the Light House project but has an genuine interest in the sport of hockey. In recent years he has built some rinks and sent teams and coaches to Northern China in efforts to bring the game to the people. Of course, it takes much more than that to hand Canada its lunch at the Olympics, but we will see.
On the athletic side of things, China should easily be able to ice a team without size being too much of an issue. I guess Yao Ming and other NBA players come to mind. Hu Kai, who was considered China's top sprinter (personal best in the 100M was 10.24) stands at about 6 ft and if he had learned to skate since 5 years of age, I am sure would have no problem keeping up the NHL's best.
Once again, alot of ifs there.
Can anyone from Harbin area speak to recent rink facility growth?

 

[RedLeader]

Hockey is catching on in Asia, especially in Korea, China and Japan. Even Mongolia has a team! And I read hockey is one of the fastest growing sports in the East. But I do see a problem in making these countries respectable on a world scale- Size.
Look at these statistics comparing height and weight between several hockey powers vs. Asian countries.
Average height:
Canada - 5'9
America 5'10
Sweden 5'11
Finland 5'11
Germany 5'10

China 5'7
Japan 5'7 1/2
Korea 5'8

See? Asiatic people are historically small. Not to say that there aren't any 6'2 200 asians but size in Hockey countries is considerably larger than Asian averages. I can't find weight averages, but By just looking at the height, there has only been 5 players in the past 10 years under 5'8. One is Brian Gionta, the other Theo Fleury plus 3 marginal NHLers. So on average Asian players would be smaller hockey players, and imagine any of the Canadian or American players who take advantage of this? You need NHL/KHLers to succeed, and Asian nations won't get many. I do wish them success though.

Yea just look their basketball team, dwarfs really when you think about it.

Sorry, but that was probably the most effort on a stupid notion I've ever seen a post.

 

[glovesave_35]

Hockey is catching on in Asia, especially in Korea, China and Japan. Even Mongolia has a team! And I read hockey is one of the fastest growing sports in the East. But I do see a problem in making these countries respectable on a world scale- Size.
Look at these statistics comparing height and weight between several hockey powers vs. Asian countries.
Average height:
Canada - 5'9
America 5'10
Sweden 5'11
Finland 5'11
Germany 5'10

China 5'7
Japan 5'7 1/2
Korea 5'8

See? Asiatic people are historically small. Not to say that there aren't any 6'2 200 asians but size in Hockey countries is considerably larger than Asian averages. I can't find weight averages, but By just looking at the height, there has only been 5 players in the past 10 years under 5'8. One is Brian Gionta, the other Theo Fleury plus 3 marginal NHLers. So on average Asian players would be smaller hockey players, and imagine any of the Canadian or American players who take advantage of this? You need NHL/KHLers to succeed, and Asian nations won't get many. I do wish them success though.

I'm not even sure what to make of this. The discrepancy in averages is a mere inch or two below Canada. The point about size in regards to sports isn't really about national averages anyhow, but about the outliers. The average NFL player is nowhere near the average American in terms of height or weight, same with NBA. With China's population alone they are more likely to produce more "outliers" in terms of height. If China ever does devote the time, energy, and resources to producing hockey players they likely won't trot out a team full of 5'8 guys. Yao Ming? There are specific pockets of China where people are significantly taller than other regions, if I'm not mistaken.

 

[Topgoon]

Hockey is catching on in Asia, especially in Korea, China and Japan. Even Mongolia has a team! And I read hockey is one of the fastest growing sports in the East. But I do see a problem in making these countries respectable on a world scale- Size.....

There's a million things you can point out as obstacles to China becoming a hockey nation, but that is probably THE worst example you can give.

Size is already weak enough of an arguement, but even an argument about the average Asian BMI being lower is better than height (1 - b/c height isn't that big of a factor for success, and 2 - because there are probably more 'taller than average NHL height' people in China than in Canada). However, physical limitations are generally a weak argument.

Better arguments:

- Lack of state-supported programs - the Chinese government, while pretty good at developing athletes, won't give hockey the same support as other winter sports mainly due to a lack of "reward" for their efforts. They need to train an entire team to compete against NHLers for just one medal!
- Majority of Chinese are low income families - hockey is an expensive sport, therefore unless its state-supported you won't have wide-spread interest or development of talent.
- Chinese culture favors academics over athletics - most parents will generally push their kids towards academics over sports, lowering
- Chinese culture favors finesse sports over more physical, contact sports (rugby, football, and hockey are simply not very popular and are especially looked down upon by the elder generations of Chinese)

Just off the top of my head.

Its these same culture and economical issues that you see Korea and Japan developing more professional hockey players despite their vastly smaller population.

 

[Spence334]

It would be nice if China went 'Soviet' and spent lots of time and effort to show up the western world haha. Imagine a hockey power in Asia? It is just what hockey needs to become a global sport rather than the traditional European/ North American base

If that were to happen, they would win the gold every year. 1.5 billion people, I'm sure that there would be at least 10 Crosby's and Ovy's. Hell 10 Lemieux and Gretzky and maybe even 3 or 4 Haseks.

Yeah if China was a hockey superpower, they would win gold

 

[james bond]

It would at least be nice to have another competitive team on the world stage. The same teams all the time is really anti climactic.

 

[02m3smg]

I played there. Ice is bad, nonexistent equipment. Few buddies of mine from MTHL, and some that crept up to Jr. A went over and played. The Sharks are the team, the first year they had a bunch of 30-40 year olds from the two teams, hosa and harbin I think. Last year Claude Lemieux was over. I think Wade Flaherty was over there too. Plante and Skalde were on the Japanese teams.

Anyways they have 3 imports, guys from ECHL. They could probably get some Chinese Canadians but no one really wants to play.

In Shanghai there is one rink with a cement pole on the ice. They thought we were Olympians when we skated.

Give it 20-30 years but I doubt it will catch on.

 

[james bond]

The Sharks are sponsored-affiliated with the San Jose Sharks. There was talk a couple of years ago about getting footprint in China since it is an expanding market. Once again the NHL has seemed to drop the ball in terms of exposing the product there. The NBA has already set up some training facilities, beating the NHL to the punch. I heard that the Vancouver Canucks were the other team that wanted to get into China as well although I have no link to confirm.

 

[mlugia]

The chinese women's team in question actually played a NA tour recently, and I went to the game where they played my Waterloo Warriors (UW team) and they soundly trounced us (I think it was 8-2 or something). They were pretty talented, but the size difference was pretty obvious, as is their tendency to use the stick for defense instead of their body (ie only stick checking, no hits)

I'm hoping China rises to prominence in hockey before I die though.

 

[Booba]

all I can tell you about hockey in Asia is that there is some league where Derek Plante played for a couple of seasons

Well it seems like there is a decent pro league in Asia. There are 4 teams in Japan, 2 in Korea and 1 in China. Actually the Chinese team had some sort of affiliation with the San Jose Sharks (it lasted one year). That's why Claude Lemieux played a few games in this league before signing with San Jose.

Since the league was created 7 years ago, a few former NHLers played briefly in this league, among them there is Wade Flaherty, Jamie McLennan, Esa Tikkanen, Ricard Persson, Derek Plante, Shjon Podein, Tyson Nash and Steve McKenna. They also have a lot of former AHLers and ECHLers + the best asians players

They also produce one NHL player, Yukuta Fukufuji (It's kinda debatable)

I don't know much about the level of play but it's probably as good as some leagues in Europe (I'm not talking about the KHL or the SEL but more about the best league of France, UK, Belarus etc.)