Actually, I'm not "harping on Ronaldo and Messi.
I'm just saying the obvious : once both aren't on allstar teams, they don't perform the same way.
Which is why having someone like Platini dominate both with NT and club should count for something.
Was Juventus some midtable club before Platini joined? Of course they weren't.
They had won Seria A 4 times in 6 years before Platini joined and then won it twice more in the next 5 years with him in the side.
You're presenting it like he was on Modena or Padova, not Juventus.
Platini had 1 league title with St Etienne and 2 with Juve, to go with one EC title.
Ronaldo has 3 PL titles, 2 La Liga and 4 CL titles.
No matter how you spin it, the numbers don't compare.
And of course Ronaldo was on the strong teams, you don't win all these titles by playing for Cesena... But very few great players weren't on great teams of their era, and very few won what he's won (by the age of 32).
You think Messi wins 3 UCLs if he was playing on Espanyol, for example? Of course not.
Era-defining players require strong teams around them to get continous success.
But them being so great is part of why the team is great in the first place.
Oh so now it has to be "peak Ronaldo".
So your point wasn't the good one. OK.
Of course it concerns a more grown-up Ronaldo, which is what all the posts about him being 19 in 2004 are about.
I thought that was clear by my posts lol...
It's not Ronaldo's fault, but when you say Ronaldo has more Bd'O than Platini, you might take into account Platini never benefited from rules changing in order to favour him.
I never once mentioned Bd'Os.
If that's what you thought I was saying by individual records, that's not what I meant.
I didn't call Ronaldo penaldo. I didn't argue anything about the penalties.
He DID have a bad game. He was voted there because he's the media darling. Anyone who saw the game knows he wasn't good.
Dude just re-watch the game and try not to hate. It was a pretty tight, scrappy afair - but he was by far the best and most creative player on the pitch. He wasn't outherworldy, but best on pitch, probably - certainly not "bad".
(another who had a good game that night was Evra - and another one of your favories lol)
It does compare because at the time, those champions had the best players of their country.
Comparing Sparta Prague of today and Sparta Prague of 1985 is either being dishonest or ignorant of the teams of the time.
They were stronger than they are today.
They were also nowhere near what a squad like Chelsea or ManCity or Atletico are today.
Even here, it's not like the whole Yugoslav national team was playing at Red Star, there were great players playing for Dinamo, Partizan, Hajduk, etc.
The wealth of players simply wasn't big enough for these teams to put out clubs on the level of Real, Juve, Milan etc. - and that's not even counting that key players DID play abroad after hitting 28 (or simply running away, like Boban did when he joined Milan).
In Juve's run to Heysel, they faced Ilves, Grasshoppers and Sparta.
Finland never saw an international competition in those years.
Swiss never qualified for a big competition from 1966 to 1994.
And Czechoslovakia didn't qualify for a major competition between 1980 and 1990.
Even if you put their national teams there, they would've been hard pressed to give a team like Juventus a good game - let alone a team from those countries who
didn't have anywhere close to all the national team players.
Aggregate score was 6-1 vs Ilves, 6-2 vs G-hoppers and 3-1 vs Sparta, with the first leg in Turin 3-0 and the tie basically decided.
Sparta got to the quarters by beating Valerengens and Lnygby, the champions of Norway and Denmark - it's not like they had a generation like Steaua or Red Star later with actual competing sides.
It was just a tournament with very few quality teams, but one where you had to take care not to screw up as it was KO from round 1.
At the same time, their opponent, Liverpool, had to face such powerhouses as Lech Poznan (5-0 agg), Austria Wien (5-2), and Panathinaikos (5-0).
They had a round vs Benfica (good opponent), like Juve had vs Bordeux. But that was it.
And compare that to what a team has to go through to win the UCL today.
It's not even remotely comparable.
...
So no, the level of competition wasn't at the level where it is today.
I don't even know how you can say that with a straight face.
Now, to be clear I'm not saying Juventus' win the EC back then is any less impressive than Real's win in 2017.
For me, every EC/UCL win is the same, no matter which era, no matter which team - they are all hard to win, just the circumstances are different.
But you're saying the opposite, that Platini's win somehow has more merit than any one of Ronaldo's.
And it's a ridiculous notion.
I don't thrown any "dirt" at Ronaldo.
I just disagreed with the notion of #2 OAT.
That's fine - if you didn't have ridiculous double standards for him and everyone else. Or is it for Platini and everyone else?