Confirmed Trade: [CGY/EDM] James Neal for Milan Lucic (12.5% retained) and a 2020 conditional 3rd round pick Part 3

[oXo Cube]

So for the Oilers this amounts to them taking on a little around a few hundred thousand extra on the cap for this year in the hopes Neal can bounce back?

If not they can buy him out the following year and save roughly 4 million per over the next few? decent sized gamble.

Oilers get out of the NMC + unbuyoutable Lucic contract and get a player they think might have some bounce back potential.

Flames get some immediate cap space and a player they think will be a better fit for the role they would have had Neal playing.

 

[Rubi]

Lucic is not owed another $21 million. The Oilers paid out his bonus for this year and retained. Lucic is owed another $16 million, but the Oilers also retained salary and will have to pay a portion of that $16 million.

You are absolutely right. My bad for not actually looking it up and using the 4 x $5.25M = $21M figure.
Actual salary to be paid by the Flames, to Lucic, will be $2.25M in the 2019-2020 season, $3.25M in the 2020-2021 season, $4.25M in the 2021-2022 season, and $3.25M in the 2022-2023 season, for a total of $13 million..

Thanks for the heads up. I have corrected my original post.

 

[Aceboogie]

I cant say forsure Lucic wont be a physical presence in Calgary. But I will say, back in 2016 when he came in, he was saying how motivated he was and he knew hwat his role had to be (physical presence). The Oilers then had a really good year and all the players were buzzing. Yet Lucic, in his first year in Edmonton, in the midst of making the playoffs in the first time in forever, was largely invisible all year. He was stapled to McDavid so got some points, but resembled nothing of his Boston self physically. Then came the playoffs and in 2 pretty intense rounds (including a physical one with Anahiem), he was yet again invisible physically.

The only really time Lucic made a difference physically was in the last 20 games of the 2016/17 regular season, leading up to the playoffs. It didnt carry forward to the playoffs, or the 17/18 season or the 18/19 season. Despite numerous blurbs abotu him being motivated, coming back in the best shape of his life and really wanting to be a physical force again.

Oiler fans saw the same song and dance that being played now for the last 3 years. And it wasnt the case of a hyped UFA going to a brutal team with a bad locker room and losing motivation. Lucic came into Edmonton with McDavid, New arena, playoffs, excitement and all the good stuff and failed to show up

Who knows, maybe hell do it in Calgary. But fool me once...

 

[Rubi]

Wow.. just looked up Lucic's salary figures on CapFriendly. Milan Lucic - CapFriendly - NHL Salary Caps

Edmonton has paid Lucic $26 million for 3 years of service ($8 mil in 2016-2017, $8 mil in 2017-2018, and $10 mil in 2018-2019) and will still have to pay him another $1 million over the next 4 years. That really sucks.

Oilers pays Lucic $27 million to play 3 years for them.
Calgary will pay Lucic $13 million to play 4 years for them.

Chiarelli really screwed the Oilers good.

 

[TheNumber4]

Wow.. just looked up Lucic's salary figures on CapFriendly. Milan Lucic - CapFriendly - NHL Salary Caps

Edmonton has paid Lucic $26 million for 3 years of service ($8 mil in 2016-2017, $8 mil in 2017-2018, and $10 mil in 2018-2019) and will still have to pay him another $1 million over the next 4 years. That really sucks.

Oilers pays Lucic $27 million to play 3 years for them.
Calgary will pay Lucic $13 million to play 4 years for them.

Chiarelli really screwed the Oilers good.

Never understand why fans care about Salary amounts or why it's even talked about at all by Hockey media. All that matters is Cap hits and Cap Consequences. Unless you really really care about Daryl Katz pocket books and balance sheets.

 

[Rubi]

Never understand why fans care about Salary amounts or why it's even talked about at all by Hockey media. All that matters is Cap hits and Cap Consequences. Unless you really really care about Daryl Katz pocket books and balance sheets.

Hockey clubs are businesses. Businesses that continually run in the red either get sold, move elsewhere, or fold. Contrary to some fans opinions hockey clubs are not non-profit organizations who's sole purpose is to provide entertainment, no matter what the cost, to the citizens of the city that it operates in.

 

[Cup or Bust]

Anything the Oilers get for Lucic is literally an upgrade. Just by subtracting a player with 0 stick handling ability , terrible wrist shot , slugs his way around the ice automatically takes the piano out of our top 3 lines back. He was all wrong for the Oilers. Edmonton is trying to build an uptempo quick counter attack team and Neal is an easy upgrade on Lucic for that. Lucic might win a few more fights. Good on you Calgary.

The scary part about Lucic is he is actually worse defensively then offensively. The amount of pass interceptions he dishes off makes you afraid when he has the puck, especially in the defensive zone.

 

[FerklundCGY]

The main thing now is:

The Oilers effectively have a $6.5M cap hit in Neal vs the Flames having a $5.25M cap hit in Lucic.

That's a $1.25M difference, which is a crap ton. I know which contract I'd rather have on the books (and that's not including the actual money remaining on each contract).

Neal was going to be a bottom 6 forward in Calgary, but Lucic is much better suited and will bring much better value for the bottom 6 than Neal would've.

Lucic also isn't a complete anchor analytically wise like Neal. In fact, Lucic has quite strong possession and scoring chance metrics, whereas Neal's are piss-poor.

The Flames are bringing in Lucic to just not be a detriment 5v5 and drag down lines while providing a physical presence, which the stats show he's very capable and likely to do, whereas unless Neal would be adding great offense to our bottom 6 (he wouldn't have), he would've been a complete liability for us in our bottom 6 considering how much of a drag he is possession and scoring chance wise.

In Edmonton, at least he has the opportunity to be gifted top 6 minutes since the Oilers have no other options and as such, should produce better offensively and if he does score 21+ goals (and out-score Lucic by 10 goals), then that's an extra win for Calgary because it gives the scouting staff (which has been on point with 90% of their picks since Treliving took over) another shot at finding a gem.

Overall, this is a clear upgrade for Calgary to our bottom 6 while also saving $500k in cap space, saving a crap ton of real dollars and having the chance to gain a 3rd round pick.

For Edmonton, they lose an extra $500k in cap space, but gain a player who could possibly rebound and score 20+ goals in their top 6 but who will be a complete liability otherwise.

 

[qwerty]

You were impressed with his game? Really? What part? Clearly you are seeing something that 98% of hockey viewers are not seeing, including his coaches, and actually, including Lucic himself.

Well relative to what I was expecting. I mean if you think the guy is just a face puncher, but then you watch him closely and he's pulling a toe drag or going through a couple guys on a rush, that certainly was not what I had expected from him. But based on what I saw from a shift to shift basis, he looked every bit of a power forward that I would have expected. Plays a heavy game, has better hockey IQ and instincts than I anticipated, decent footwork, intimidating on the forecheck. Obviously speed was not his strong suit, but once he gets his feet moving, he got to the places where he needed to be.

 

[Aceboogie]

The main thing now is:

The Oilers effectively have a $6.5M cap hit in Neal vs the Flames having a $5.25M cap hit in Lucic.

That's a $1.25M difference, which is a crap ton. I know which contract I'd rather have on the books (and that's not including the actual money remaining on each contract).

Neal was going to be a bottom 6 forward in Calgary, but Lucic is much better suited and will bring much better value for the bottom 6 than Neal would've.

Lucic also isn't a complete anchor analytically wise like Neal. In fact, Lucic has quite strong possession and scoring chance metrics, whereas Neal's are piss-poor.

The Flames are bringing in Lucic to just not be a detriment 5v5 and drag down lines while providing a physical presence, which the stats show he's very capable and likely to do, whereas unless Neal would be adding great offense to our bottom 6 (he wouldn't have), he would've been a complete liability for us in our bottom 6 considering how much of a drag he is possession and scoring chance wise.

In Edmonton, at least he has the opportunity to be gifted top 6 minutes since the Oilers have no other options and as such, should produce better offensively and if he does score 21+ goals (and out-score Lucic by 10 goals), then that's an extra win for Calgary because it gives the scouting staff (which has been on point with 90% of their picks since Treliving took over) another shot at finding a gem.

Overall, this is a clear upgrade for Calgary to our bottom 6 while also saving $500k in cap space, saving a crap ton of real dollars and having the chance to gain a 3rd round pick.

For Edmonton, they lose an extra $500k in cap space, but gain a player who could possibly rebound and score 20+ goals in their top 6 but who will be a complete liability otherwise.

The mental gymnastics you needed to convince yourself this is a good move is worthy of a 10.0 from the judges

 

[qwerty]

Weird how he becomes a flame as suddenly you’re a fan of Lucic when all you did was trash on how terrible he was.

It's the contract that I had issues with, not the player himself and I still readily admit that the contract still bothers me even with the 750k retention. I'll certainly admit though that I was quite ignorant about his game. I thought for sure he fit the mold of a pugilist and nothing more, better after having watched him more in depth and in isolated, I was pleasantly surprised. I certainly feel he'll be a better fit on the Flames than Neal ever was. I remember hating Neal's game even in the preseason and was glad Lindholm actually worked out so well to ease the sting.

 

[qwerty]

Weird how he becomes a flame as suddenly you’re a fan of Lucic when all you did was trash on how terrible he was.

It's the contract that I had issues with, not the player himself and I still readily admit that the contract still bothers me even with the 750k retention. I'll certainly admit though that I was quite ignorant about his game. I thought for sure he fit the mold of a pugilist and nothing more, better after having watched him more in depth and in isolated, I was pleasantly surprised. I certainly feel he'll be a better fit on the Flames than Neal ever was. I remember hating Neal's game even in the preseason and was glad Lindholm actually worked out so well to ease the sting.

 

[FerklundCGY]

The mental gymnastics you needed to convince yourself this is a good move is worthy of a 10.0 from the judges

Not a good move, it's bad contract for bad contract.

But from Calgary's side, it makes a lot of sense because Lucic is a clear upgrade to the bottom 6 whereas Neal isn't effective unless he's in a top 6 role.

At least argue which of my points were false

 

[ChaoticOrange]

Funny, from a raw analytics perspective Neal has always been pretty good. He was a negative relative player last year, but still well over 50%.

Buddy even got Selke votes in 15-16

I think the change will be good for both players, but I have to give a significant edge to Edmonton. Best case scenario for them is they've just added a legitimate top six scoring winger. Best case for the Flames is they just added a bottom six bruiser that's wildly overpaid. Just from pure bounceback/rebound viewpoint this is a win for the Oilers. Add in the pump and dump angle as well as the buyout angle and it just gets better.

 

[JPeeper]

Not a good move, it's bad contract for bad contract.

But from Calgary's side, it makes a lot of sense because Lucic is a clear upgrade to the bottom 6 whereas Neal isn't effective unless he's in a top 6 role.

At least argue which of my points were false

Yup, trading a 1/10 player is only going to get you a 1/10 player back. Garbage for garbage. I've never watched a player give less of a f*** playing hockey than when I watched Neal last year. Guy got his big contract and completely stopped giving a f***. Allegedly signs with Calgary for a chance at a Cup, plays so tremendously awful that he is benched in game 5.

Love that he is off the roster, but not happy Lucic is on it either. If Lucic at least gives a f*** next year I won't be as annoyed when he doesn't put points up.

 

[hangman005]

Over 1000, Move to part 4.

Confirmed Trade: - [CGY/EDM] James Neal for Milan Lucic (12.5% retained) and a 2020 conditional 3rd round pick Part 4