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Canada's goaltending "problem" is nonsense.

Discussion in 'International Tournaments' started by XeroKaos, May 24, 2018.

  1. XeroKaos

    XeroKaos Registered User

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    Lets look at the Stanley Cup Finals.

    Marc Andre Fleury vs Braden Holtby.

    Quebec vs Saskatchewan.

    There is much talk of Canada not having quality goaltenders anymore, this always annoys me because there is a very recent history of Canadian goaltending success in the NHL, see Matt Murray. A young 24 year old quality Canadian keeper who has already won a pair of cups and will only improve IMO.

    Carter Hart was the best goalie statically of the 2018 World Junior Championships.

    What annoys me is that if Vegas had a Finnish goalie and Washington had a Finnish goalie we'd be hearing all about it left right and centre, we'd be hearing non stop about how great Finnish goaltending is to have 2 Finnish starters in the cup Finals.

    If a 24 year old Swedish goalie backstopped the Penguins to back to back cups there would be insane amounts of gushing over Swedish goalies.

    Its almost as if its popular, or in fashion to bash Canadian goaltending these days. If a best vs best tournament started tomorrow there wouldn't be a controversy over who would be goalie for Team Canada it would be a Fleury/Holtby tandem...and it would be the best tandem in the world as of this moment....and that isn't an opinion, it is a fact.

    Yes it is a fact that Marc Andre Fleury and Braden Holtby are the two best goalies in the world right now.

    Discuss.
     
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  2. Bear12Good

    Bear12Good Registered User

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    Bobrovsky/Vasilevsky play worse?
     
  3. JackSlater

    JackSlater Registered User

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    Canadian goaltending should be improved. It isn't atrociously bad or even the worst among top nations, but it should be better. There are naturally peaks and valleys and Canada has been in a valley for goaltending for a while now. Consider Canada's goaltending options in the late 90s and early 2000s compared to its options today. There are other nations that Canada could learn from, as the strategy that brought about Canada's dominant run of goaltenders (primarily from Quebec) isn't enough anymore.

    This of course has nothing to do with which teams make the finals. Canadian goaltending would be in th exact same spot if the finals featured Winnipeg vs Tampa Bay.
     
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  4. beowulf

    beowulf Not a nice guy.

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    Canada has a goaltending problem? Many of the best NHL goalies are Canadian and the same at international tournaments...
     
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  5. cg98

    cg98 Registered User

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    Everyone says this because they dont have the pedigrees or fame (yet) to guys like Broduer, Roy, Belfour, etc. It gets a little ridiculous sometimes.

    Crawford for sure wouldve won the Vezina this season if he didnt go down with injury, Holtby had a down regular season but has returned to form these playoffs, Fleury is a brick wall and is finally showing his true capabilities, he easily shouldve won the Vezina this season if Crawford wasnt winning it and if he played more games. Only Price really stumbled, but Montreal was god awful all around this season.

    Also Matt Murray is still young and inconsistent, but hes got 2 Cups in his first 3 seasons at the ripe age of 24, you can only imagine what he’ll be like in his prime when hes more seasoned and when he makes adjustments to his training and techniques.

    Canadas gonna be fine in net.
     
    Last edited: May 25, 2018
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  6. Frank Drebin

    Frank Drebin Habs

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    We had a real problem in 2013 when we were looking at Luongo, MAF, Smith and Price, until Price decided to be the best goalie in the world. Now MAF has that honor.

    Are people really saying Canada has a goaltending problem?
     
  7. razor ray

    razor ray Registered User

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    Canada does not have an any position problem. Deep everywhere.
     
  8. cg98

    cg98 Registered User

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    LD is pretty weak actually.
     
  9. Bear12Good

    Bear12Good Registered User

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    I think Bobrovsky/Vasilevsky play better then Fleury and Holtby.
     
  10. NyQuil

    NyQuil Unleashed

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    Personally, I think we could use some improvement at the goaltending position.
     
  11. SmellOfVictory

    SmellOfVictory Registered User

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    I find it strange that you're including Luongo, because Luongo has been one of the more consistently good goalies of the last 15 years. MAF and Price are way too inconsistent, Smith is basically average most years.
     
  12. Rob

    Rob Registered User

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    The WHC have had bad goaltending but that is due to the fact no number one goaltender wants to play.
     
  13. Ceremony

    Ceremony ______________ Sponsor

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    You know Holtby conceded fewer goals than both of them in direct competition in these playoffs, right?
     
  14. Frank Drebin

    Frank Drebin Habs

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    Luongo in 2014 had the failure of 2011 fresh in most peoples minds and was beginning a decline in his play. He certainly has been consistent over the course of his career, but his peak was never as high as Price's in 2014 or MAF's today.
     
  15. Gigantor The Goalie

    Gigantor The Goalie Speak for the Goalies

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    Loungo posted three straight seasons of +30 GSAA and in one of those three seasons Loungo posted a +40 GSAA. Carey Price only has one +30 GSAA season and MAF only has one +20 GSAA season. So peak goes in favour of Loungo over Price/MAF.
     
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  16. IKnowNothing

    IKnowNothing Registered User

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    We are not deep in the goaltending position , this is why our wc team had the worst goaltending in recent memory

    Our main guys like price maf luongo holtby are allguys around 30

    Besides Murray who I still not 100% convinced yet (and injury prone) who else is young and we can say this is our future?
     
  17. Frank Drebin

    Frank Drebin Habs

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    Luongo never had a season like prices 14-15 or maf's current playoffs.

    There has never been a point in time where luongo was the clear cut best goalie in the world; his lack of personal hardware backs this up.

    Plus GSAA is a essentially a factor of shots against and games played, a goalie won't have high gsaa without high games played and high shots against.
     
  18. Gigantor The Goalie

    Gigantor The Goalie Speak for the Goalies

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    We're pretty deep with Roberto Loungo, Carey Price, Braden Holtby, Devan Dubnyk, Cam Talbot, MAF, Corey Crawford, Martin Jones, and Matt Murray. The problem is none of these goalies wanted to go or couldn't go. Sucks but what can you do?

    Does any nation really have a strong U25 NHL/NHL ready/High NHL potential stable of goalies? Canada has Matt Murray, Tristan Jarry, and Carter Hart that fits this description. Plus they have Eric Comrie and Adin Hill who will be pushing for a NHL spot in the future. This isn't overly worse than the stable of goalies that Russia has in the three IS's. Better than Finland who has Saros, Husso and then...who? Sweden has Lehner as their young NHL guy, Ullmark as the NHL ready guy and a stable of prospects that matches at best in Gustavsson/Soderstrom/Sandstrom.

    I know we as Canadians like to take pot shots at our goaltending but honestly we're doing fine at the moment and not in trouble in terms of prospects.
     
  19. Siludin

    Siludin Registered User

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    I think Canada has a "problem" of its best players not giving a damn about the World Championships - a meaningless tournament to make Europeans feel better.
     
  20. cg98

    cg98 Registered User

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    The US probably has the best U25 goalie tandem in John Gibson and Connor Hellebuyck (who just turned 25), and Thatcher Demko who's pushing for the starting job in Vancouver, with Russia right after them.

    I've seen Comrie here in Winnipeg, his development hasn't really progressed nor declined its just stagnated, altho he hasn't progressed the way I thought he would.
     
  21. Gigantor The Goalie

    Gigantor The Goalie Speak for the Goalies

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    Personal hardware awarded by the GM's who are remarkably predictable by choosing the goalie that wins a lot.

    Loungo's best three seasons:
    48.42 GSAA (0.587 GSAA/30 SA)
    34.53 GSAA (0.478 GSAA/30)
    32.64 GSAA (0.394 GSAA/30)

    MAF's top 3:
    20.77 GSAA (0.453 GSAA/30)
    10.58 GSAA (0.349 GSAA/30)
    10.28 GSAA (0.168 GSAA/30)

    Price's top 3:
    36.7 GSAA (0.564 GSAA/30)
    23.51 GSAA (0.386 GSAA/30)
    22.04 GSAA (0.308 GSAA/30)

    So when each goalie hits the 30 SA interval Loungo is still ahead of both MAF and Price from top to bottom even with the overall GSAA being inflated from high GP/SA. Congrats to MAF for the historic playoff run so far. When looking at the big sample size that is a regular season the peak has to go to Loungo. Credit where credit is due.
     
  22. IKnowNothing

    IKnowNothing Registered User

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    hi

    We are talking about Canadian goaltending depth...All the guys you mentioned are 30 and over except for Jones, and Matt Murray, and the jury is still out on Murray, even though he won 2 stanley cups (its easy to win with Crosby, Malkin, letang)

    Comrie hasn't done much if anything regarding his progression (i dont know hill)

    We are in deep problem...
     
  23. Jared Dunn

    Jared Dunn Registered User

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    Did you try to tune in to those playoffs a little bit???
     
  24. cg98

    cg98 Registered User

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    Murray plays behind one the worst blue lines in the league. If its so easy to win a cup with Crosby and Malkin why didnt Fleury do it more often after 2009 when he wasnt relegated to the backup?
     
  25. XeroKaos

    XeroKaos Registered User

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    Matt Murray is an excellent goalie, one of the best young goalies in the entire NHL. I consider him Canada's response to Russia's Andrei Vasilevskiy and the US's Connor Hellebuyck. Canada has a young star in the crease, we're covered there moving forward.

    Quite frankly Murray is better than any young goalie the Swedes, Finns and Czechs currently have in the league.
     

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