Speculation: Calgary Flames... Playoff Team or Blow them up ?

[Muffin]

Uhh, they were a bubble team with Gaudreau struggling and Giordano injured at points... do you actually know the team you're talking about, cause to me it sounds like you're talking out of your ass and don't actually know about the Flames. But that's an educated guess.


"A lot of their core is again." Who? Giordano is aging. Backlund maybe. Who else? Gaudreau, Monahan, Lindholm, Tkachuk, Andersson, Valimaki, Rittich, Kylington, Dube--most of the top 6 is in their mid to low twenties and outside of two defencemen the rest are in their twenties.

Giordano played 60 out of 70 games lmao, you make it sound like he missed half the year or something, Gaudreau was still on paced for like 70 points. You remove those two and you're missing 100 points off the roster.

 

[blankall]

Another quick bit of trivia.

People do realize that the last time one of these supposedly necessary top 4 draft picks actually was a part of a Stanley Cup winning team was Drew Doughty in 2008?

This mythic plan of stocking up on a big pick and then turning around and winning a cup, simply does not happen anymore. There's a number of reasons for this. The NHL has nerfed tanking with the lottery, so getting multiple very high picks in a row is not possible. The cap structure has changed. Bridge deals don't exist anymore for high end draft picks. There's far more parity in the league.

 

[Ctrain2k]

Another quick bit of trivia.

People do realize that the last time one of these supposedly necessary top 4 draft picks actually was a part of a Stanley Cup winning team was Drew Doughty in 2008?

This mythic plan of stocking up on a big pick and then turning around and winning a cup, simply does not happen anymore. There's a number of reasons for this. The NHL has nerfed tanking with the lottery, so getting multiple very high picks in a row is not possible. The cap structure has changed. Bridge deals don't exist anymore for high end draft picks. There's far more parity in the league.

I wouldn’t say that’s true at all, every cup winner since 2012 drafted their best player in the top 4 except arguably LA with Kopitar and Doughty. The best way to build teams is still through the draft just look at every cup winner who’s dominated for the past 10 years.

Now all the up and coming teams were built this way too, look at Edmonton McDavid, Draisaitl and Nuge were drafted 1st, 1st and 3rd, Colorado drafted MacKinnon, Makar, Landeskog and Rantanen 1st, 2nd, 4th and 10th, Toronto got Matthews, Marner, Nylander and Rielly 1st, 4th, 5th and 8th.

 

[CraigsList]

I wouldn’t say that’s true at all, every cup winner since 2012 drafted their best player in the top 4 except arguably LA with Kopitar and Doughty. The best way to build teams is still through the draft just look at every cup winner who’s dominated for the past 10 years.

Now all the up and coming teams were built this way too, look at Edmonton McDavid, Draisaitl and Nuge were drafted 1st, 1st and 3rd, Colorado drafted MacKinnon, Makar, Landeskog and Rantanen 1st, 2nd, 4th and 10th, Toronto got Matthews, Marner, Nylander and Rielly 1st, 4th, 5th and 8th.

Tell me how exactly Edmonton gets granted the "up-and-coming" status when they're barely starting to turn things around? So, Calgary has to think of rebuilding, but Edmonton doesn't have to, even though Calgary has been far better off, even with lesser players?

Just want some clarification on this. Yes, they have the top 2 players in the league in terms of point production, but that hasn't made them a contender nor a team that should be considered on the rise until there's some consistency.

 

[blankall]

I wouldn’t say that’s true at all, every cup winner since 2012 drafted their best player in the top 4 except arguably LA with Kopitar and Doughty. The best way to build teams is still through the draft just look at every cup winner who’s dominated for the past 10 years.

Now all the up and coming teams were built this way too, look at Edmonton McDavid, Draisaitl and Nuge were drafted 1st, 1st and 3rd, Colorado drafted MacKinnon, Makar, Landeskog and Rantanen 1st, 2nd, 4th and 10th, Toronto got Matthews, Marner, Nylander and Rielly 1st, 4th, 5th and 8th.

Firstly, how is Edmonton or Toronto in any better of a position than Calgary. Both have their stars at full capacity, but are strangled by the cap. Colorado looks great, but they also failed by accident, and at no point blew it up. So there are no examples of teams who've purposely blown it up and actually had success in about 12 years.

Second for every up and coming team you cite, there are multiple teams, who've all drafted high, still in the basement: Florida, Buffalo, NYI, NJ, etc...

Also, the last team to win the cup, hadn't drafted in the top 4 since 2008, when they drafted Pietrangelo. They built their team largely by great asset management.

 

[CraigsList]

Firstly, how is Edmonton or Toronto in any better of a position than Calgary. Both have their stars at full capacity, but are strangled by the cap. Colorado looks great, but they also failed by accident, and at no point blew it up. So there are no examples of teams who've purposely blown it up and actually had success in about 12 years.

Second for every up and coming team you cite, there are multiple teams, who've all drafted high, still in the basement: Florida, Buffalo, NYI, NJ, etc...

Also, the last team to win the cup, hadn't drafted in the top 4 since 2008, when they drafted Pietrangelo. They built their team largely by great asset management.

.....

bLoW iT uP

 

[viper0220]

The Calgary Flames need to upgrade the roster but it is unlikely anything like that will happen, the owners got their new arena, they most likely don't care what happens next(as long as the new arena is built.)

 

[blankall]

Tell me how exactly Edmonton gets granted the "up-and-coming" status when they're barely starting to turn things around? So, Calgary has to think of rebuilding, but Edmonton doesn't have to, even though Calgary has been far better off, even with lesser players?

Just want some clarification on this. Yes, they have the top 2 players in the league in terms of point production, but that hasn't made them a contender nor a team that should be considered on the rise until there's some consistency.

Aren't you paying attention?

If Calgary blows it up. Sucks for a decade. Lucks out into getting many first overall picks in a row, even though that's not possible anymore, and then drafts the best player in the NHL... They might end up 2 points higher on the standings than they are now.... After a decade that is.

 

[Ararana]

Firstly, how is Edmonton or Toronto in any better of a position than Calgary. Both have their stars at full capacity, but are strangled by the cap. Colorado looks great, but they also failed by accident, and at no point blew it up. So there are no examples of teams who've purposely blown it up and actually had success in about 12 years.

Second for every up and coming team you cite, there are multiple teams, who've all drafted high, still in the basement: Florida, Buffalo, NYI, NJ, etc...

Also, the last team to win the cup, hadn't drafted in the top 4 since 2008, when they drafted Pietrangelo. They built their team largely by great asset management.

Just out of curiosity, how did Colorado 'fail by accident'?

 

[blankall]

Just out of curiosity, how did Colorado 'fail by accident'?

They were attempting to build a competitive team, and just did not play well.

People seem to have very short term memories, but Colorado oscillated between being downright awful to average for many years in a row. Just prior to acquiring MacKinnon with the #1 overall pick, the Avs used their first round pick to trade for Varlamov. At no point did Colorado "blow it up". They've always been trying to win. They just were not very good at winning until recently.

 

[Jerkbait]

Aren't you paying attention?

If Calgary blows it up. Sucks for a decade. Lucks out into getting many first overall picks in a row, even though that's not possible anymore, and then drafts the best player in the NHL... They might end up 2 points higher on the standings than they are now.... After a decade that is.

And always the bridesmaid!!! They could do what your saying but they will not win like that....they have some peices...very good pieces but they need to upgrade especially in goal, forwards 8 to 10 and d pairing 2 and 3 . They overvalue players who underachieve like Bennett. Brodie probably walks. They could have traded both for assets that would help.

 

[blankall]

And always the bridesmaid!!! They could do what your saying but they will not win like that....they have some peices...very good pieces but they need to upgrade especially in goal, forwards 8 to 10 and d pairing 2 and 3 . They overvalue players who underachieve like Bennett. Brodie probably walks. They could have traded both for assets that would help.

Every team has room for improvement. Seriously criticizing forwards 8-10? What team has 10 perfect forwards for positions 1-10?

The Flames are fine everywhere, but need another big offensive weapon. They need someone to drive play offensively, when other players are slumping, and take heat off Gaudreau. If the Flames have that, they don't lose 2 OT games to Colorado. They win another 5 regular season games this year, bumping them up to 3rd. The questions disappear.

Edit: Also the Flames bottom six includes Ryan, Dube, Bennett, and Lucic. That brings a lot of physical presence and Dube and Ryan can score. The problem with the Flames depth is forwards 11 and 12. They also desperately need another top 6 forwards, which would bump one of Backlund/Mangiapane into the bottom 6. If the Flames could figure that out, they'd have an excellent top 6 and a very good 7-11 forwards of Mangiapane/Backlund, Ryan, Lucic, Bennett, and Dube.

Once again it's that final legit top 6 RW/centre that is the missing piece.

 

[Jerkbait]

Every team has room for improvement. Seriously criticizing forwards 8-10? What team has 10 perfect forwards for positions 1-10?

The Flames are fine everywhere, but need another big offensive weapon. They need someone to drive play offensively, when other players are slumping, and take heat off Gaudreau. If the Flames have that, they don't lose 2 OT games to Colorado. They win another 5 regular season games this year, bumping them up to 3rd. The questions disappear.

Edit: Also the Flames bottom six includes Ryan, Dube, Bennett, and Lucic. That brings a lot of physical presence and Dube and Ryan can score. The problem with the Flames depth is forwards 11 and 12. They also desperately need another top 6 forwards, which would bump one of Backlund/Mangiapane into the bottom 6. If the Flames could figure that out, they'd have an excellent top 6 and a very good 7-11 forwards of Mangiapane/Backlund, Ryan, Lucic, Bennett, and Dube.

Once again it's that final legit top 6 RW/centre that is the missing piece.

Well by listing the forwards 8 to 10 you solidified what I was saying. They need a goalie ... some punch on the 3rd and 4th line which equals timely scoring... yes of course they need a BIG offensive threat but thay alone doesn't make them a cup team.....its just not there with this roster but it's not far off....you ask what teams are solid in the forward department ..well Tampa, Pittsburgh, Toronto, Boston, Washington...not perfect but close ...

 

[Foppberg]

They should. Outside of Tkachuk & maybe Gaudreau they really don't have a legit "it" player. Gio is one but he's getting old, better off blowing it up/retooling.