Value of: Brent Burns at the dead line.

[tictactoe]

I think people are heavily underrating the value of retention would be here. I mean, you're asking an ownership group to pay another team 16 million for your asset to play for them, artifically giving them an additional 4m in cap space in the process...and if you're a contender in this cap environment the Sharks have no obligation to do you such a favor, they would be weaponizing the bejesus out of that space and salary as they should. And that's without noting that the next year or two at least of Burns at his current contract isn't nearly as bad as it's being made (other than when you literally odn't have the space for it).

Come on people, you're making me stick up for the Sharks here

yeah you got a point there.

 

[Cogburn]

Probably Podkolzin or a '22 1st would likely be the starting point.

Pod's probably off the table, but the first is a good start if it were my call.

What sort of salary would you prefer? The straight cap dump, or players that can contribute to some degree but are overpaid? Please bare in mind we can't include all of them as single year cap dumps.

 

[Pinkfloyd]

Pod's probably off the table, but the first is a good start if it were my call.

What sort of salary would you prefer? The straight cap dump, or players that can contribute to some degree but are overpaid? Please bare in mind we can't include all of them as single year cap dumps.

If you're talking dollar for dollar, it'd probably players that can contribute to some degree but are overpaid as they are still moveable for us. I think a straight dump is likely to cost you more but depending on what you're willing to pony up to make that happen, maybe it's feasible.

 

[Cogburn]

If you're talking dollar for dollar, it'd probably players that can contribute to some degree but are overpaid as they are still moveable for us. I think a straight dump is likely to cost you more but depending on what you're willing to pony up to make that happen, maybe it's feasible.

Probably a hybrid.

Ideally, without tilting the playing field entirely in our direction, I'd be looking at Eriksson (6 million for 2 years, currently 4.925,000 in cap hit if kept on the taxi squad or the minors) and Roussel (3 million for two years, pest extraordinaire, who just hasn't seemed to be on the same page as the team this year). The cap would be 2 years, then off the books.

Other dumps are Sutter (4.375, useful bottom six guy, UFA this year), Beagle (3 million for another year after this, 4th line, slow, heavy center...actually not bad this year, relative to the team), Holtby (if this trade is done post expansion draft, 4.3 until summer 2022), Benn (2 million, UFA this summer, has been a solid bottom pairing contributor for us, would likely be redundant with Burns coming in) and Myers is a maybe (6 million for as long as Burns, but has probably been our best overall D this year, so his inclusion would drop the first from us for something else, or need another inclusion from the Sharks).

Players like Virtanen (2.55 until summer 2022) and Gaudette (950k, RFA this offseason) are also possible inclusions, but have value enough to not be cap dump, but if either of them pique your interest, we could find a way to include them, specifically for a defensive/physical bottom six player at their position.

 

[Ziggdiezan]

Hes still very good. Been far better than Karlsson. He would be a serious asset to a team that needs a boost to offense from the backend. Yeah by the end of his deal he hurts but in the next 2-3 hes positive.

That is fair, problem is your paying for the entire contract and cap is tight league wide.

 

[themelkman]

That is fair, problem is your paying for the entire contract and cap is tight league wide.

Yeah but it wont be in 5 years. Cap will get better in a few years

 

[Pinkfloyd]

Probably a hybrid.

Ideally, without tilting the playing field entirely in our direction, I'd be looking at Eriksson (6 million for 2 years, currently 4.925,000 in cap hit if kept on the taxi squad or the minors) and Roussel (3 million for two years, pest extraordinaire, who just hasn't seemed to be on the same page as the team this year). The cap would be 2 years, then off the books.

Other dumps are Sutter (4.375, useful bottom six guy, UFA this year), Beagle (3 million for another year after this, 4th line, slow, heavy center...actually not bad this year, relative to the team), Holtby (if this trade is done post expansion draft, 4.3 until summer 2022), Benn (2 million, UFA this summer, has been a solid bottom pairing contributor for us, would likely be redundant with Burns coming in) and Myers is a maybe (6 million for as long as Burns, but has probably been our best overall D this year, so his inclusion would drop the first from us for something else, or need another inclusion from the Sharks).

Players like Virtanen (2.55 until summer 2022) and Gaudette (950k, RFA this offseason) are also possible inclusions, but have value enough to not be cap dump, but if either of them pique your interest, we could find a way to include them, specifically for a defensive/physical bottom six player at their position.

I think any variation of the cap dumps would likely work. We'd probably ask to have Chatfield in there just to have an RHD until Merkley is ready. But if it's definitely the 2022 1st round pick, we'd probably look at that, Chatfield, Sutter, and Roussel. Probably add a '21 2nd to balance it out for value. The other thing about it is that this would be more or less trading within the division so there'll be some premium placed on Vancouver.

 

[Cogburn]

We

I think any variation of the cap dumps would likely work. We'd probably ask to have Chatfield in there just to have an RHD until Merkley is ready. But if it's definitely the 2022 1st round pick, we'd probably look at that, Chatfield, Sutter, and Roussel. Probably add a '21 2nd to balance it out for value. The other thing about it is that this would be more or less trading within the division so there'll be some premium placed on Vancouver.

I can't imagine being in a different division when this is all over, but that could be a few seasons still.

If I'm reading things right, our 2022 first, Sutter, Roussel and Chatfield for Burns and a second? Or is the second from us? I'd be all over the former, I think I'd hold on the latter (we've hemmoraged picks the last few years) both of which after Hamonic's recovered.

 

[North Cole]

You're probably right overall from Edmonton's side. 50% retention is absolutely a pipe dream. Like I said earlier in the thread, whoever looks to acquire Burns to win now will likely get him at 6.5 mil at the least. But honestly, I don't think Broberg is absolutely needed. I think you can swap in Holloway and the Sharks would still be interested in a package involving him. The other thing that makes this a pipe dream is Burns' three team trade list. The chances that Edmonton is on that three team list or that he'd be willing to expand his list to include Edmonton is slim I think.

But I think a trade with Edmonton for Burns looks like [email protected] for Neal, Holloway, and a protected '22 1st.

Yeah I honestly didn't realize he had such a restrictive NTC, and agree there's a 0% chance he would waive to come here haha. Hopefully the trade offers don't get too crazy, and people are looking for BB for spare parts, I like his game. This feels like a thread that could get ugly quickly for you guys.

 

[Not Canada Drai]

I'd do that.

I would be absolutely shocked if any Sharks fan disagreed.

 

[Pinkfloyd]

We


I can't imagine being in a different division when this is all over, but that could be a few seasons still.

If I'm reading things right, our 2022 first, Sutter, Roussel and Chatfield for Burns and a second? Or is the second from us? I'd be all over the former, I think I'd hold on the latter (we've hemmoraged picks the last few years) both of which after Hamonic's recovered.

It’d be a 2nd from you guys but we could probably add a 4th or 5th to make it easier but I’d understand wanting to hold off. I just don’t think the 1st can be the only asset that’s a legitimate future coming our way for Burns.

Yeah I honestly didn't realize he had such a restrictive NTC, and agree there's a 0% chance he would waive to come here haha. Hopefully the trade offers don't get too crazy, and people are looking for BB for spare parts, I like his game. This feels like a thread that could get ugly quickly for you guys.

It’s hard to be super serious about any trade offer because of the clause. That can certainly tank the return.

 

[Cogburn]

It’d be a 2nd from you guys but we could probably add a 4th or 5th to make it easier but I’d understand wanting to hold off. I just don’t think the 1st can be the only asset that’s a legitimate future coming our way for Burns.

Some of us are holding out hope that Chatfield will progress into an NHL defender.

If we're worried about more futures, what about our 2022 first, Virtanen, DiPietro, Eriksson and Chatfield? You'd get more futures, but we're downgrading the cap dump into one consolidated, terrible player. Cap hit is about the same, assuming Eriksson is sent down to the taxi squad or AHL.

You get a third line winger that still holds potential to become a top six player, a goalie that has a real shot to become a starter (if we glaze over the game we threw him to the wolves against you guys), a D prospect, and a first round pick in a better draft than this years.

 

[Dicdonya]

The Sharks aren't trading Burns at 50% retained. It's an insane premise.

It is only insane if the Sharks keep trying to win with this core.

If we start a rebuild this season, 4 mil over the next 5 years is not likely to matter, especially if the cap starts going up after the freeze.

Also if a GM offers something like this:

Burns at 18.75% retention to Edmonton (6.5M) for Neal (5.75M) 2021 1st round pick, 2022 2nd round pick & choice of Holloway or Broberg. It’s time to win baby

No chance I turn that down going into a rebuild. Neal is off the books in three years instead of 5 for Burns which helps our long term cap around the time we need to start re-signing prospects, and look to maybe start competing again.

 

[pucksakes666]

Doesn’t he have a full NMC? I doubt he wants to leave sunny cali

 

[seroes]

Doesn’t he have a full NMC? I doubt he wants to leave sunny cali

He has a 3 team trade list. But he may very well waive if the Sharks go into a rebuild.

 

[KingsFan7824]

When was the last time any star player was traded with term on their contract (more than a year or year and a half)? Last example I can think of is Carter/Richards to LA/CBJ/LA but later.

And those guys were 26/27 years old at the time of those trades.

 

[Pinkfloyd]

Some of us are holding out hope that Chatfield will progress into an NHL defender.

If we're worried about more futures, what about our 2022 first, Virtanen, DiPietro, Eriksson and Chatfield? You'd get more futures, but we're downgrading the cap dump into one consolidated, terrible player. Cap hit is about the same, assuming Eriksson is sent down to the taxi squad or AHL.

You get a third line winger that still holds potential to become a top six player, a goalie that has a real shot to become a starter (if we glaze over the game we threw him to the wolves against you guys), a D prospect, and a first round pick in a better draft than this years.

It's probably what I would expect the return to be for Burns from Vancouver.