Brad Treliving is doing a great job.

[tuckerintensity]

I love that the best we can do for credit for Treliving is drafting a defenceman that he traded for two guys that don't play for Calgary anymore because the team sucked and the new GM has to rebuild. Yes, epic work, BT. Epic work.

 

[ACC1224]

He was hired as a "Yes-Man" without an actual GM search last summer.

He will absolutely be given time to structure the Leafs. Biggest fear is he turns us into Calgary - there's a reason they wanted no part of him at the end.

Wasn't the issue he wanted to fire Sutter but Ownership wouldn't let him?
I don't see any reason why he'd take a job as a 'yes man' when he left one to avoid being one.

 

[Sypher04]

He was hired as a "Yes-Man" without an actual GM search last summer.

He will absolutely be given time to structure the Leafs. Biggest fear is he turns us into Calgary - there's a reason they wanted no part of him at the end.

Not that Tre is blameless by any means and I’m not a big fan but Calgary was destroyed mostly by key American players not wanting to commit to living outside of the US after the pandemic.

 

[Menzinger]

I agree that’s a positive but is that more so on who he hired as a head scout or the players he scouted himself? Either way he gets credit but he hasn’t picked the head scout in Toronto.

So far his actions suggest hes happy with the current Leafs scouting setup. I believe the only changes he's made so far, aside from a couple guys changing job titles is to hire Muzzin as a pro scout

 

[notDatsyuk]

I would go player by player if I was by my computer but all players listed were better than Nylander either a. their defensive impact outweighs the gap in production (Reinhart, Barkov, Tkachuk), b. they lead their team in points and would most likely have more points than Nylander on the Leafs (Kaprizov, Crosby, Forsberg, Hughes), c. they are probably equally impactful but they play C (Larkin, Aho, Point, Pettersson)

So instead of being the go-to player on the top line with better linemates, if they played second or third line with worse players they would produce more?

I think you have that backwards.

 

[ULF_55]

I would go player by player if I was by my computer but all players listed were better than Nylander either a. their defensive impact outweighs the gap in production (Reinhart, Barkov, Tkachuk), b. they lead their team in points and would most likely have more points than Nylander on the Leafs (Kaprizov, Crosby, Forsberg, Hughes), c. they are probably equally impactful but they play C (Larkin, Aho, Point, Pettersson)

And Point with Tavares instead of Kucherov?

 

[TheTotalPackage]

I'm fine with allowing Treliving to restructure the team. Is he a sexy pick for a GM? No. Is he a safe pick for a GM? Yeah. And that's just what the team needs right now.

He didn't tie up long-term money to any free agents this past summer. He will have Tavares's money to work with next summer. How he starts reshaping this team this summer, particularly on the back end and in net, will be a telltale sign of where things may go into the future.

As much as the Tkachuk trade looks bad now, between being forced to trade a player not wanting to be there, and the two players he got back, I thought he did excellent given the situation and won that trade. Huberdeau flaming out the way he has is one of the more baffling player dropoffs in recent memory.

 

[Mess]

At the end of the day, this was the worst version of the Leafs team we've seen in years, in both the regular season and playoffs. That's all I have to say about that.

I beg to differ ..

With the new additions of Tyler Bertuzzi, Max Domi, Ryan Reaves, Connor Dewar and Dmen Simon Benoit, Joel Edmundson & Ilya Lyubushkin I'm loving the physical play and intensity and punishing hits that this version of the Leafs are playing with. We're seing the early stages of Treliving's Dcore style of big, mean and mobile with 2 coming at the TD. Leafs 4th line lead by Reaves has both a purpose and built to be able to play in all situations to provide energy.

This is real Hockey as opposed to the past figure skating teams, and Leafs are going head to head playing the game in the trenches, which I have been proud of the gang,

Unfortunately, despite the new comers providing this team with a true backbone spin to have the ability to push back, they can't overcome the Leafs biggest pitfall that leads to failure is the butter soft Core 4 that consumes 1/2 the teams salary cap. The core 4 that thrive on regular season Run and Gun style hockey with scoring on the rush and playing with puck possessions to fill the net with pucks and outscoring their goaltending sub <.900 performance and weaker defensive play based on exchanges scoring chances where last goal wins.. Playoff style dump and chase is the Kryptonite of this core 4 and the reason for the teams failure overall.

BT was handed a bad hand with a team paid and built for entertainment purposes first and foremost, with the leagues highest salaries so MLSE can charge and validate the highest price of addmission. as the teams value increases.

This makes the Leafs essentially "Regular season Warriors but playoff "Paper Tigers", which is great for Leaf fans that love the excitement of player personnel performances and achievements of the regular season, but sadly those that desire to win a Championship (the true desire of following sports IMO), have to take a back seat until we see this soft core 4 broken up and Leafs rebuilt,

So I'm giving BT a pass until he can get out from under Cap Hell and the JT boat anchor contract after next season, before he will be judged on his own merits.

 

[Menzinger]

So instead of being the go-to player on the top line with better linemates, if they played second or third line with worse players they would produce more?

I think you have that backwards.

Imo biggest fallacy folks walk into is assuming players production will always translate equally, or even positively to a new team.

Individual context and Circumstances can matter a lot.

 

[myleafs]

He was hired as a "Yes-Man" without an actual GM search last summer.

He will absolutely be given time to structure the Leafs. Biggest fear is he turns us into Calgary - there's a reason they wanted no part of him at the end.

Tre was offered an extension and turned it down

 

[Nineteen67]

He was hired as a "Yes-Man" without an actual GM search last summer.

He will absolutely be given time to structure the Leafs. Biggest fear is he turns us into Calgary - there's a reason they wanted no part of him at the end.

From the moment he was hire I was very sceptical, but I believe that Shanny will be let go and the new president will hire a GM, or if it’s Dubas, he’ll do both jobs.

 

[djdev]

Treliving resume suggests he can’t build a good team and I won’t be thrilled if he’s given the chance to restructure the Leafs.

given the fact under 7% of GMs have ever won a cup, resumes and history can be a tricky thing when trying to measure success(past and future) of a an executive imo. furthermore to that his teams in calgary have made the 2nd round 1 more time than this team in the same time period with less opportunities. outside of a very select few GMs its pretty hit or miss. i think hes done a good job so far personally.

 

[HockeyVirus]

A year later my opinion of the GM is this.

It is very rare for a GM to be perfect in all aspects. Some GM's who are good at building a team from scratch might not be able to put them over the top. Some who can make the tweaks to win are no good at building an entire roster.

I think Brad is not good at building an entire team from scratch. Remains to be seen if he can be the guy who makes the right tweaks. If he manages to change the core and give us a different look I'll think he has done a good job.

So far, I think his type of player is better than Dubas type.

 

[Leafs4Life77]

A lot of people (Mirtle, Siegel, etc.) love to say that this years' team is the worst Leafs team in years. While that may be true, I think the following needs to be considered when comparing this team to recent Dubas teams:

1. The dramatic fall-off of Tavares and Brodie. Combined, this is a $16M cap hit where we are maybe getting $5M of value. This is on Dubas and not on Treliving.
2. For the first time in years, we didn't spend substantial draft capital at the deadline (whether this was intentional, or was a lack of draft capital / attractive options is unknown). In my opinion, you can't compare the playoff lineup last year with this one, while not also factoring in the draft capital that was expended.

 

[Martin Skoula]

Not that Tre is blameless by any means and I’m not a big fan but Calgary was destroyed mostly by key American players not wanting to commit to living outside of the US after the pandemic.

Signing Huberdeau to that retirement contract before he played a single game for you was an unforced mammoth of an error. Keep Weegar, keep Monahan and the 1st it cost to dump him for Kadri’s retirement deal, either flip Huberdeau retained for futures or try him out and decide what to do with him at the deadline. Weegar + 1st + 1st for selling Monahan + whatever Huberdeau returns is a good outcome to the Tkachuk situation, could have picked up Hertl this deadline to replace him and still had 2 1sts leftover.

His day 1 return on the Tkachuk/Gaudreau situation wasn’t bad, it’s what he voluntarily did with that return that’s the problem.

 

[Tak7]

From the moment he was hire I was very sceptical, but I believe that Shanny will be let go and the new president will hire a GM, or if it’s Dubas, he’ll do both jobs.

If they didn't have the appetite for the president + GM scenario last summer, I doubt they'd be open to it this summer.

With all due respect to the Penguins / other teams that employ this sort of setup, the Leafs have so much more going on that requires much more attention; giving all those keys to one person, seems ill-advised. Much better to have a dedicated prezzy and then let the GM focus exclusively on building the hockey team.

 

[Americanadian]

And Point with Tavares instead of Kucherov?

I assume Point would put up less points with Tavares than Kucherov but let's look deeper:

Evolving Hockey Goals Above Replacement (GAR):
Point: 14.2 GAR
Nylander: 9.8 GAR

EH xGAR:
Point: 23.6
Nylander: 11.1

The Athletic Net Rating:
Point: +13
Nylander +14

My initial prognosis was "similar impact but the edge goes to Point because he plays C". The advanced numbers lean in Point's favor.

 

[Dreakmur]

I beg to differ ..

With the new additions of Tyler Bertuzzi, Max Domi, Ryan Reaves, Connor Dewar and Dmen Simon Benoit, Joel Edmundson & Ilya Lyubushkin I'm loving the physical play and intensity and punishing hits that this version of the Leafs are playing with. We're seing the early stages of Treliving's Dcore style of big, mean and mobile with 2 coming at the TD. Leafs 4th line lead by Reaves has both a purpose and built to be able to play in all situations to provide energy.

This is real Hockey as opposed to the past figure skating teams, and Leafs are going head to head playing the game in the trenches, which I have been proud of the gang,

Unfortunately, despite the new comers providing this team with a true backbone spin to have the ability to push back, then can't overcome the Leafs biggest pitfall that leads to failure is the butter soft Core 4 that consumes 1/2 the teams salary cap. The core 4 that thrive on regular season Run and Gun style hockey with scoring on the rush and playing with puck possessions to fill the net with pucks and outscoring their goaltending sub <.900 performance and weaker defensive play based on exchanges scoring chances where last goal wins.. Playoff style dump and chase is the Kryptonite of this core 4 and the reason for the teams failure overall.

BT was handed a bad hand with a team paid and built for entertainment purposes first and foremost, with the leagues highest salaries so MLSE can charge and validate the highest price of addmission. as the teams value increases.

This makes the Leafs essential "Regular season Warriors but playoff "Paper Tigers", which is great for Leaf fans that love the excitment of player personnal performances and achievements of the regular season, but sadly those that desire to win a Championship (the true desire of following sports IMO), have to take a back seat until we see this soft core 4 broken up and Leafs rebuilt,

So I'm giving BT a pass until he can get out from under Cap Hell and the JT boat anchor contract after next season, before he will be judged on his own merits.

I think Tre did a decent job adding the kinds of players we lacked. The problem remains that we spend far too much money on players who lack too many winning ingredients.

With this salary structure, if the top guys are all soft, the team is going to be soft, regardless of what you do with the depth.

 

[Nineteen67]

If they didn't have the appetite for the president + GM scenario last summer, I doubt they'd be open to it this summer.

With all due respect to the Penguins / other teams that employ this sort of setup, the Leafs have so much more going on that requires much more attention; giving all those keys to one person, seems ill-advised. Much better to have a dedicated prezzy and then let the GM focus exclusively on building the hockey team.

I agree. If Keefe is the only one that’s fired they’ll. Ore than likely be in the same position next year.

 

[ULF_55]

I assume Point would put up less points with Tavares than Kucherov but let's look deeper:

Evolving Hockey Goals Above Replacement (GAR):
Point: 14.2 GAR
Nylander: 9.8 GAR

EH xGAR:
Point: 23.6
Nylander: 11.1

The Athletic Net Rating:
Point: +13
Nylander +14

My initial prognosis was "similar impact but the edge goes to Point because he plays C". The advanced numbers lean in Point's favor.

Linemates matter.

 

[Americanadian]

Linemates matter.

I don't disagree. Nylander's two most common linemates had their worst seasons of their careers playing with him. Point's 2 most common linemates had career years. I don't know if we give credit to Point or Nylander there.

 

[All Mod Cons]

Absolutely not Brad's fault this year. All of his stars are injured. Matthews, Marner, Nylander, Tavares (he's just shit) all badly injured. Brad's basically playing with a $45 mil roster. He 100% escapes any blame this year. And maybe more in the future.

 

[Dekes For Days]

A lot of people (Mirtle, Siegel, etc.) love to say that this years' team is the worst Leafs team in years. While that may be true, I think the following needs to be considered when comparing this team to recent Dubas teams:

1. The dramatic fall-off of Tavares and Brodie. Combined, this is a $16M cap hit where we are maybe getting $5M of value. This is on Dubas and not on Treliving.
2. For the first time in years, we didn't spend substantial draft capital at the deadline (whether this was intentional, or was a lack of draft capital / attractive options is unknown). In my opinion, you can't compare the playoff lineup last year with this one, while not also factoring in the draft capital that was expended.

1. Neither were as dramatic as some made them out to be, and you're getting way more than 5m in value. To be clear, the core 4 just had their most productive year.

Core 4 scoring, adjusted to 82 game seasons:
2023-2024: 164 goals, 355 points
2022-2023: 146 goals, 351 points
2021-2022: 156 goals, 359 points
2020-2021: 142 goals, 329 points

And that's not counting Tavares bringing more defensive impact than usual this year.
Brodie saw a decline, but that wouldn't have been as big of an issue if Treliving did his job last offseason and added any defensive support throughout the roster instead of purging it. And where are we factoring in the piles of cheap internal depth that was left for Treliving? That alone more than made up for any net deficit impact from Tavares and Brodie. Cap space wasn't the issue. What we did with our abundance of cap space was the issue.

2. Except our pre-deadline team was already worse than past pre-deadline teams, which is precisely why it was harder to justify spending like we have when we were better, but we still spent 6 picks and a prospect to add 3 players to the playoff roster and all we did was continue to get worse.

 

[ULF_55]

I don't disagree. Nylander's two most common linemates had their worst seasons of their careers playing with him. Point's 2 most common linemates had career years. I don't know if we give credit to Point or Nylander there.

So now Tavares is Kucherov?

Come on man, Tavares gets called a 3rd. line center here all the time.

While that is extreme, he has never, in his career, been a Kucherov.

 

[Americanadian]

So now Tavares is Kucherov?

Come on man, Tavares gets called a 3rd. line center here all the time.

While that is extreme, he has never, in his career, been a Kucherov.

I never once said that. I did say I don't think Point puts up the same point totals with Tavares.