Confirmed with Link: Blues acquire Jared Coreau from ANA

[Majorityof1]

As long as this is to shore up minor league goaltending, and not an attempt to avoid giving Binny/Husso games, I am fine with it. We literally got him for free.

Still in the grand scheme of things, its been a weird season for our goalies. Our presumed goalie of the future Husso plays horrifically. Our scrap heap prospect (based on how the org. has used him), Binnington, steals the job. We waive our NHL back-up for no immedeatly apparent reason, only to never play the prospects we call up. We then have to shuffle prospects between AHL and NHL to get them games rather than just ride the bench in the NHL. Finally we trade for a guy worse than the dude we waived. I am sure their are reasons for every move internally that we don't know but can guess at. I am not criticizing Armstrong. Just saying that is a weird series of moves when viewed externally as a whole.

 

[bleedblue1223]

As long as this is to shore up minor league goaltending, and not an attempt to avoid giving Binny/Husso games, I am fine with it. We literally got him for free.

Still in the grand scheme of things, its been a weird season for our goalies. Our presumed goalie of the future Husso plays horrifically. Our scrap heap prospect (based on how the org. has used him), Binnington, steals the job. We waive our NHL back-up for no immedeatly apparent reason, only to never play the prospects we call up. We then have to shuffle prospects between AHL and NHL to get them games rather than just ride the bench in the NHL. Finally we trade for a guy worse than the dude we waived. I am sure their are reasons for every move internally that we don't know but can guess at. I am not criticizing Armstrong. Just saying that is a weird series of moves when viewed externally as a whole.

Saving Stillman cash. If we are going to suck, might as well spend less money to do so.

 

[Majorityof1]

Saving Stillman cash. If we are going to suck, might as well spend less money to do so.

We aren't really saving much cash though. We had Binnington in the AHL making $100k and Johnson making $1.75M, so $1.85M total. Now we have Binny (assumedly) making $650k and Coreau with a hefty $400k AHL salary for $1.05M. We are spending $800k less in cap, but only for half the year, so saving $400k. I mean that's a ton for you and I, but a small fraction of the budget of an NHL team. That is only recouping 40% of the cost of the Jerebek mistake.

 

[bleedblue1223]

We aren't really saving much cash though. We had Binnington in the AHL making $100k and Johnson making $1.75M, so $1.85M total. Now we have Binny (assumedly) making $650k and Coreau with a hefty $400k AHL salary for $1.05M. We are spending $800k less in cap, but only for half the year, so saving $400k. I mean that's a ton for you and I, but a small fraction of the budget of an NHL team. That is only recouping 40% of the cost of the Jerebek mistake.

Blues are still a team that will be close to breaking even and losing money, so 400k here and 400k there adds up. After deadline moves, Stillman will spend a few less million this season than they were projecting.

 

[MortiestOfMortys]

Is everybody missing the part where “future considerations” ended up being Jared Thomas?

Signed to the Rampage, has been playing in Tulsa, will likely remain in Tulsa because of San Diego’s ECHL arrangement

 

[Majorityof1]

Blues are still a team that will be close to breaking even and losing money, so 400k here and 400k there adds up. After deadline moves, Stillman will spend a few less million this season than they were projecting.

Yeah, not arguing that. Like I said, the moves probably all have their reasons, but just kind of a weird series of events when taking as a whole. If we are trying to save money at the possible expense of team performance, why not ship Gunnar and/or Maroon (maybe they will)? Moving Maroon at 50% retention saves more money and has less effect on the team.

 

[bleedblue1223]

Yeah, not arguing that. Like I said, the moves probably all have their reasons, but just kind of a weird series of events when taking as a whole. If we are trying to save money at the possible expense of team performance, why not ship Gunnar and/or Maroon (maybe they will)? Moving Maroon at 50% retention saves more money and has less effect on the team.

Disagree, at least Army would. Chad Johnson was garbage with us. Gunnar is still positive when he's healthy, and Army/Berube still believe in Maroon. Johnson served no benefit to the team.

 

[Majorityof1]

Is everybody missing the part where “future considerations” ended up being Jared Thomas?

Signed to the Rampage, has been playing in Tulsa, will likely remain in Tulsa because of San Diego’s ECHL arrangement

Not really missing it. Just don't really care about it. Its an AHL contract of a guy not even playing in the AHL. We basically got Coreau for free. Unless you mean I should add half of his $50k contract or whatever he makes to our financial savings from the move. So we saved $25k on top of the $400k.

 

[bleedblue1223]

Not really missing it. Just don't really care about it. Its an AHL contract of a guy not even playing in the AHL. We basically got Coreau for free. Unless you mean I should add half of his $50k contract or whatever he makes to our financial savings from the move. So we saved $25k on top of the $400k.

Right, this is just a completely meaningless trade in the grand scheme of things and almost everyone just doesn't care. Sure, it adds balance to the AHL roster, but does anyone care about that? I doubt it.

 

[Majorityof1]

Disagree, at least Army would. Chad Johnson was garbage with us. Gunnar is still positive when he's healthy, and Army/Berube still believe in Maroon. Johnson served no benefit to the team.

Johnson had roughly the same stats as Allen when he was waived. Most of his games were when we were playing the worst as a team. How can Allen get excused based on team's poor performance but not Johnson? I don't even think Johnson is good, and was not a fan of his signing at all. But he is a NHL goaltender and Binnington is Schroedinger's cat. How can we say we lost nothing when we have not seen how good his replacement is (or even who his replacement is)? So far Binnie has a NHL .840 save percentage vs Chad's .884 with us. That is considerably worse (a goal every 25 shots). Do you really think replacing Maroon with Sanford would cost a goal a game? Again, we don't know how good or bad Binnington will be when he gets a real start and a real chance, but he has the chance to be significantly worse than Johnson.

 

[bleedblue1223]

Johnson had roughly the same stats as Allen when he was waived. Most of his games were when we were playing the worst as a team. How can Allen get excused based on team's poor performance but not Johnson? I don't even think Johnson is good, and was not a fan of his signing at all. But he is a NHL goaltender and Binnington is Schroedinger's cat. How can we say we lost nothing when we have not seen how good his replacement is (or even who his replacement is)? So far Binnie has a NHL .840 save percentage vs Chad's .884 with us. That is considerably worse (a goal every 25 shots). Do you really think replacing Maroon with Sanford would cost a goal a game? Again, we don't know how good or bad Binnington will be when he gets a real start and a real chance, but he has the chance to be significantly worse than Johnson.

Contract situations matter, no one would claim Allen, and we wanted whoever we waived to be claimed. Our plan was to simply ride Allen, so far that has been better, and even then it doesn't matter, this season isn't recoverable and Army knows it, but he isn't going tank mode.

 

[Majorityof1]

Contract situations matter, no one would claim Allen, and we wanted whoever we waived to be claimed. Our plan was to simply ride Allen, so far that has been better, and even then it doesn't matter, this season isn't recoverable and Army knows it, but he isn't going tank mode.

I guess I just don't get the half-measures to save a fraction of a percent of our budget. Either tank and save a substantial amount of money while seeing what you have in young players, or go for it while keeping all options on the table. Removing the option of a NHL caliber backup goalie to save 0.1% of our budget while paying millions to multiple guys we know shouldn't be here next year seems odd. Whatever, I am not a GM.

 

[Celtic Note]

Johnson had roughly the same stats as Allen when he was waived. Most of his games were when we were playing the worst as a team. How can Allen get excused based on team's poor performance but not Johnson? I don't even think Johnson is good, and was not a fan of his signing at all. But he is a NHL goaltender and Binnington is Schroedinger's cat. How can we say we lost nothing when we have not seen how good his replacement is (or even who his replacement is)? So far Binnie has a NHL .840 save percentage vs Chad's .884 with us. That is considerably worse (a goal every 25 shots). Do you really think replacing Maroon with Sanford would cost a goal a game? Again, we don't know how good or bad Binnington will be when he gets a real start and a real chance, but he has the chance to be significantly worse than Johnson.

Is it really fair to even consider Binnington’s NHL stats this season when the sample size is less than two full games and he played in blowout games where the starter was pulled for playing behind a terrible team effort?

 

[Brian39]

Basicly this. Our GM is trying to keep good relations with other GMs. Chad Ochocinco Johnson looked good in his two games i thought.
The future considerations might just be some Missouri BBQ put into a cooler & mailed to our GM.

Well now I feel like we overpaid.

 

[Majorityof1]

Is it really fair to even consider Binnington’s NHL stats this season when the sample size is less than two full games and he played in blowout games where the starter was pulled for playing behind a terrible team effort?

No. Not at all. But he has no other stats to compare. Which gets to my overarching argument on this that we need to play him, and others, so we know what we have before we make decisions on waiving our backup. As I said, Binnington is Schroedinger's cat. He is both the worst NHL goalie ever and the best with all possibilities in between. We won't know what we have until we open the box. But its a real chance to be significantly worse than Johnson.

 

[Brian39]

Is it really fair to even consider Binnington’s NHL stats this season when the sample size is less than two full games and he played in blowout games where the starter was pulled for playing behind a terrible team effort?

It is not. A 68 minute sample size split between 2 relief appearances is absolutely meaningless statistically. The coaching staff and front office can certainly use that film in their evaluation of Binny's ability, but a 25 shot sample size is worthless from a statistical standpoint.

 

[Brian39]

No. Not at all. But he has no other stats to compare. Which gets to my overarching argument on this that we need to play him, and others, so we know what we have before we make decisions on waiving our backup. As I said, Binnington is Schroedinger's cat. He is both the worst NHL goalie ever and the best with all possibilities in between. We won't know what we have until we open the box. But its a real chance to be significantly worse than Johnson.

How long did you want to carry 3 goalies on the NHL roster?

 

[Majorityof1]

How long did you want to carry 3 goalies on the NHL roster?

For a couple games at a time. We have run lean with less than a full 23 man roster multiple times during the season. Instead of calling up a guy who isn't going to skate, call a goalie, get him a game or two and send him back down. As I said in another thread, this is something that goes back years, not just this season.

 

[542365]

Is everybody missing the part where “future considerations” ended up being Jared Thomas?

Signed to the Rampage, has been playing in Tulsa, will likely remain in Tulsa because of San Diego’s ECHL arrangement

Both teams are listing it as separate transactions. The Blues got Coreau for future considerations and assigned him to San Antonio, and the San Diego Gulls got Jared Thomas for future considerations. I don't really get it. Something to do with the fact that Thomas is on an AHL contract?

 

[Stupendous Yappi]

Blues are still a team that will be close to breaking even and losing money, so 400k here and 400k there adds up. After deadline moves, Stillman will spend a few less million this season than they were projecting.

I have to think that the news of the all-star game next year was welcome in the front office. That has to be a huge revenue event. I'm not sure how that worked with the outdoor game, since the stadium was used, but there is nothing like that with the all-star festivities at Enterprise Center.

 

[Brian39]

For a couple games at a time. We have run lean with less than a full 23 man roster multiple times during the season. Instead of calling up a guy who isn't going to skate, call a goalie, get him a game or two and send him back down. As I said in another thread, this is something that goes back years, not just this season.

Allen had a .924 SV% in the month leading up to us waiving Johnson and mid-November into mid-December was a stretch where this organization was very much wanting to win games. No organization in the league with our pre-season expectations is throwing in the towel on the season in November and starting a prospect over their starter who is on a stretch of very good play. So those starts would have needed to come at the expense of Johnson.

Johnson played very well up until 11/9/18 (.941 SV%) and actually began to take starts from Allen about a month before he was waived. However, he started playing terribly a month before he was waived, posting an .832 over his last 4 starts here. You're not bringing up a 3rd goalie based on 2 bad starts by your backup. I would strongly have disagreed with the team starting to carry 3 goalies after Chad had one or 2 bad starts.

Carrying 3 goalies sucks. Every goalie hates it. There are 2 nets at an NHL practice and adding a 3rd goalie takes reps away. Doing that because a guy has a bad couple nights makes it that much harder for the goalie to bounce back. Teams consistently try to avoid carrying 3 healthy goalies because it essentially never helps the situation. It either brings down all 3 or it doesn't impact your starter because the other 2 goalies split one net and each only get 50% of the reps they should get. More than any other position, goaltending is about repetition, timing, rhythm and getting into a groove. I think the absolute best way to damage a goalie prospect is asking him to start his first NHL game without a few full NHL practices under his belt to find his timing on NHL caliber shots. Having him split a net with the goalie whose job he might be taking is a great way to set him up to fail. The Islanders, Canes and Flyers all experimented with a sustained 3 goalie roster and watched it fail miserably. There is a very, very good reason that teams try to avoid carrying 3 healthy goalies.

Given the schedule we had after waiving Johnson, I think jettisoning Johnson and letting Binny take 3 weeks of full NHL practice reps was a much, much better option than screwing around with 3 goalies. Binny is much better set up to start handling NHL starts now that the schedule heats up. There are no excuses if he fails over the next few weeks and if he does then we should be able to cheaply acquire a journeyman backup if we're somehow back in the hunt by the end of January.

 

[Stupendous Yappi]

I still think there is a chance that the Blues make a mid-season goalie move, in terms of acquiring a player to be the starter going forward (beyond this season). It could be a trade, then re-sign, situation ala Bobrovsky. Either way, it would likely result in spending more money on the goalie position next year than we have in a while (including paying assets, withholding to trade or buying out Allen).

 

[Brian39]

I still think there is a chance that the Blues make a mid-season goalie move, in terms of acquiring a player to be the starter going forward (beyond this season). It could be a trade, then re-sign, situation ala Bobrovsky. Either way, it would likely result in spending more money on the goalie position next year than we have in a while (including paying assets, withholding to trade or buying out Allen).

I could see us making a move to address the goalie position beyond this season, but I don't thin it will be Bob. I can't imagine that he would be interested in negotiating with us now instead of testing the UFA market this summer. I just don't see what this organization can offer him that Columbus can't other than a huge UFA overpay that we could also offer in July. I also think that Columbus is content to make one last run with him and Panarin and then let them walk. Korpisalo has been brutal for them this year (.884 SV% while Bob is at .910), so trading Bob essentially tanks their season unless they think Allen is the answer. Unless they fall out of a playoff spot by a decent margin by the deadline, I see them being buyers and trying to win before a mini-rebuild.

 

[ort]

Has signing a goaltender to a big contract ever worked out for anyone?

 

[WeWantTacos]

If there's one thing Armstrong knows how to do it's acquire AHL caliber goalies.