Best player in franchise history-New Jersey Devils

[toothlessgoon]

Previous poll winners

Toronto Maple Leafs: Auston Matthews (30.5%)
Montreal Canadiens: Jean Beliveau (43.8)
New York Rangers: Brian Leetch (48.5%)
Chicago Blackhawks: Bobby Hull (57.0%)
Detroit Red Wings: Gordie Howe (81.4%)
Boston Bruins: Bobby Orr (88.4%)
St. Louis Blues: Brett Hull (80.5%)
Philadelphia Flyers: Bobby Clarke (61.6%)
Pittsburgh Penguins: Mario Lemieux (90.7%)
Los Angeles Kings: Wayne Gretzky (68.1%)
Dallas Stars: Mike Modano (87.9%)
Buffalo Sabres: Dominik Hasek (88.8%)
Vancouver Canucks: Pavel Bure (63.4%)
New York Islanders: Mike Bossy (53.2%)
Calgary Flames: Jarome Iginla (80.2%)
Washington Capitals: Alex Ovechkin (82.7%)

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[jetsforever]

St Louis Blues legend Martin Brodeur

 

[Albatros]

Eliáš, leads very comfortably in goals, assists, and points while being solid also defensively. One of the most versatile and underrated players in league history. Brodeur is the only challenger and rightly so, but of him people tend to remember only the highest highs while he also had some pretty weak years through his prime.

 

[bobholly39]

Eliáš, leads very comfortably in goals, assists, and points while being solid also defensively. One of the most versatile and underrated players in league history. Brodeur is the only challenger and rightly so, but of him people tend to remember only the highest highs while he also had some pretty weak years through his prime.

Brodeur is like a top 30 player of all time or so. Elias isnt even top 100, nor close.

Brodeur is very easily better than Elias.

 

[Albatros]

Brodeur is like a top 30 player of all time or so. Elias isnt even top 100, nor close.

Brodeur is very easily better than Elias.

Top 30 goalie maybe, Brodeur has his merits for sure but he also benefited of playing behind a tight system enormously. Even so never led the league in save percentage and only once in goals against average. Had six seasons of goals saved below average. In that sense similar to Curtis Joseph who also had the highest highs and lowest lows.

 

[jigglysquishy]

Top 30 goalie maybe, Brodeur has his merits for sure but he also benefited of playing behind a tight system enormously. Even so never led the league in save percentage and only once in goals against average. Had six seasons of goals saved below average. In that sense similar to Curtis Joseph who also had the highest highs and lowest lows.

He was voted in at fifth for goalies all time in the recent HoH list.

I believe only one poster had him outside their top 10.

I don't see a valid argument for him outside top 15, and personally have him ahead of Glen Hall for fourth.

 

[KirkAlbuquerque]

you could argue Stevens or Nieds were better but Brodeur played (pretty much) his whole career there and got himself a statue

 

[tarheelhockey]

Top 30 goalie maybe, Brodeur has his merits for sure but he also benefited of playing behind a tight system enormously. Even so never led the league in save percentage and only once in goals against average. Had six seasons of goals saved below average. In that sense similar to Curtis Joseph who also had the highest highs and lowest lows.

From age 23 to 37 (that's 14 seasons) Brodeur was a Vezina finalist 9 times, winning 4 times. The times he wasn't a finalist, he finished 4th twice and 5th twice. That timeframe coincides with elite seasons from Hasek, Roy, and Belfour among others.

It's true that there was a run of about 4 seasons in his late 20s where he was "only" regarded as a top-5 goalie. That describes Curtis Joseph's entire career outside of maybe 3-4 years.

I can't even wrap my head around the 'lowest lows' comment. What was Brodeur's lowest low? 01-02? That would be a career year for all but the best goalies.

 

[HugeInTheShire]

Top 30 goalie maybe, Brodeur has his merits for sure but he also benefited of playing behind a tight system enormously. Even so never led the league in save percentage and only once in goals against average. Had six seasons of goals saved below average. In that sense similar to Curtis Joseph who also had the highest highs and lowest lows.

It's almost like people don't understand he won almost 300 games and the Vezina twice WITHOUT Stevens, Niedermayer and Daneyko.

More wins than Parent, Hrudey, Beaupre, Potvin, Dryden, Ranford and Cheevers after the big 3 left NJ

Yet everyone says he's a product of those 3 being so good.

 

[WhiskeyYerTheDevils]

Elias for me, but I know I'm in the minority.

One of the most underrated careers I've ever seen.

 

[Hockeyholic]

Brodeur did have some questionable performances (97-99 PO & 01 SCF comes to mind). But he usually had more elite performances than subpar performances.

He's the only correct answer here.

 

[edguy]

Brodeur is my favorite goalie all time and I don't even like the Devils, but he did revolutionize the position. He gets my vote.

 

[Albatros]

From age 23 to 37 (that's 14 seasons) Brodeur was a Vezina finalist 9 times, winning 4 times. The times he wasn't a finalist, he finished 4th twice and 5th twice. That timeframe coincides with elite seasons from Hasek, Roy, and Belfour among others.

It's true that there was a run of about 4 seasons in his late 20s where he was "only" regarded as a top-5 goalie. That describes Curtis Joseph's entire career outside of maybe 3-4 years.

I can't even wrap my head around the 'lowest lows' comment. What was Brodeur's lowest low? 01-02? That would be a career year for all but the best goalies.

Brodeur also got probably more undeserved Vezina votes than anyone else, twice he was in top 5 of the vote while saving goals below average and both times with a .906 save percentage. But he got that "best goalie in the world" narrative going like Carey Price after him and then it no longer mattered how well he actually played. Cujo never had that luxury despite having before delivered those strong performances as well.

 

[elmaco]

Kovalchuk

 

[895]

Brodeur is a fat philandering fraud but he's at worst the 6th best goalie of all time.

 

[tarheelhockey]

Brodeur also got probably more undeserved Vezina votes than anyone else, twice he was in top 5 of the vote while saving goals below average and both times with a .906 save percentage. But he got that "best goalie in the world" narrative going like Carey Price after him and then it no longer mattered how well he actually played. Cujo never had that luxury despite having before delivered those strong performances as well.

I'm actually willing to buy that Brodeur poached reputation votes, but you cannot convince me that a Vezina record of 2, 3, 3, 4, 5, 8, 10 and a record of 1, 1, 1, 1, 2, 2, 2, 3, 3, 4, 4, 5, 5, 7, 8 are separated by reputation.

Let's say we assume that Brodeur's .906 seasons were actually so bad that he didn't deserve any votes at all. AND let's say that all of his results were inflated and we should knock him down a notch for every single one of them. AND let's say that Joseph actually deserved to be bumped up a notch every single year.

That obscenely unfair approach would give Brodeur a 2, 2, 2, 2, 3, 3, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8 and Joseph a 1, 2, 2, 3, 4, 7, 9. Brodeur would still be regarded as the far superior goalie even after we have actively tried to sabotage him and actively pumped up Joseph. The difference between these players is THAT big.

It should also be pointed out that the "best goalie in the world" narrative actually went to Hasek from 1994-2001. Hasek had the greatest peak in goaltending history during that period, so competing with him for recognition was similar to competing with Gretzky as a center the 1980s. During this timeframe, Brodeur finished a clear-cut second for the Vezina twice. So whatever we might say about reputation votes favoring him later in his career, the timing of his early career was historically unfavorable and may very well have directly cost him 2 Vezinas right off the top.

 

[AvroArrow]

Eliáš, leads very comfortably in goals, assists, and points while being solid also defensively. One of the most versatile and underrated players in league history. Brodeur is the only challenger and rightly so, but of him people tend to remember only the highest highs while he also had some pretty weak years through his prime.

Elias had longevity he was never even close to the player Brodeur was. This is an ainec poll, I don't think Elias is top 3 NJ player.

 

[Jersey Fresh]

Elias had longevity he was never even close to the player Brodeur was. This is an ainec poll, I don't think Elias is top 3 NJ player.

He's above Niedermayer for sure.

The Brodeur revisionism is absurd, but the source isn't super surprising. Brodeur owns the goaltender record book, and for several of those, likely will never be remotely challenged. Add to that the guy's style revolutionized the position - he was so good at handling the puck the league tried to legislate his advantage out of the game.

 

[Voight]

I'm actually willing to buy that Brodeur poached reputation votes, but you cannot convince me that a Vezina record of 2, 3, 3, 4, 5, 8, 10 and a record of 1, 1, 1, 1, 2, 2, 2, 3, 3, 4, 4, 5, 5, 7, 8 are separated by reputation.

Let's say we assume that Brodeur's .906 seasons were actually so bad that he didn't deserve any votes at all. AND let's say that all of his results were inflated and we should knock him down a notch for every single one of them. AND let's say that Joseph actually deserved to be bumped up a notch every single year.

That obscenely unfair approach would give Brodeur a 2, 2, 2, 2, 3, 3, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8 and Joseph a 1, 2, 2, 3, 4, 7, 9. Brodeur would still be regarded as the far superior goalie even after we have actively tried to sabotage him and actively pumped up Joseph. The difference between these players is THAT big.

It should also be pointed out that the "best goalie in the world" narrative actually went to Hasek from 1994-2001. Hasek had the greatest peak in goaltending history during that period, so competing with him for recognition was similar to competing with Gretzky as a center the 1980s. During this timeframe, Brodeur finished a clear-cut second for the Vezina twice. So whatever we might say about reputation votes favoring him later in his career, the timing of his early career was historically unfavorable and may very well have directly cost him 2 Vezinas right off the top.

He also finished 4th behind Jim Carey, Chris Osgood and Darren Puppa one year

Cant be that great

 

[tabness]

Ken Daneyko should be an option

 

[Albatros]

I'm actually willing to buy that Brodeur poached reputation votes, but you cannot convince me that a Vezina record of 2, 3, 3, 4, 5, 8, 10 and a record of 1, 1, 1, 1, 2, 2, 2, 3, 3, 4, 4, 5, 5, 7, 8 are separated by reputation.

Let's say we assume that Brodeur's .906 seasons were actually so bad that he didn't deserve any votes at all. AND let's say that all of his results were inflated and we should knock him down a notch for every single one of them. AND let's say that Joseph actually deserved to be bumped up a notch every single year.

That obscenely unfair approach would give Brodeur a 2, 2, 2, 2, 3, 3, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8 and Joseph a 1, 2, 2, 3, 4, 7, 9. Brodeur would still be regarded as the far superior goalie even after we have actively tried to sabotage him and actively pumped up Joseph. The difference between these players is THAT big.

It should also be pointed out that the "best goalie in the world" narrative actually went to Hasek from 1994-2001. Hasek had the greatest peak in goaltending history during that period, so competing with him for recognition was similar to competing with Gretzky as a center the 1980s. During this timeframe, Brodeur finished a clear-cut second for the Vezina twice. So whatever we might say about reputation votes favoring him later in his career, the timing of his early career was historically unfavorable and may very well have directly cost him 2 Vezinas right off the top.

Hašek was simply the far superior goalie, but many voters were actively looking for a way to give Brodeur the Vezina which then occurred in 2003:

(goalies with min. 50 gp)

Marty Turco .932
Dwayne Roloson .927
Roman Čechmánek .925
Ed Belfour .922
Jean-Sébastien Giguère .920
Patrick Roy .920
Olaf Kölzig .919
Roberto Luongo .918
Tomáš Vokoun .918
Mike Dunham .916
Jocelyn Thibault .915
Martin Brodeur .914

And the Vezina Trophy goes to... Martin Brodeur!

Later on Brodeur did deserve a couple of Vezinas, but as said there's still a lot of air in his legacy.

 

[HBK27]

Hašek was simply the far superior goalie, but many voters were actively looking for a way to give Brodeur the Vezina which then occurred in 2003:

(goalies with min. 50 gp)

Marty Turco .932
Dwayne Roloson .927
Roman Čechmánek .925
Ed Belfour .922
Jean-Sébastien Giguère .920
Patrick Roy .920
Olaf Kölzig .919
Roberto Luongo .918
Tomáš Vokoun .918
Mike Dunham .916
Jocelyn Thibault .915
Martin Brodeur .914

And the Vezina Trophy goes to... Martin Brodeur!

Later on Brodeur did deserve a couple of Vezinas, but as said there's still a lot of air in his legacy.

Stop trying to derail this thread into a referendum on Brodeur's career. WE GET IT - you don't like him.

It's just a poll on the best player in franchise history and rightfully the guy with his own friggin' statue outside the arena is running away with it.

 

[Albatros]

I have nothing against Brodeur, for some reason some long-time Devils players like him and Niedermayer are exceptionally overrated while at the same time others like Elias are very underrated.

 

[HBK27]

Two first ballot HOF's - "exceptionally overrated".

LOL...

 

[Zenos]

Hašek was simply the far superior goalie, but many voters were actively looking for a way to give Brodeur the Vezina which then occurred in 2003:

(goalies with min. 50 gp)

Marty Turco .932
Dwayne Roloson .927
Roman Čechmánek .925
Ed Belfour .922
Jean-Sébastien Giguère .920
Patrick Roy .920
Olaf Kölzig .919
Roberto Luongo .918
Tomáš Vokoun .918
Mike Dunham .916
Jocelyn Thibault .915
Martin Brodeur .914

And the Vezina Trophy goes to... Martin Brodeur!

Later on Brodeur did deserve a couple of Vezinas, but as said there's still a lot of air in his legacy.

Listing a bunch of goalies and their save percentages doesn't exactly prove much though, does it. What happens if we do the same for GAA or wins? (hint: Brodeur looks very good).