ATD 2014 Draft Thread II

[ResilientBeast]

The draft will last 25 rounds. You must draft 2 goalies, 6 defensemen, 12 forwards, a coach and 4 extra picks.

Now on a 8 hour clock.

2). The time windows will be tight but reasonable.

• 12 hour clock for the first two rounds, (sending a shortlist to another GM highly encouraged here)
• then 10 hour clock for rounds 3-6,
• then 8 hour clock for rounds 7-14,
• then 6 hour clock for rounds 15-20,
• then 4 hour clock for rounds 21-25

One hour time window deduction for each skipped pick (two hour deduction for missing a 12 hour clock - leave a list), with a minimum 4 hour clock guaranteed regardless of deductions.

3). Trades - No trades!

• Swapping your entire set of draft picks with another GM before either of you has made a single pick is allowed, however.

4). ADD/DROPS - At the conclusion of the draft, there will be a 7 day period for add/drops. All add/drops must be 1-for-1. Dropped players will NOT be eligible to be added by other teams.

5). At the conclusion of the draft, there will be a 10 day period for lineup assassinations. Assassinations will be divided by division.

6). Regular season rankings MUST BE VOTED ON by at least one GM (if the team is co-GM'd) per team. The penalty if not done is a potential lowering in the standings because each GM will rank his own team first. Co-GMs who both vote each get half a vote for the regular season rankings in their own division.

GMs who vote in every round of the playoffs will get preference of their draft positions in the following draft.

7). All Teams make the playoffs. The conferences will be divided into two divisions of 7 each, with the regular season divisional winner getting a 1st round bye in the playoffs. The first round of the playoffs will feature three intra-divisional matchups in each division, after which the remaining teams will compete in divisional semifinals (standard high vs. low seed) and divisional finals rounds. Winners of the divisions will meet in the conference finals, and winners of the conference will meet in the draft finals.

8). NO MENTIONING UNDRAFTED PLAYERS!!!

9). PM the next team after you have made your pick. THIS IS NOT OPTIONAL!

Deductions

Stoneberg - Halifax Citadels = -1 hour

The 2014 Draft Order:

Round 1:

1. Brave Canadian - Guelph Platers: Bobby Orr, D
2. MadArcand - Hartford Whalers: Wayne Gretzky, C
3. SchultzSquared - Salt Lake Golden Eagles: Gordie Howe, RW
4. tony_d - Indianapolis Racers: Doug Harvey, D
5. chaosrevolver & Dreakmur: Montreal Shamrocks: Ray Bourque, D
6. ted1971 - As de Québec: Maurice Richard, RW
7. Hobnobs - Rögle BK: Nicklas Lidstrom, D
8. Hawkey Town 18 - Chicago Shamrocks: Mario Lemieux, C
9. Stoneberg - Halifax Citadels: Eddie Shore, D
10. BillyShoe1721 - Philadelphia Flyers: Bobby Hull, LW
11. markrander87 - Victoria Salsa: Jean Beliveau, C
12. Johnny Engine - Buchans Miners: Patrick Roy, G
13. ResilientBeast - Edmonton Eskimos: Stan Mikita, C
14. bluesfan94 & Nalyd Psycho - Kansas City Scouts: Denis Potvin, D
15. TheDevilMadeMe - New Jersey Swamp Devils: Red Kelly, D/C
16. Jafar - Montreal Canadiens: Howie Morenz, C
17. King Forsberg - Modo Hockey: Jaromir Jagr, RW
18. Reds4Life - Detroit Red Wings: Dominik Hasek, G
19. Velociraptor - Belfast Giants: Bobby Clarke, C
20. monster_bertuzzi - Vancouver Millionaires: Mark Messier, C/LW
21. Dwight - West Island Lions: Bryan Trottier, C
22. papershoes - Kenora Thistles: Larry Robinson, D
23. Modo - Eishockeyclub München e.V.: Steve Yzerman, C
24. JFA87-66-99 - Pittsburgh Bankers: Guy Lafleur, RW
25. Rob Scuderi - Pittsburgh AC: Slava Fetisov, D
26. 87and71 - Pittsburgh Hornets: Mike Bossy, RW
27. LeafLander - Toronto Maple Leafs: Chris Chelios, D
28. Hedberg & VanIslander - New York Rangers: Joe Sakic, C

Round 2:

29. Hedberg & VanIslander - New York Rangers: Brad Park, D
30. LeafLander - Toronto Maple Leafs: Phil Esposito, C
31. 87and71 - Pittsburgh Hornets: Ted Lindsay, LW
32. Rob Scuderi - Pittsburgh AC: Frank Nighbor, C/LW
33. JFA87-66-99 - Pittsburgh Bankers: Jacques Plante, G
34. Modo - Eishockeyclub München e.V.: Valeri Kharlamov, LW
35. papershoes - Kenora Thistles: Cyclone Taylor, C/D
36. Dwight - West Island Lions: Pierre Pilote, D
37. monster_bertuzzi - Vancouver Millionaires: King Clancy, D
38. Velociraptor - Belfast Giants: Paul Coffey, D
39. Reds4Life - Detroit Red Wings: Scott Stevens, D
40. King Forsberg - Modo Hockey: Chris Pronger, D
41. Jafar - Montreal Canadiens: Sprague Cleghorn, D
42. TheDevilMadeMe - New Jersey Swamp Devils: Bill Cook, RW
43. bluesfan94 & Nalyd Psycho - Kansas City Scouts: Milt Schmidt, C
44. ResilientBeast - Edmonton Eskimos: Tim Horton, D
45. Johnny Engine - Buchans Miners: Al MacInnis, D
46. markrander87 - Victoria Salsa: Earl Seibert, D
47. BillyShoe1721 - Philadelphia Flyers: Glenn Hall, G
48. Stoneberg - Halifax Citadels: Terry Sawchuk, G
49. Hawkey Town 18 - Chicago Shamrocks: Bill Gadsby, D
50. Hobnobs - Rögle BK: Frank Boucher, C
51. ted1971 - As de Québec: Alexander Ovechkin, LW
52. chaosrevolver & Dreakmur: Montreal Shamrocks: Frank Mahovlich, LW
53. tony_d - Indianapolis Racers: Newsy Lalonde, C
54. SchultzSquared - Salt Lake Golden Eagles: Ken Dryden, G
55. MadArcand - Hartford Whalers: Jari Kurri, RW
56. Brave Canadian - Guelph Platers: Syl Apps, C

Round 3:

57. Brave Canadian - Guelph Platers: Zdeno Chara, D
58. MadArcand - Hartford Whalers: Brian Leetch, D
59. SchultzSquared - Salt Lake Golden Eagles: Henri Richard, C
60. tony_d - Indianapolis Racers: Sergei Makarov, RW
61. chaosrevolver & Dreakmur - Montreal Shamrocks: Andy Bathgate, RW
62. ted1971 - As de Québec: Dit Clapper, D/RW
63. Hobnobs - Rögle BK: Bernie Geoffrion, RW
64. Hawkey Town 18 - Chicago Shamrocks: Charlie Conacher, RW
65. Stoneberg - Halifax Citadels: Marcel Dionne, C
66. BillyShoe1721 - Philadelphia Flyers: Borje Salming, D
67. markrander87 - Victoria Salsa: Martin Brodeur, G
68. Johnny Engine - Buchans Miners: Dickie Moore, LW
69. ResilientBeast - Edmonton Eskimos: Bill Quackenbush, D
70. bluesfan94 & Nalyd Psycho - Kansas City Scouts: Ted Kennedy, C
71. TheDevilMadeMe - New Jersey Swamp Devils: Peter Forsberg, C
72. Jafar - Montreal Canadiens: Boris Mikhailov, RW
73. King Forsberg - Modo Hockey: Sidney Crosby, C
74. Reds4Life - Detroit Red Wings: Sergei Fedorov, C
75. Velociraptor - Belfast Giants: Teemu Selanne, RW
76. monster_bertuzzi - Vancouver Millionaires: Mark Howe, D
77. Dwight - West Island Lions: Cy Denneny, LW
78. papershoes - Kenora Thistles: Sid Abel, C/LW
79. Modo - Eishockeyclub München e.V.: Brett Hull, RW
80. JFA87-66-99 - Pittsburgh Bankers: Elmer Lach, C
81. Rob Scuderi - Pittsburgh AC: Valeri Vasiliev, D
82. 87and71 - Pittsburgh Hornets: Scott Niedermayer, D
83. LeafLander - Toronto Maple Leafs: Guy Lapointe, D
84. Hedberg & VanIslander - New York Rangers: Aurel Joliat, LW

Round 4:

85. Hedberg & VanIslander - New York Rangers: Rod Langway, D
86. LeafLander - Toronto Maple Leafs: Vladislav Tretiak, G
87. 87and71 - Pittsburgh Hornets: Serge Savard, D
88. Rob Scuderi - Pittsburgh AC: Max Bentley, C
89. JFA87-66-99 - Pittsburgh Bankers: J.C. Tremblay, D
90. Modo - Eishockeyclub München e.V.: "Black" Jack Stewart, D
91. papershoes - Kenora Thistles: Jarome Iginla, RW
92. Dwight - West Island Lions: Eddie Gerard, D/LW
93. monster_bertuzzi - Vancouver Millionaires: Joe Malone, C/LW
94. Velociraptor - Belfast Giants: Doug Bentley, LW/C
95. Reds4Life - Detroit Red Wings: Norm Ullman, C
96. King Forsberg - Modo Hockey: Anatoli Firsov, LW
97. Jafar - Montreal Canadiens: Frank Brimsek, G
98. TheDevilMadeMe - New Jersey Swamp Devils: Toe Blake, LW
99. bluesfan94 & Nalyd Psycho - Kansas City Scouts: Pavel Bure, RW
100. ResilientBeast - Edmonton Eskimos: Cam Neely, RW
101. Johnny Engine - Buchans Miners: Doug Gilmour, C
102. markrander87 - Victoria Salsa: Alex Delvecchio, C/LW
103. BillyShoe1721 - Philadelphia Flyers: Johnny Bucyk, LW
104. Stoneberg - Halifax Citadels: Ivan "Ching" Johnson, D
105. Hawkey Town 18 - Chicago Shamrocks: Harvey "Busher" Jackson, LW
106. Hobnobs - Rögle BK: Gilbert Perreault, C
107. ted1971 - As de Québec: Bert Olmstead, LW
108. chaosrevolver & Dreakmur - Montreal Shamrocks: Hooley Smith, C/RW
109. tony_d - Indianapolis Racers : Lionel Conacher, D
110. SchultzSquared - Salt Lake Golden Eagles: Marcel Pronovost, D
111. MadArcand - Hartford Whalers : Ernie 'Moose' Johnson D
112. Brave Canadian - Guelph Platers : Ron Francis C

Round 5:

113. Brave Canadian - Guelph Platers : Michel Goulet LW
114. MadArcand - Hartford Whalers : Rob Blake D
115. SchultzSquared - Salt Lake Golden Eagles : Emile "Butch" Bouchard D
116. tony_d - Indianapolis Racers : Brendan Shanahan LW
117. chaosrevolver & Dreakmur - Montreal Shamrocks: Jacques Laperriere, D
118. ted1971 - As de Québec: Joe Primeau, C
119. Hobnobs - Rögle BK : Larry Murphy, D
120. Hawkey Town 18 - Chicago Shamrocks : Ebbie Goodfellow, D.
121. Stoneberg - Halifax Citadels : Martin St. Louis, RW
122. BillyShoe1721 - Philadelphia Flyers : Hod Stuart D
123. markrander87 - Victoria Salsa: Alexei Kasatonov, D
124. Johnny Engine - Buchans Miners: Alexander Maltsev, C/RW
125. ResilientBeast - Edmonton Eskimos: Peter Stastny, C
126. bluesfan94 & Nalyd Psycho - Kansas City Scouts George Boucher, D
127. TheDevilMadeMe - New Jersey Swamp Devils: Babe Siebert, D/LW
128. Jafar - Montreal Canadiens: Syd Howe, LW/C/D
129. King Forsberg - Modo Hockey: Jan Suchy, D
130. Reds4Life - Detroit Red Wings: Dave Keon, C
131. Velociraptor - Belfast Giants: Eric Lindros, C
132. monster_bertuzzi - Vancouver Millionaires: Joe Thornton, C
133. Dwight - West Island Lions : Punch Broadbent, RW
134. papershoes - Kenora Thistles : Carl Brewer, D
135. Modo - Eishockeyclub München e.V. : Ferdinand Charles Flaman, D
136. JFA87-66-99 - Pittsburgh Bankers : Tommy Phillips, LW/RW
137. Rob Scuderi - Pittsburgh AC : Bryan Hextall, RW
138. 87and71 - Pittsburgh Hornets : Adam Oates, C
139. LeafLander - Toronto Maple Leafs : Paul Kariya, LW
140. Hedberg & VanIslander - New York Rangers : Yvan Cournoyer, RW

Round 6:

141. Hedberg & VanIslander - New York Rangers : Clint Benedict, G
142. LeafLander - Toronto Maple Leafs : Babe Dye, RW
143. 87and71 - Pittsburgh Hornets : Pavel Datsyuk, C
144. Rob Scuderi - Pittsburgh AC : Georges Vezina, G
145. JFA87-66-99 - Pittsburgh Bankers : Tom Johnson, D
146. Modo - Eishockeyclub München e.V. : Mike Modano, C
147. papershoes - Kenora Thistles : Evgeni Malkin, C
148. Dwight - West Island Lions : Rick Middleton, RW
149. monster_bertuzzi - Vancouver Millionaires : Sweeney Schriner, LW
150. Velociraptor - Belfast Giants : Art Coulter, D
151. Reds4Life - Detroit Red Wings : Ken Reardon, D
152. King Forsberg - Modo Hockey: Bill Durnan, G
153. Jafar - Montreal Canadiens: Frantisek Pospisil, D
154. TheDevilMadeMe - New Jersey Swamp Devils: Bill Cowley, C
155. bluesfan94 & Nalyd Psycho - Kansas City Scouts : Sylvio Mantha, D
156. ResilientBeast - Edmonton Eskimos : Ed Belfour, G
157. Johnny Engine - Buchans Miners : Lester Patrick, D
158. markrander87 - Victoria Salsa : Doug Wilson, D
159. BillyShoe1721 - Philadelphia Flyers : Vladimir Petrov, C
160. Stoneberg - Halifax Citadels: Roy Conacher, LW
161. Hawkey Town 18 - Chicago Shamrocks : Charlie Gardiner, G
162. Hobnobs - Rögle BK : Bill White, D
163. ted1971 - As de Québec : Turk Broda, G
164. chaosrevolver & Dreakmur - Montreal Shamrocks: Bernie Parent, G
165. tony_d - Indianapolis Racers: Dale Hawerchuk, C
166. SchultzSquared - Salt Lake Golden Eagles: Nels Stewart, C
167. MadArcand - Hartford Whalers: John Leclair, LW
168. Brave Canadian - Guelph Platers: Johnny Bower, G

Round 7:

169. Brave Canadian - Guelph Platers: Mark Recchi, RW
170. MadArcand - Hartford Whalers: Tony Esposito, G
171. SchultzSquared - Salt Lake Golden Eagles: Reg Noble, LW/D/C
172. tony_d - Indianapolis Racers : Billy Smith, G
173. chaosrevolver & Dreakmur - Montreal Shamrocks: Marty Barry, C/LW
174. ted1971 - As de Québec : Denis Savard, C
175. Hobnobs - Rögle BK : Roy Worters, G
176. Hawkey Town 18 - Chicago Shamrocks: Henrik Zetterberg, C/LW
177. Stoneberg - Halifax Citadels : Allan Stanley, D
178. BillyShoe1721 - Philadelphia Flyers : Jean Ratelle, C
179. markrander87 - Victoria Salsa : Mickey Mackay, C/R
180. Johnny Engine - Buchans Miners : Luc Robitaille, LW
181. ResilientBeast - Edmonton Eskimos : Woody Dumart, LW
182. bluesfan94 & Nalyd Psycho - Kansas City Scouts : Jiri Holecek, G
183. TheDevilMadeMe - New Jersey Swamp Devils : Harry Cameron, D
184. Jafar - Montreal Canadiens: Jimmy Thomson, D
185. King Forsberg - Modo Hockey: Eric Desjardins, D
186. Reds4Life - Detroit Red Wings: Vladimir Martinec, RW
187. Velociraptor - Belfast Giants : Cecil "Tiny" Thompson, G
188. monster_bertuzzi - Vancouver Millionaires : Clarence Day, D
189. Dwight - West Island Lions : Markus Naslund, LW
190. papershoes - Kenora Thistles : Harvey Pulford, D
191. Modo - Eishockeyclub München e.V. : Hugh Lehman, G.
192. JFA87-66-99 - Pittsburgh Bankers : Alexander Ragulin, D
193. Rob Scuderi - Pittsburgh AC: Patrik Elias, C/LW
194. 87and71 - Pittsburgh Hornets : Ilya Kovalchuk, LW/RW
195. LeafLander - Toronto Maple Leafs : Sergei Gonchar, D
196. Hedberg & VanIslander - New York Rangers : Harry Howell, D

Round 8:

197. Hedberg & VanIslander - New York Rangers : Sergei Zubov, D
198. LeafLander - Toronto Maple Leafs : Vladimir Konstantinov, D
199. 87and71 - Pittsburgh Hornets : Daniel Alfredsson, RW
200. Rob Scuderi - Pittsburgh AC, Art Ross, D
201. JFA87-66-99 - Pittsburgh Bankers, Marian Hossa RW
202. Modo - Eishockeyclub München e.V. : Pat Stapleton, D
203. papershoes - Kenora Thistles : Bob Gainey, LW
204. Dwight - West Island Lions: Moose Vasko, D
205. monster_bertuzzi - Vancouver Millionaires: Glenn Anderson, RW
206. Velociraptor - Belfast Giants: Bun Cook, LW
207. Reds4Life - Detroit Red Wings : Bill Barber, LW
208. King Forsberg - Modo Hockey : Darryl Sittler, C
209. Jafar - Montreal Canadiens : Frank Fredrickson , C
210. TheDevilMadeMe - New Jersey Swamp Devils : Herb Gardiner, D
211. bluesfan94 & Nalyd Psycho - Kansas City Scouts: Vaclav Nedomansky, C/RW
212. ResilientBeast - Edmonton Eskimos: Lanny McDonald, RW
213. Johnny Engine - Buchans Miners: Brad McCrimmon, D
214. markrander87 - Victoria Salsa: Claude Provost, RW
215. BillyShoe1721 - Philadelphia Flyers: Theo Fleury, RW
216. Stoneberg - Halifax Citadels : Wayne Cashman, LW
217. Hawkey Town 18 - Chicago Shamrocks : Vladimir Lutchenko, D
218. Hobnobs - Rögle BK : Helmut Balderis, RW
219. ted1971 - As de Québec : Jack Walker, F
220. chaosrevolver & Dreakmur - Montreal Shamrocks : Frank Foyston, F
221. tony_d - Indianapolis Racers : Gary Suter, D
222. SchultzSquared - Salt Lake Golden Eagles : Ott Heller, D
223. MadArcand - Hartford Whalers : Rod Brind'Amour, C/LW
224. Brave Canadian - Guelph Platers : Zigmund Palffy, RW

Round 9:

225 Brave Canadian - Guelph Platers : Duncan Keith, D
226. MadArcand - Hartford Whalers : Russell Bowie, C
227. SchultzSquared - Salt Lake Golden Eagles : Rick Martin, LW
228. tony_d - Indianapolis Racers : Brian Propp, LW
229. chaosrevolver & Dreakmur - Montreal Shamrocks : Lionel Hitchman, D
230. ted1971 - As de Québec : Leo Boivin, D
231. Hobnobs - Rögle BK : Guy Carbonneau, C
232. Hawkey Town 18 - Chicago Shamrocks : Ace Bailey, RW
233. Stoneberg - Halifax Citadels : Bernie Morris, C/RW
234. BillyShoe1721 - Philadelphia Flyers : Mike Grant, D
235. markrander87 - Victoria Salsa : Rod Gilbert, RW
236. Johnny Engine - Buchans Miners : Didier Pitre, RW/D
237. ResilientBeast - Edmonton Eskimos : Igor Larionov, C
238. bluesfan94 & Nalyd Psycho - Kansas City Scouts : Clark Gilles, LW
239. TheDevilMadeMe - New Jersey Swamp Devils : Grant Fuhr, G
240. Jafar - Montreal Canadiens : Paul Thompson, LW
241. King Forsberg - Modo Hockey : Jacques Lemaire, C
242. Reds4Life - Detroit Red Wings : Alexander Yakushev, LW
243. Velociraptor - Belfast Giants : Derian Hatcher, D
244. monster_bertuzzi - Vancouver Millionaires
245. Dwight - West Island Lions
246. papershoes - Kenora Thistles
247. Modo - Eishockeyclub München e.V.
248. JFA87-66-99 - Pittsburgh Bankers
249. Rob Scuderi - Pittsburgh AC
250. 87and71 - Pittsburgh Hornets
251. LeafLander - Toronto Maple Leafs
252. Hedberg & VanIslander - New York Rangers

Round 10:

253. Hedberg & VanIslander - New York Rangers
254. LeafLander - Toronto Maple Leafs
255. 87and71 - Pittsburgh Hornets
256. Rob Scuderi - Pittsburgh AC
257. JFA87-66-99 - Pittsburgh Bankers
258. Modo - Eishockeyclub München e.V.
259. papershoes - Kenora Thistles
260. Dwight - West Island Lions
261. monster_bertuzzi - Vancouver Millionaires
262. Velociraptor - Belfast Giants
263. Reds4Life - Detroit Red Wings
264. King Forsberg - Modo Hockey
265. Jafar - Montreal Canadiens
266. TheDevilMadeMe - New Jersey Swamp Devils
267. bluesfan94 & Nalyd Psycho - Kansas City Scouts
268. ResilientBeast - Edmonton Eskimos
269. Johnny Engine - Buchans Miners
270. markrander87 - Victoria Salsa
271. BillyShoe1721 - Philadelphia Flyers
272. Stoneberg - Halifax Citadels
273. Hawkey Town 18 - Chicago Shamrocks
274. Hobnobs - Rögle BK
275. ted1971 - As de Québec
276. chaosrevolver & Dreakmur - Montreal Shamrocks
277. tony_d - Indianapolis Racers
278. SchultzSquared - Salt Lake Golden Eagles
279. MadArcand - Hartford Whalers
280. Brave Canadian - Guelph Platers

Round 11:

281 Brave Canadian - Guelph Platers
282. MadArcand - Hartford Whalers
283. SchultzSquared - Salt Lake Golden Eagles
284. tony_d - Indianapolis Racers
285. chaosrevolver & Dreakmur - Montreal Shamrocks
286. ted1971 - As de Québec
287. Hobnobs - Rögle BK
288. Hawkey Town 18 - Chicago Shamrocks
289. Stoneberg - Halifax Citadels
290. BillyShoe1721 - Philadelphia Flyers
291. markrander87 - Victoria Salsa
292. Johnny Engine - Buchans Miners
293. ResilientBeast - Edmonton Eskimos
294. bluesfan94 & Nalyd Psycho - Kansas City Scouts
295. TheDevilMadeMe - New Jersey Swamp Devils
296. Jafar - Montreal Canadiens
297. King Forsberg - Modo Hockey
298. Reds4Life - Detroit Red Wings
299. Velociraptor - Belfast Giants
300. monster_bertuzzi - Vancouver Millionaires
301. Dwight - West Island Lions
302. papershoes - Kenora Thistles
303. Modo - Eishockeyclub München e.V.
304. JFA87-66-99 - Pittsburgh Bankers
305. Rob Scuderi - Pittsburgh AC
306. 87and71 - Pittsburgh Hornets
307. LeafLander - Toronto Maple Leafs
308. Hedberg & VanIslander - New York Rangers

Round 12

309. Hedberg & VanIslander - New York Rangers
310. LeafLander - Toronto Maple Leafs
311. 87and71 - Pittsburgh Hornets
312. Rob Scuderi - Pittsburgh AC
313. JFA87-66-99 - Pittsburgh Bankers
314. Modo - Eishockeyclub München e.V.
315. papershoes - Kenora Thistles
316. Dwight - West Island Lions
317. monster_bertuzzi - Vancouver Millionaires
318. Velociraptor - Belfast Giants
319. Reds4Life - Detroit Red Wings
320. King Forsberg - Modo Hockey
321. Jafar - Montreal Canadiens
322. TheDevilMadeMe - New Jersey Swamp Devils
323. bluesfan94 & Nalyd Psycho - Kansas City Scouts
324. ResilientBeast - Edmonton Eskimos
325. Johnny Engine - Buchans Miners
326. markrander87 - Victoria Salsa
327. BillyShoe1721 - Philadelphia Flyers
328. Stoneberg - Halifax Citadels
329. Hawkey Town 18 - Chicago Shamrocks
330. Hobnobs - Rögle BK
331. ted1971 - As de Québec
332. chaosrevolver & Dreakmur - Montreal Shamrocks
333. tony_d - Indianapolis Racers
334. SchultzSquared - Salt Lake Golden Eagles
335. MadArcand - Hartford Whalers
336. Brave Canadian - Guelph Platers

Click to read more...

 

[Dreakmur]

Good pick with Devlecchio there Mark. I read somewhere that he was good defensively, but can't remember where. I hope you can find something on it.

 

[TheDevilMadeMe]

Good pick with Devlecchio there Mark. I read somewhere that he was good defensively, but can't remember where. I hope you can find something on it.

I think Delvecchio's drop was deserved, but this is a good place for him.

And yes, he was a strong defensive player. I thought of him briefly, but decided I preferred Toe Blake's grit.

 

[Hawkey Town 18]

I think Delvecchio's drop was deserved, but this is a good place for him.

And yes, he was a strong defensive player. I thought of him briefly, but decided I preferred Toe Blake's grit.

Blake was a nice pick, I was likely going to take him with my upcoming pick to play with Mario. Now I have no idea who I am going to take or even what position.

 

[TheDevilMadeMe]

Blake was a nice pick, I was likely going to take him with my upcoming pick to play with Mario. Now I have no idea who I am going to take or even what position.

IMO, Blake's value increased quite a bit after overpass showed last time that he was a gritty, digging player, who was strong both ways. I think we all assumed that he probably was that type of player, but overpass's work really confirmed it.

 

[BillyShoe1721]

Delvecchio was the perfect center for a puck-dominant winger like Bobby Hull, there goes my entire plan with Ullman and Delvecchio gone.

 

[markrander87]

Delvecchio was the perfect center for a puck-dominant winger like Bobby Hull, there goes my entire plan with Ullman and Delvecchio gone.

Looks like I scooped you both times with he and Seibert, nothing personal but with you in my division I can't say i'm upset

 

[markrander87]

I think one thing that needs to be mentioned is how often Delvecchio Was not on Gordie Howes line. His legacy gets laced with "well he played with Howe" etc...but as Overpass showed in the HOH top Centre thread Delvecchio was not a product of Howe.

 

[TheDevilMadeMe]

I think one thing that needs to be mentioned is how often Delvecchio Was not on Gordie Howes line. His legacy gets laced with "well he played with Howe" etc...but as Overpass showed in the HOH top Centre thread Delvecchio was not a product of Howe.

Eh, he was on Howe's line for the large majority of his career, but he did have a few strong seasons without Howe as a regular even strength linemate (including the one season he was actually a 2nd Team AS C)

Edit: Though I must say, I am finding it ironic that you are happily using Delvecchio at LW after getting on me for using Sid Abel at LW last year, when Abel spent more time at LW than Delvecchio did.

 

[Hobnobs]

That implies that the Ducks were better off, or just as good without Pronger, which definitely wasn't the case. That Ducks team went 16-5 in those playoffs. They were dominant.

I dont think they were better off without Pronger but he wasnt going to win the smythe being out two games which his team won certainly not when he missed those games because of suspensions for trying to open up skulls with his elbow.

 

[BillyShoe1721]

The Philadelphia Flyers select intangible machine LW Johnny Bucyk. He gives us a lot of flexibility when building our second line.

VsX: 116, 89, 82, 81, 80, 80, 73, 73, 71, 71, 71, 70, 69, 69, 66, 65, 64, 62, 43, 41

7-year Weighted VsX of Drafted LWs(underrates Bucyk because of his incredible longevity)

Rank | Player | Rank|Draft Spot
1 | Bobby Hull | 107.1|10
2 | Ted Lindsay | 106|31
3 | Doug Bentley* ** | 96.2|94
4 | Toe Blake* | 92.6|98
5 | Alex Ovechkin | 92.1|51
9 | Dickie Moore | 88.6|68
11 | Sid Abel | 87.8|78
12 | John Bucyk | 86.3|103
13 | Frank Mahovlich | 85.5|52
15 | Alex Delvecchio | 84.9|102
20 | Aurel Joliat | 83.1|84

* wartime star

** 1949-50 Chicago

Read about his physicality, two-way play, and leadership in the great bio that seventies did a few years ago:

http://hfboards.mandatory.com/showpost.php?p=31455086&postcount=110

 

[TheDevilMadeMe]

7-year Weighted VsX of Drafted LWs(underrates Bucyk because of his incredible longevity)

Either that, or it overrates him because his offensive explosion happened when Bobby Orr came to Boston, not to mention playing with Esposito on Boston's dominant PP.

Bucyk did have incredible longevity as a first line player, though. (And was a beast in corners without taking penalties)

 

[Dreakmur]

The Philadelphia Flyers select intangible machine LW Johnny Bucyk. He gives us a lot of flexibility when building our second line.

VsX: 116, 89, 82, 81, 80, 80, 73, 73, 71, 71, 71, 70, 69, 69, 66, 65, 64, 62, 43, 41

7-year Weighted VsX of Drafted LWs(underrates Bucyk because of his incredible longevity)

Rank | Player | Rank|Draft Spot
1 | Bobby Hull | 107.1|10
2 | Ted Lindsay | 106|31
3 | Doug Bentley* ** | 96.2|94
4 | Toe Blake* | 92.6|98
5 | Alex Ovechkin | 92.1|51
9 | Dickie Moore | 88.6|68
11 | Sid Abel | 87.8|78
12 | John Bucyk | 86.3|103
13 | Frank Mahovlich | 85.5|52
15 | Alex Delvecchio | 84.9|102
20 | Aurel Joliat | 83.1|84

* wartime star

** 1949-50 Chicago

Read about his physicality, two-way play, and leadership in the great bio that seventies did a few years ago:

http://hfboards.mandatory.com/showpost.php?p=31455086&postcount=110

Excellent pick, but those offensive numbers are a bit misleading.

 

[Stoneberg]

Unfortunately for myself and everyone else Bucyk was the last guy on the short list I made last night for work today.

I'll probably be at work another couple hours at least, then have to commute home in a snowy mess, then have to research a pick. So best case scenario, I pick in about 4 hours.

 

[Sturminator]

IMO, Blake's value increased quite a bit after overpass showed last time that he was a gritty, digging player, who was strong both ways. I think we all assumed that he probably was that type of player, but overpass's work really confirmed it.

I think there's a tradeoff; some of the work done last year also illuminated possible issues with Blake's offense. These are his VsX scores in chronological order:

75, 107, 84, 73, 83, 82, 77, 92, 96, 79

The bolded are 1944-45 and onwards, when Blake experienced a "second peak" in his thirties in a war-depleted league playing on a line with a peaking Maurice Richard. These results can probably be thrown out, and the first seven years of his peak taken to get a truer accounting of his 7-season VsX totals (luckily he had seven peak seasons before things start to look distorted). The 77 is from 1943-44, but for the sake of not splitting hairs and because it is close to his old baseline, we'll just assume it is undistorted. Using the non-bolded years of the above, Blake's 7-season VsX score is 83.2, a good bit lower than the 92.6 that he has without adjustment. Taking the long view on Blake, he looks like a guy who produced at around the 80% benchmark consistently, with a one-time spike in his career year.

 

[Sturminator]

Excellent pick, but those offensive numbers are a bit misleading.

Yes, sadly the top of the VsX table for LWs is littered with pretty obvious distortions.

 

[TheDevilMadeMe]

I think there's a tradeoff; some of the work done last year also illuminated possible issues with Blake's offense. These are his VsX scores in chronological order:

75, 107, 84, 73, 83, 82, 77, 92, 96, 79

The bolded are 1944-45 and onwards, when Blake experienced a "second peak" in his thirties in a war-depleted league playing on a line with a peaking Maurice Richard. These results can probably be thrown out, and the first seven years of his peak taken to get a truer accounting of his 7-season VsX totals (luckily he had seven peak seasons before things start to look distorted). The 77 is from 1943-44, but for the sake of not splitting hairs and because it is close to his old baseline, we'll just assume it is undistorted. Using the non-bolded years of the above, Blake's 7-season VsX score is 83.2, a good bit lower than the 92.6 that he has without adjustment. Taking the long view on Blake, he looks like a guy who produced at around the 80% benchmark consistently, with a one-time spike in his career year.

I don't think the "issues" with Blake's offense are new - everyone knows he played through the war when other players weren't in the league. I completely agree with throwing out his 1944-45 year when the Punch Line roflstomped the war-depleted league in the regular season. I do not think we should just throw out 1945-46 entirely, however - most (not all) of the league was back from the war.

I get that there was a Maurice Richard factor involved in 1945-46, but if we are going to throw it out entirely because of linemates, we need to start looking at knocking Dickie Moore and others down.

Basically, I think that 83.2 (which is what you get if you pretend Blake retires after 1944) is a bit too low, but is a lot closer to his true value than the 92.6 raw VsX score (which would have him as the 4th best offensive LW of all-time, which nobody believed to begin with).

Yes, sadly the top of the VsX table for LWs is littered with pretty obvious distortions.

Heh, yes. Basically, every LW in the table Billy listed could be argued to have his numbers inflated by his linemates, playing through WW2, and/or team situation, other than Bobby Hull, Alex Ovechkin, and Frank Mahovlich.

(That's why I questioned throwing out Toe Blake's 1945-46 season entirely, even if I agree with throwing out his 1944-45)

 

[tony d]

Bucyk and Brimsek where both options i was looking at for my upcoming picks. Looks like Ill be spending a snowy night researching.

 

[Sturminator]

I get that there was a Maurice Richard factor involved in 1945-46, but if we are going to throw it out entirely because of linemates, we need to start looking at knocking Dickie Moore and others down.

It is not necessary to treat Blake's 1945-46 season as though it didn't happen in order to ignore it for VsX purposes. The question is whether we think he was legitimately performing above his already established baseline (a tick below 80%), or whether the scoring spike was due to some improvement in his play. I think it's entirely possible that Blake had a good season that year, up to his normal standard, but unlikely that his scoring totals that year represent a true spike in performance.

Take his normal baseline and add it into the VsX formula in place of his 7th best season, and it doesn't move the needle much, and that is giving him the benefit of the doubt for the 1943-44 score. Basically, I think Blake's later performance is legitimate in that it adds meaningfully to his longevity (ten seasons as an impact player is strong for his generation), but I think it can be essentially ignored when calculating his peak offensive value because he already has a seven-year peak we can use.

 

[Velociraptor]

7-year Weighted VsX of Drafted LWs(underrates Bucyk because of his incredible longevity)

Rank | Player | Rank|Draft Spot
1 | Bobby Hull | 107.1|10
2 | Ted Lindsay | 106|31
3 | Doug Bentley* ** | 96.2|94
4 | Toe Blake* | 92.6|98
5 | Alex Ovechkin | 92.1|51
9 | Dickie Moore | 88.6|68
11 | Sid Abel | 87.8|78
12 | John Bucyk | 86.3|103
13 | Frank Mahovlich | 85.5|52
15 | Alex Delvecchio | 84.9|102
20 | Aurel Joliat | 83.1|84

* wartime star

** 1949-50 Chicago

Out of curiosity, what is the relevance of your second asterisk?

I'd also like to hear peoples thoughts comparing Bentley, Blake, and Bucyk. I had a pretty difficult time differentiating the three when it was my turn to draft. They all possess several advantageous intangibles, but I went with Bentley who was known as a tenacious back-checker (seems like him and Blake are very similar, Blake playing a rougher, grittier style of hockey.

 

[tony d]

Bucyk and Brimsek where both options i was looking at for my upcoming picks. Looks like Ill be spending a snowy night researching.

 

[BillyShoe1721]

Out of curiosity, what is the relevance of your second asterisk?

I'd also like to hear peoples thoughts comparing Bentley, Blake, and Bucyk. I had a pretty difficult time differentiating the three when it was my turn to draft. They all possess several advantageous intangibles, but I went with Bentley who was known as a tenacious back-checker (seems like him and Blake are very similar, Blake playing a rougher, grittier style of hockey.

That was included in the original VsX table that I copied the numbers from. I'm not sure the exact details, but I think it was that there was some belief that the scorekeepers in Chicago were very liberal in rewarding assist totals during the late 1940s. I think there was an article about it somewhere. Sturm created the table, so I think he would know.

 

[TheDevilMadeMe]

It is not necessary to treat Blake's 1945-46 season as though it didn't happen in order to ignore it for VsX purposes. The question is whether we think he was legitimately performing above his already established baseline (a tick below 80%), or whether the scoring spike was due to some improvement in his play. I think it's entirely possible that Blake had a good season that year, up to his normal standard, but unlikely that his scoring totals that year represent a true spike in performance.

Take his normal baseline and add it into the VsX formula in place of his 7th best season, and it doesn't move the needle much, and that is giving him the benefit of the doubt for the 1943-44 score. Basically, I think Blake's later performance is legitimate in that it adds meaningfully to his longevity (ten seasons as an impact player is strong for his generation), but I think it can be essentially ignored when calculating his peak offensive value.

It's possible that Blake's 1945-46 statistics are majority distorted like his 1944-45 ones. But I think it's just as possible that it was a legitimate late career spike year for him, similar to how his Hart year was an early career spike year (though not as good as his Hart year obviously).

In 1944-45, the Punch Line finished 1-2-3 in scoring, way above everyone else, Blake was the third, and Lach and Richard finished 1-2 in Hart voting.

But in 1945-46 (after most but not all players returned from the War), Blake actually led the Montreal Canadiens in scoring - 50 points for Blake, 48 for Richard, 47 for Lach. All 3 members played all 50 games: http://www.hockey-reference.com/teams/MTL/1946.html. Hard to tell anything from Hart voting, as only Montreal's goalie finished in the top 5, and we don't have anything past that for that year.

 

[TheDevilMadeMe]

Out of curiosity, what is the relevance of your second asterisk?

I'd also like to hear peoples thoughts comparing Bentley, Blake, and Bucyk. I had a pretty difficult time differentiating the three when it was my turn to draft. They all possess several advantageous intangibles, but I went with Bentley who was known as a tenacious back-checker (seems like him and Blake are very similar, Blake playing a rougher, grittier style of hockey.

I think Bentley and Blake are very close - Bentley was faster and has somewhat better regular season stats, I believe, even after adjusting for distortions. Blake was grittier, a better leader, and has an outstanding playoff resume. (Bentley's playoff resume is basically an "incomplete," since unfortunately, he was stuck on a crappy Chicago team for his career). Both were strong two-way players (we already knew this about Bentley; I think Blake's two-way game wasn't really explored until last draft).

Bentley is LW/C eligible, which gives you useful versatility this early in the draft.

I think Bucyk is a clear step down from them as an overall player. Keeping in mind that Bucyk is one of those long-career, relatively low peak guys that others might rate higher than me.

But Bucyk has some specialized skills (body checking, winning battles in corners, overall physicality without taking penalties) that can be very useful in the ATD.

Edit: I think ordering this group of LWs will be a very interesting part of the HOH Top Wingers project, if that ever happens.

 

[BraveCanadian]

I think Bucyk is a clear step down from them as an overall player. Keeping in mind that Bucyk is one of those long-career, relatively low peak guys that others might rate higher than me.

But Bucyk has some specialized skills (body checking, winning battles in corners, overall physicality without taking penalties) that can be very useful in the ATD.

I think his offense is a bit overstated by vsx for obvious reasons but his longevity is awesome and being able to be physical without the drawbacks of doing so are very nice to haves as well..

Even straight up removing some seasons for vsx he will be stronger than many left wingers all around.