Speculation: any Sabres deals NOT Eichel

[Perennial]

I would personally pay for their plane tickets. no way Detroit take that

DET does not deal Larkin he's like a favorite son.

Whether they would or whether they should are two different discussions

Given how bad the Red Wings are, I think it make sense to gamble on Cozens - who will be under team control for what, 7 years? - rather than holding onto Larkin during the rebuild when he's only got 3 more years left until UFA

 

[StephenPeat]

Well this is utter nonsense.

I mean you don’t have to like it but don’t deny you see it. For you it’s an inconvenient truth, but a truth nonetheless.

There is not a single player on that team outside the two named that is anything more than second-rate with major question marks and a history as a loser. Reinhart? Skinner? Ristolainen? Who’s paying a premium for these players? Name them, I challenge you to show what, about anything I’ve said, is demonstrably incorrect.

 

[Snowman]

I'd like to see Roslovic and Perreault from the Jets for Ristolainen. Sabres have a glut of RHD. Ristolainen fills the hole that Buff left, in terms of size and offense/puck movement. Roslovic might be the kind of winger to get Eichel past the 100 pt mark, as he is a good hard working player that isn't getting top 6 minutes or much PP time in Winnipeg. Perreault is a cap dump, but can be a serviceable top 9 player. Makes room for other young players coming up the pipeline in Winnipeg.

I would hope the Jets aren't interested in Ristolainen at all. He's exactly the type of defensemen we don't need in the least.

 

[voyageur]

I would hope the Jets aren't interested in Ristolainen at all. He's exactly the type of defensemen we don't need in the least.

I am not sure why you would say that. Currently the Jets have 2 defensemen who can confidently log over 20 minutes of ice time in a night. He's big, which the Jets defense isn't (remember he separated Lowry's shoulder with a hit?). He can move the puck and get up the ice. The Jets coaching had to simplify their game this year, because of the lack of defensive talent. He can QB a PP. Which gives options beyond Pionk. He can kill penalties, which will keep Pionk off the PK. And he is signed at a good price, if he can get his career turned around. Given all the reclamation projects the Jets used last year, I think Ristolainen would go a lot further under Huddy's coaching.

 

[TheDawnOfANewTage]

I mean you don’t have to like it but don’t deny you see it. For you it’s an inconvenient truth, but a truth nonetheless.

There is not a single player on that team outside the two named that is anything more than second-rate with major question marks and a history as a loser. Reinhart? Skinner? Ristolainen? Who’s paying a premium for these players? Name them, I challenge you to show what, about anything I’ve said, is demonstrably incorrect.

your post:

Let’s try a cute exercise as the REST OF THE LEAGUE. Name a player not Eichel or Dahlin who you’d pay ANYTHING AT ALL for. If you cannot do so, assume Eichel AND Dahlin will be on the block. It’s only a matter of time.

The players are NOT GOOD. The drafting has been NOT GOOD. The development is NOT GOOD. The Sabres are the NorthEast Edmonton Oilers but they cycle more rapidly.

you said “anything at all” so you’ve already moved your goalposts- that’s nonsense. Your argument is malleable, shifting, nonsense.

Second, your assumption that Eichel and Dahlin will be on the block because we don’t have other good players is just logically faulty. Like, no, we’d just hold onto those players either way. You’ve presented a false either/or scenario, where we either need to already have good players around those guys or we need to trade them- no, that’d be stupid. It’s like saying since you don’t have a coffee table you must sell your couch. Nonsense, keep the couch and find a way to get a coffee table.

so basically- you present hyperbole, shifting goalposts, and false choices. In other words, nonsense.

 

[Snowman]

I am not sure why you would say that. Currently the Jets have 2 defensemen who can confidently log over 20 minutes of ice time in a night. He's big, which the Jets defense isn't (remember he separated Lowry's shoulder with a hit?). He can move the puck and get up the ice. The Jets coaching had to simplify their game this year, because of the lack of defensive talent. He can QB a PP. Which gives options beyond Pionk. He can kill penalties, which will keep Pionk off the PK. And he is signed at a good price, if he can get his career turned around. Given all the reclamation projects the Jets used last year, I think Ristolainen would go a lot further under Huddy's coaching.

The thing is he can't really log over 20 minutes a night. That's his problem. When he plays that much he's terrible. With Pionk on the right and if we re-sign Demelo as speculated, that makes Ristolainen a very expensive bottom pairing D-man. He's basically another Tyler Myers. We were all so excited when Vancouver took Myers off our hands, I would hope the Jets wouldn't rush back in and trade for Tyler Myers 2.0.

 

[StephenPeat]

your post:




you said “anything at all” so you’ve already moved your goalposts- that’s nonsense. Your argument is malleable, shifting, nonsense.

Second, your assumption that Eichel and Dahlin will be on the block because we don’t have other good players is just logically faulty. Like, no, we’d just hold onto those players either way. You’ve presented a false either/or scenario, where we either need to already have good players around those guys or we need to trade them- no, that’d be stupid. It’s like saying since you don’t have a coffee table you must sell your couch. Nonsense, keep the couch and find a way to get a coffee table.

so basically- you present hyperbole, shifting goalposts, and false choices. In other words, nonsense.

I’ll simplify my narrative if it appeases you.
We’ve established: outside Eichel/Dahlin the Sabres DONT have Good Players.
With 3coaches/3GMs in 5 seasons, your own media are wondering why Eichel hasn’t “demanded” a trade.

Face it, if I ask you;
Who is your Coach/GM today?
What DECENT player on your team doesn’t have multiple, major question marks?
The follow-up is;
For which team will your star player be playing in 3 seasons? Or less?

You frame it as though the players are the only parallel to the Edmonton Oilers of late, the fact is the failures are systematic. The big difference is the Oilers are FWIW a playoff team today and the Sabres are sunk and floundering.

 

[Hunter368]

The thing is he can't really log over 20 minutes a night. That's his problem. When he plays that much he's terrible. With Pionk on the right and if we re-sign Demelo as speculated, that makes Ristolainen a very expensive bottom pairing D-man. He's basically another Tyler Myers. We were all so excited when Vancouver took Myers off our hands, I would hope the Jets wouldn't rush back in and trade for Tyler Myers 2.0.

Agreed. Much sooner sign DeMelo and keep our roster players then get Ristolainen.

 

[Big Muddy]

So this is the thread I offer tons of futures and unproven commodities for Dahlin right?

LOL. Probably. But don't forget to offer AJ/Kerfoot as part of (quantity) package. j/k

 

[SI]

The thing is he can't really log over 20 minutes a night. That's his problem. When he plays that much he's terrible. With Pionk on the right and if we re-sign Demelo as speculated, that makes Ristolainen a very expensive bottom pairing D-man. He's basically another Tyler Myers. We were all so excited when Vancouver took Myers off our hands, I would hope the Jets wouldn't rush back in and trade for Tyler Myers 2.0.

he doesn’t have too and neither does Pionk or Demelo.

Risto at EV strength, 2nd PP, 2nd unit PK

with Pionk at EV strength, 1st PP and off the Pk

with DeMelo as the shutdown pair and PK duties.

This roll out and distribution of minutes can be spread out. All of them avg. around 19-20. there will be some nights that one or two will go over because of special teams.

 

[Blitz]

I’ll simplify my narrative if it appeases you.
We’ve established: outside Eichel/Dahlin the Sabres DONT have Good Players.
With 3coaches/3GMs in 5 seasons, your own media are wondering why Eichel hasn’t “demanded” a trade.

Face it, if I ask you;
Who is your Coach/GM today?
What DECENT player on your team doesn’t have multiple, major question marks?
The follow-up is;
For which team will your star player be playing in 3 seasons? Or less?

You frame it as though the players are the only parallel to the Edmonton Oilers of late, the fact is the failures are systematic. The big difference is the Oilers are FWIW a playoff team today and the Sabres are sunk and floundering.

This is a deep heap of BS...
A) they have plenty of good players outside Eichel & Dahlin. Jokiharju, Skinner, Reinhart, Olofsson & even Montour would all be considered Good or better on ANY roster in this league.

B) The national media & other clueless talking heads, specifically in BOS ramped up the Eichel rumours after the house cleaning based on their total lack of knowledge of what was actually happening in the front office of a team they NEVER pay attention to. The team is changing direction in an attempt to win, not getting ready to fold.

C) The teams best player will be playing here for 7 more years as he signed a legally binding contract to do so. There is no question & he has no leverage unless he's willing to quit hockey... Demanding a trade gets you nowhere here, ask Risto's camp - lesson learned from RoR.
Plus the guys who hated playing under Housley seem to love playing for Ralph, Captain Jack included.

D) The Oilers missed the playoffs last 2 years and 9 of 10yrs prior to that dating back to '05/06, so stop acting like they're head & shoulders above this team... The parallels are quite similar. EDMs rebuild also started 4 years ahead of the Sabres when they drafted Hall (2010 vs Reinhart in 14).

Stop talking out yet @$$.

 

[Snowman]

he doesn’t have too and neither does Pionk or Demelo.

Risto at EV strength, 2nd PP, 2nd unit PK

with Pionk at EV strength, 1st PP and off the Pk

with DeMelo as the shutdown pair and PK duties.

This roll out and distribution of minutes can be spread out. All of them avg. around 19-20. there will be some nights that one or two will go over because of special teams.

Doesn't matter. Ristolainen is paid too much for the bottom pairing duty he is most suited for.

The Jets have a decent amount of cap space this summer, but not enough to waste cap space on a player we don't really need.

 

[FrolikFan67]

How would you guys describe montour’s all around game? Surprised to see he was a +18

 

[struckbyaparkedcar]

How would you guys describe montour’s all around game? Surprised to see he was a +18

Transition wizard who’d be really good if he had better instincts in either end.

As-is, he’s best suited to drive play on a third pairing and slot up the roster from time-to-time, because he doesn’t provide the offensive or defensive value to play a top four role in either direction.

 

[dkollidas]

Mittelstadt for Leddy?
I believe he could be a solid partner for Jokiharju on the 2nd pair abs handle some d-zone minutes.

 

[TheDawnOfANewTage]

I’ll simplify my narrative if it appeases you.
We’ve established: outside Eichel/Dahlin the Sabres DONT have Good Players.
With 3coaches/3GMs in 5 seasons, your own media are wondering why Eichel hasn’t “demanded” a trade.

Face it, if I ask you;
Who is your Coach/GM today?
What DECENT player on your team doesn’t have multiple, major question marks?
The follow-up is;
For which team will your star player be playing in 3 seasons? Or less?

You frame it as though the players are the only parallel to the Edmonton Oilers of late, the fact is the failures are systematic. The big difference is the Oilers are FWIW a playoff team today and the Sabres are sunk and floundering.

I didn’t ask you to simplify anything, just keep your argument consistent.

We haven’t established shit- you’re just arguing Sabres are bad and drawing false conclusions from that, I’m sitting back with popcorn because this shifting “narrative” is funny to me.

I’m well aware of Buffalo’s situation, thanks. I’m a fan of them after all. My question is why you feel the need to point all this out- like dude, I know. As to where my star players will be in 3 years? Hopefully Buffalo. Maybe somewhere else. It’s 3 years in the future, Nostradamus, idk what the hell I’m eating for lunch tomorrow.

Did I even mention the Oilers? What is your argument? Why are you invested in this? Has anyone ever been so far as to do like as?

Bottom line: Eichel is under contract. He has not requested a trade. Anything beyond that is your specious assumptions about what must or what will happen- and yet day after day Eichel remains a Sabre. Personally I’d say he goes at least halfway through next season before anything would ever happen, but once again, that’s getting into speculative territory- point is we simply don’t know.

 

[Unbiased Fan]

1. Sabres 1st, C Prospect & Ristolainen for Gaudreau (Flames Sign Hall)
2. Sam Reinhart for Ryan Johansen
3. Dominik Kahun & 3rd for Josh Anderson
4. 2nd & 4th 2021 for Andreas Johnsson
5. Sign Edmundson 3.75 x 3
6. Sign Tyson Barrie 6.5 x 5

Gaudreau - Eichel - Anderson
Skinner - Johansen - Oloffsson
Johnsson - Johansson - Vesey
Grigensons - Lazar - Larsson

Dahlin - Miller
Edmundson - Barrie
McCabe - Jokihariu

Not bad but I HATE the Tyson Barrie signing. They got Dahlin for the PP they need a dman who can defend.

 

[57special]

Mittelstadt is being overrated here, and I say this as a guy who was a CM fan. He's worth a late 1st at best, IMO, and maybe not in this draft that is pretty strong well into the first half of the second.

The guy has wonderful hands, vg vision and passing, decent size and speed, but until he actually puts them to use on a regular basis on the ice then he will be run over by those players who give their all every time they play. Maybe he will be a late bloomer...I don't know. He definitely is a boom or bust type. Don't seem him being effective on a checking line.

 

[tsujimoto74]

Mittelstadt is being overrated here, and I say this as a guy who was a CM fan. He's worth a late 1st at best, IMO, and maybe not in this draft that is pretty strong well into the first half of the second.

The guy has wonderful hands, vg vision and passing, decent size and speed, but until he actually puts them to use on a regular basis on the ice then he will be run over by those players who give their all every time they play. Maybe he will be a late bloomer...I don't know. He definitely is a boom or bust type. Don't seem him being effective on a checking line.

Mitts' problem isn't his effort level on the ice. It's 2 things, IMO: (1) his physical conditioning isn't at the level it needs to be yet. He was super physically immature when he was drafted, so it was pretty predictable that it might take a few seasons for him to get in NHL shape. Why he was rushed into the NHL before he got to that point... (2) He's not quite up to NHL speed yet. And I don't mean in a "he doesn't move fast enough" sense, more in a "he needs to make his decisions a half second sooner" sense. The first issue is perfectly fixable. The second is something some prospects get and some don't. Will Mitts?

 

[Perennial]

Cozens & #8 (+ Okposo) for Larkin
Cozens & #8 (+ Okposo) for Horvat

I think if you're Detroit or Vancouver, these would be deals you should begrudgingly accept

 

[TheDawnOfANewTage]

Doesn't matter. Ristolainen is paid too much for the bottom pairing duty he is most suited for.

The Jets have a decent amount of cap space this summer, but not enough to waste cap space on a player we don't really need.

Risto player 23 minutes a night to a -2 +/- on a bad Buffalo team. He’s really not that bad. Hopefully he can build off of last year.

Mittelstadt for Leddy?
I believe he could be a solid partner for Jokiharju on the 2nd pair abs handle some d-zone minutes.

Eh- good idea, but personally I feel like we’re gonna need more offense going into the future. So I’d rather have patience/foolish hope in Mitts for a bit longer or move him in a package for a forward.

Cozens & #8 (+ Okposo) for Larkin
Cozens & #8 (+ Okposo) for Horvat

I think if you're Detroit or Vancouver, these would be deals you should begrudgingly accept

Personally I don’t feel Sabres are in a long term position to deal Cozens and the #8. Cozens is developing well, no matter what we could really use him in the future. I’ve seen #8 for Domi mentioned, and I love that one. Otherwise something like #8+Montour for Larkin or Horvat? Sabres likely still have to add, and I just don’t see either of those teams being eager to make that deal- maybe Detroit if they really wanna have an insane prospect pool? But MTL seems more likely to move Domi, so..

 

[Perennial]

Risto player 23 minutes a night to a -2 +/- on a bad Buffalo team. He’s really not that bad. Hopefully he can build off of last year.



Eh- good idea, but personally I feel like we’re gonna need more offense going into the future. So I’d rather have patience/foolish hope in Mitts for a bit longer or move him in a package for a forward.




Personally I don’t feel Sabres are in a long term position to deal Cozens and the #8. Cozens is developing well, no matter what we could really use him in the future. I’ve seen #8 for Domi mentioned, and I love that one. Otherwise something like #8+Montour for Larkin or Horvat? Sabres likely still have to add, and I just don’t see either of those teams being eager to make that deal- maybe Detroit if they really wanna have an insane prospect pool? But MTL seems more likely to move Domi, so..

Assuming Dahlin is off limits, I can't imagine Detroit or Vancouver would consider dealing Larkin or Horvat without Cozens being the main piece going back

 

[TheDawnOfANewTage]

Assuming Dahlin is off limits, I can't imagine Detroit or Vancouver would consider dealing Larkin or Horvat without Cozens being the main piece going back

Exactly why I think those deals unlikely to happen. To me Cozens should be borderline untouchable, he’s a prospect who’s developing correctly and could become our much needed 2C. And unless Buffalo just offers up way too much of everything else (#8+Mitts+Montour+Thompson+etc.) I don’t see why DET or VAN go for it.

 

[Perennial]

Exactly why I think those deals unlikely to happen. To me Cozens should be borderline untouchable, he’s a prospect who’s developing correctly and could become our much needed 2C. And unless Buffalo just offers up way too much of everything else (#8+Mitts+Montour+Thompson+etc.) I don’t see why DET or VAN go for it.

Vancouver seems determined to be competitive right away, so I'm not sure they'd pull the trigger

Detroit, on the other hand, is years away from contending, so they might be a little more willing to deal Larkin

IF that's true, why would you hold onto Cozens in the hopes he can become your 2C, when you know Larkin would immediately thrive in that role?

 

[TheDawnOfANewTage]

Vancouver seemed determined to be competitive right away, so I'm not sure they'd pull the trigger

Detroit, on the other hand, is years away from contending, so they might be a little more willing to deal Larkin

IF that's true, why would you hold onto Cozens in the hopes he can become your 2C, when you know Larkin would immediately thrive in that role?

Because it’s not just Cozens for Larkin, it’s the #8 as well, and I worry the Sabres are more than one player away from a real return to relevancy.

It’s not the worst idea in the world, it’s just about whether you think the Sabres have enough else in place to make the deal worth it- and I don’t think they do. Larkin would maybe be enough to sneak into the playoffs, but personally I’d rather see if Cozens keeps developing well and then consider moving the pick alone or with Mittelstadt for a lesser piece. Just my take, but I see Sabres as a borderline team next year either way- too many holes to think Larkin alone would make the difference. But we have a goaltending prospect on the way in UPL, we have another year of development for Dahlin and our prospects- timing could be better if we just hold onto Cozens imo.