You can’t score when you’re not playing… because the whole league shutdown due to Covid? If we are talking about a pretty consistently injured player then sure but he played just as many games as the rest of the league. Thats just dismissing legitimately good seasons he had because it’d be detrimental to what you said.
Value of: Andrew Mangiapane
- Thread starter SeanMoneyHands
- Start date
Ledge And Dairy
Registered User
Declined? His actual production has bounced back quite significantly from last year and his EV scoring rate is higher than it was 2 years ago when he got 35 goals (0.53ppg this year vs 0.5ppg in 21/22). His total scoring would probably be higher if our powerplay wasn't constantly a complete waste of 2 minutes (3 PP points this year vs 11 in 21/22). The only thing that's actually "declined" in his play is his actual goal scoring rate. He's still got a powerful release (though it's never really been deceptive like a natural goal scorers is) but most of his goals that year were pretty greasy anyways. Coleman has simply gotten all the greasy goals on that line this year. He is still quite a valuable player with a wicked high compete level. You pretty much never get a lazy shift from him
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Nanuuk
Registered User
He hasn't declined at all except in his goal scoring. His career high was 55 points. He is on track for 46 points in this, a transition year for the team.
Yet with a new coach and substantial changes to the roster he keeps plugging along with a strong forecheck and checking game.
Only 43% of his zone starts are in the oZone and he has maintained a 50.7% CF at even strength. Admittedly that is down from his career average of 55.2%.
It can be argued that his last contract was a slight overpay, but not by much.
He can play both wings.
If the Flames do move him it will be because they have a number of left wingers and prospects. None at this point are better than Mangiapane.
I don't doubt, though, that a change of scenery is bad for any player that has been part of a team for a number of years.
If the Flames do trade him he would fetch a good return.
Good player but overpaid. Good at defense and can score timely goals. Every team likes that, he's just not scoring goals at obscene rates this year. Coleman is the finisher on that line now. Wouldn't be surprised if it swapped back next year though
Calgary would need to retain 50% to get a good return.
Calgary would need to retain 50% to get a good return.
Ledge And Dairy
Registered User
He's not overpaid, he is very fairly paid. Though I have no doubt Calgary would have to retain to get the return they want for him next year. He will probably go to a contender and have an strong playoffs due to his work ethic.
Coleman and Mangiapane play the exact same way, they both score by going to the net and getting greasy goals. Coleman's just happen to be going in this year whereas Mange's aren't. It could absolutely flip back next year
Ideally you want someone like him under 5 million. I'm sure any team would have given him the contract we gave him but he has slightly underperformed it in my opinion.
Lunatik
Registered User
- Oct 12, 2012
- 56,248
- 8,384
You don't get 2nd liners for under 5m any more. He is very slightly overpaid, he should be making about 5.25-5.5
Nanuuk
Registered User
Mangi has to get greasy in order to up his production. He needs to get in tight and a bit more feisty to be really effective scoring.
I'm not sure what his value is. It's kind of tough to project. Is he the excellent defensive winger his analytics say he is or is he a product of Backlund and Coleman? Probably a bit from each column honestly. He scores sometimes and plays greasy sometimes. He's in his mid to late 20s now, he shouldn't be as inconsistent as he is.
He'll have value at the TDL, but my guess is not much value in the offseason.
He'll have value at the TDL, but my guess is not much value in the offseason.
Man Bear Pig
Registered User
I wouldn't hate that swap for Liljegren. My problem would be term. Liljegren is going to be a cheap RHD for likely a few more years.You know it's bad when we actually agree.
I think Toronto and the Rangers could be possible suitors, something built around Lilli or Lindgren could make sense.
Djp
Registered User
Problem is his actual sslary.
Calgary likely nerdd to take back a high contract or get a 3rd team. A deadline at c25% of time left aa 3rd team retaining likelycists a 3rd. Itd more likely
Y c sd lgary gets a 2nd. 3rd team gets a 3td in a trade
Lunatik
Registered User
- Oct 12, 2012
- 56,248
- 8,384
y'all seem unhappy with Norris and his contract, what about a swap of Mangiapane for Norris? Flames take teh risk but could possibly get a better player long-term.
Tat's fair, but I do think Mangiapane has more value, so I think that balances it out.
Nanuuk
Registered User
I was just reading a pretty good analysis of Mangiapanes' play on another fan website.
Some salient points from the article and fan comments.
Mangiapane's point are all from 5v5 play. He sees no power play time.
Playing on the third line, the shutdown line. he is always on the ice against other teams top lines with the role of trying to shut them down first, score second.
The majority of his starts are in the defensive zone.
In 2022-23, he had on again, off again shoulder problems and had post season surgery.
Often it may take a year, even for athletes, to fully recover from a surgery like this.
So, it makes it very hard to evaluate his true value I would say.
Some salient points from the article and fan comments.
Mangiapane's point are all from 5v5 play. He sees no power play time.
Playing on the third line, the shutdown line. he is always on the ice against other teams top lines with the role of trying to shut them down first, score second.
The majority of his starts are in the defensive zone.
In 2022-23, he had on again, off again shoulder problems and had post season surgery.
Often it may take a year, even for athletes, to fully recover from a surgery like this.
So, it makes it very hard to evaluate his true value I would say.
mattihp
Registered User
HighLifeMan
#SnowyStrong
- Feb 26, 2009
- 7,297
- 2,468
Doesn't do much for Calgary.
Not interested in the three additional years on the player who's three years older. I'd personally just move Mangiapane at the deadline next year with retention for picks.
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