Coach Discussion: All-purpose Coach discussion thread

[JetsWillFly4Ever]

Nah, Fluery started to faulted pretty bad and Murray is just sitting there waiting to go back in. It’d be like use riding Bro while Helly was hurt and then when Bro faulters we have our actual starter just waiting.

Yeah that same series where they were down 2 games to 1 and Fleury was crapping the bed and the Sens were handily outshooting them and exposing Fleury and Murray, their starter for most of the season, returned from injury and played and led them to a Cup final. Wow great coaching.

So if Hellebuyck goes down and Brossoit some how gets us to the WCF and Brossoit is crapping the bed and we are down in a series and Helle returns from injury, you think Mo would keep rolling with Brossoit?

This comparing Brossoit to Fleury is disingenuous. Fleury the guy who already led the team to a cup, who had been a long time starter, who finished with a .924 save percentage in the playoffs is not the same as comparing a tiny sample size of Brossoit being good.

Hell, Murray prob would have never gotten the starting job over Fleury in the first place if Maurice was the coach.

 

[AKAChip]

Entire season is a stretch. Entire calendar year? For sure. He certainly makes questionable line up decisions.

It’s both lineup and deployment decisions. What is the benefit of putting a badly struggling Scheifele and Wheeler out with a minute left up a goal against Chicago? That’s not even mentioning the things he does that are stupid but don’t result in a goal against.

 

[Daximus]

Now I know you're reaching. Lol. A 36-year old Selanne, two 2nd-year players in Getzlaf and Perry, and McDonald, Kunitz, Penner and Moen is your argument for the best roster ever assembled in the cap era? I guess our definition of great players/rosters differs.

A 36 year old Selanne that was coming off a 48 goal, 94 point season. And a 21 year old Getzlaf and Perry that were one and two in playoff scoring, while Selanne was 3rd, on their team and all 3 top 10 among all teams.

Come on dude. You also convincingly leave off two of the best defencemen of the era in Pronger and Neidermeyer.

 

[thegr8one66]

I mean just look at that damn team. Three - 40 goal scorers. The best PP in the league by a country mile. They haven't changed a damn thing about it all year, you just can't stop it. One of the best if not the best two-way defencemen in the league. The best winger in the league by a fair margin. And a top 3 PK led by Cirelli, one of the most underrated two-way centers in the game right now. Easily the best depth in the league and by far the best young goalie in the league.

And a good coach gettting the most out of that squad!

 

[Daximus]

Acquiring Hendricks is a mistake that Chevy made but he absolutely does not force Maurice to play him.

I think the only reason Hendy played at all was to give Roslovic a break.

 

[Duke749]

Now I know you're reaching. Lol. A 36-year old Selanne, two 2nd-year players in Getzlaf and Perry, and McDonald, Kunitz, Penner and Moen is your argument for the best roster ever assembled in the cap era? I guess our definition of great players/rosters differs.

Yeh, a 36 year old 48 goal scorer with 94 points, a 2nd year Getz with 58 points, a 69 point hall of fame defenseman, with a 59 point Pronger.

Also, Getz led the team in the playoffs with 17 points and Perry was tied for second with 15 with Selanne and Pronger.

 

[Duke749]

It’s both lineup and deployment decisions. What is the benefit of putting a badly struggling Scheifele and Wheeler out with a minute left up a goal against Chicago? That’s not even mentioning the things he does that are stupid but don’t result in a goal against.

AND WITH CONNOR!?!?!? He benched Ehlers who is better defensively and has elevated those two but left Connor out there?!? Wtf?

 

[Daximus]

And a good coach gettting the most out of that squad!

Yzerman deserves waaaay more credit than Cooper. Whats funny is you go on the Lightning board and they to moan and whine about his roster decisions. No one is ever happy.

 

[AKAChip]

AND WITH CONNOR!?!?!? He benched Ehlers who is better defensively and has elevated those two but left Connor out there?!? Wtf?

Right. Maurice has coached in the NHL for over 20 years and he still hasn’t figured out the simplest things.

 

[Gotaf7]

A great roster is going to find a way to win a Cup regardless of the coach most of the time. We need to take a long hard look at the players on this team before we fire the coach. We may not be as good as we think.

100% this, sometimes things on paper look different on the ice! Player personnel changes are needed, what you see is what we are flipping the mythical playoff switch is not going to change a thing.

 

[AKAChip]

I think the only reason Hendy played at all was to give Roslovic a break.

I mean, if that is the reason it’s a really terrible one. If you need to give a guy a break, play someone who can actually keep up at this level. Hell, Lindholm is a better option.

 

[Duke749]

This comparing Brossoit to Fleury is disingenuous. Fleury the guy who already led the team to a cup, who had been a long time starter, who finished with a .924 save percentage in the playoffs is not the same as comparing a tiny sample size of Brossoit being good.

Hell, Murray prob would have never gotten the starting job over Fleury in the first place if Maurice was the coach.

I wasn’t comparing the two. Just illustrating the point.

You should check out Fluery’s playoff numbers. He has largely been inconsistent.

 

[Daximus]

I mean, if that is the reason it’s a really terrible one. If you need to give a guy a break, play someone who can actually keep up at this level. Hell, Lindholm is a better option.

Lindholm is pretty much the same player, he's just nicer to watch because he's faster. Lindholms best season is equivalent to a 36 year old Hendricks...

 

[thegr8one66]

Well I suppose you can give a guy credit for putting his best player on the ice in a clutch situation. I guess he didn't put him on the penalty kill so there is some credit too. Wish I got credit at work for the stupid things I didn't do.

But the two examples you just gave states Quenville did do something. Yet you want credit for things you didn't do.

 

[JetsWillFly4Ever]

I wasn’t comparing the two. Just illustrating the point.

You should check out Fluery’s playoff numbers. He has largely been inconsistent.

You definitely were comparing, you said 'it'd be like', that is clearly comparing.

But yes, Fleury's playoff numbers leave a lot to be desired for sure. That being said he was great in those playoffs and had 1/2 bad games and the coach went back to a fresh off injury Murray. Maurice doesn't have much of a history of making decisions like that imo.

 

[Daximus]

But the two examples you just gave states Quenville did do something. Yet you want credit for things you didn't do.

I mean I didn't drop an I-Beam and kill 6 people the other day. Way to go me!!! You don't get credit for putting Kane out on the ice and him scoring a goal. That is all Kane.

 

[thegr8one66]

For the record, I do think coaches have an effect. But I think the effect is largely overstated. Coaches are like supplements. There are good ones and bad ones like there are good brands and bad brands. But the difference between a good brand and another good brand is largely minimal with only minor differences. But they are still just supplements and they only assist in your goals whether it be weight loss, muscle gain, or whatever. The real player is your diet. And like your team’s roster, your diet is doing the bulk of the work while the supplements are just assisting you in your goal similar to a coach.

I agree. Just imagine if we had a great brand of supplement to use (instead of our current bad supplement) and how much stronger we could be!

 

[Daximus]

You definitely were comparing, you said 'it'd be like', that is clearly comparing.

But yes, Fleury's playoff numbers leave a lot to be desired for sure. That being said he was great in those playoffs and had 1/2 bad games and the coach went back to a fresh off injury Murray. Maurice doesn't have much of a history of making decisions like that imo.

When has he ever had two Vezina calibre goalies to make that decision?

 

[Daximus]

I agree. Just imagine if we had a great brand of supplement to use (instead of our current bad supplement) and how much stronger we could be!

I think we need to look much longer and much harder at our diet. We have some fat that isn't pulling it's weight on the ice.

 

[thegr8one66]

He’s their best player. What exactly is any coach supposed to do with Kane on their roster? Not play him in critical situations?

He's supposed to do exactly what he did: make sure Kane was playing the right amount of ice tiem to not burn him out, play him with linemates that compliment his style, and instill a game plan that utilizes his talents.

 

[Duke749]

You definitely were comparing, you said 'it'd be like', that is clearly comparing.

But yes, Fleury's playoff numbers leave a lot to be desired for sure. That being said he was great in those playoffs and had 1/2 bad games and the coach went back to a fresh off injury Murray. Maurice doesn't have much of a history of making decisions like that imo.

Fluery was their backup. Bro is our backup. Fluery put up subpar numbers all season. He put up a .909 SV% that year. We really need to stop pretending what he did was predictable. It wasn’t.

 

[JetsWillFly4Ever]

When has he ever had two Vezina calibre goalies to make that decision?

Well not directly, but how often does he change things when they are going generally well? How often does he go back to the tried and true guy (Fleury) instead of the younger up and coming guy (Murray). Yes I realize that in this case Murray was already a cup winner, but how did Murray get the job in the first place? Would Paul ever bench someone who has proven to give good performances for someone who is young and up and coming ? Fleury was .921 and .920 in the two seasons before Murray took the job.

 

[Duke749]

He's supposed to do exactly what he did: make sure Kane was playing the right amount of ice tiem to not burn him out, play him with linemates that compliment his style, and instill a game plan that utilizes his talents.

Yeh you’re starting to really reach here.

 

[Daximus]

He's supposed to do exactly what he did: make sure Kane was playing the right amount of ice tiem to not burn him out, play him with linemates that compliment his style, and instill a game plan that utilizes his talents.

With Kane you don't have to do much. Make sure he doesn't see much defensive zone starts and never play him on the PK if you don't have too. Any coach would do similar things with Kane. Unless they are a complete dumbass. You are giving far to much credit to something that every coach and fan would do in the same situation.

 

[Daximus]

Yeh you’re starting to really reach here.

Don't you know that firing Maurice will magically make everyone better?