Prospect Info: 2024 NHL Draft Thread

[Captain3rdLine]

Totally fine with drafting IQ above everything else. That's always my MO but especially now.

You don't have time to wait for players like Holtz to get it anymore. Precocious is the way.

Was Holtz considered iffy on the IQ scale pre draft? I feel that became a narrative(that competed with the skating narrative) as he struggled to find his footing in the NHL.

Ya not at all. Holtz’s IQ was literally one of his strengths. High IQ goalscorer.

The problem with “drafting IQ above everything else” is that it is by far the hardest thing to evaluate. Especially with so many guys playing in so many different leagues, at different levels, on different teams with different systems. Ridiculously hard and so situational. A guy can be a really smart player who all of the sudden with slightly less time at a higher level struggles to keep up with the pace of play and make decisions quick enough.

 

[Captain3rdLine]

Holtz always had a decent IQ but it wasn't exactly his calling card. He was drafted for his bread and butter, which is obviously goal scoring. What I liked about Holtz in his draft year was that the rest of his game was solid across the board, and I felt he possessed better passing vision than a lot of folks credited him for. However, I didn't have him as a top 10 pick like most of the consensus; I had him about even with Dawson Mercer just outside the top 10.

But his goalscoring was largely due in part to his IQ. Not just his shot. He was good at going to the right areas and knowing how to get open and score. That’s IQ. And as you said he had pretty good passing vision. Overall he was a pretty smart player and a lot of scouting reports from that draft said that. He certainly didn’t have low-IQ like the other poster was suggesting even if he’s had some trouble adjusting to NHL pace since.

 

[Guadana]

Totally fine with drafting IQ above everything else. That's always my MO but especially now.

You don't have time to wait for players like Holtz to get it anymore. Precocious is the way.

You hope Lenni is a player and then someone like Helenius or whoever is as well. I don't think we can afford to miss on this pick / trade from a cap perspective.

All skills should be average at least. For example Lenny is below average in skating and it pushes him away from guarantee category. Gusev is one of the smartest players, it was a reason he produced 44 points in 66 games in his first season, but couldnt stay in NHL as a regular. But when most skills are average or above average with high IQ - it make a player very interesting with higher potential. In case of Helenius we have very smart player o=in all three zones. Nygard is smart player too. Helenius is more creative in playmaking, Nygard is more accurate and process the game a bit faster - better skating and starting speed helps.

Tij Iginla looks like a guy projected to go somewhere around where we pick.

Love the goal heavy stat line, love the blood lines, and he's an Aug b-day so young for draft which I'm always a fan of.

OK size, not a big guy but given his dad I wouldn't be surprised if he played a physical game, no idea about his skating. I assume he'll be a winger at the pro level?


Was Holtz considered iffy on the IQ scale pre draft? I feel that became a narrative(that competed with the skating narrative) as he struggled to find his footing in the NHL.

Problem with Iginla is his IQ. He is focusing on the puck or on his player, he is losing position, he isnt good for same reasons in D zone. Without separation speed it creates more questions about his ceiling and his role overall.

 

[Guadana]

I wrote up Tij Iginla, it's probably a page or two back on this thread. He's a good but not great skater, and he's about average size for a winger, but he's very strong pound for pound. He's quite competitive and tenacious, but not proactively physical like his father was back in the day.

Holtz always had a decent IQ but it wasn't exactly his calling card. He was drafted for his bread and butter, which is obviously goal scoring. What I liked about Holtz in his draft year was that the rest of his game was solid across the board, and I felt he possessed better passing vision than a lot of folks credited him for. However, I didn't have him as a top 10 pick like most of the consensus; I had him about even with Dawson Mercer just outside the top 10.

Holtz was smart with and without the puck in O zone - passing game, finding open space, his board game was average at best for his age - positional and physical, his position game in d zone, his positioning against transition was not so good. So I cant name him consistently smart player. So there are no surprises why he isnt solid NHLer still. He learn the game on the fly.

 

[Hockey Sports Fan]

Once you get outside the top 2 or 3 forwards, everyone will be lacking in some elite skill. If Helenius had elite skating or hands or a shot, we'd have no chance of drafting him. But his IQ gives him a very high floor, and as someone who has basically no chance at playing top-6 center minutes with the Devils, that intrigues me the most. I really like a guy that's productive WITHOUT elite phsyical tools. And to be honest I think that's one of the elements missing the most in the Devils' current lineup.

 

[devilsblood]

I wrote up Tij Iginla, it's probably a page or two back on this thread. He's a good but not great skater, and he's about average size for a winger, but he's very strong pound for pound. He's quite competitive and tenacious, but not proactively physical like his father was back in the day.

Holtz always had a decent IQ but it wasn't exactly his calling card. He was drafted for his bread and butter, which is obviously goal scoring. What I liked about Holtz in his draft year was that the rest of his game was solid across the board, and I felt he possessed better passing vision than a lot of folks credited him for. However, I didn't have him as a top 10 pick like most of the consensus; I had him about even with Dawson Mercer just outside the top 10.

Looks like there are multiple goal scorers in our range, if we want to lean that way. Tij, Eiserman, maybe Lindstrom.

Lindstrom looks higher on most boards I'm guessing based on size, but it looks like he missed some games, so I'm wary of that.

Wonder when Tij was measured, and as a young guy, wonder if he has a bit more room to grow.

 

[devilsblood]

Once you get outside the top 2 or 3 forwards, everyone will be lacking in some elite skill. If Helenius had elite skating or hands or a shot, we'd have no chance of drafting him. But his IQ gives him a very high floor, and as someone who has basically no chance at playing top-6 center minutes with the Devils, that intrigues me the most. I really like a guy that's productive WITHOUT elite phsyical tools. And to be honest I think that's one of the elements missing the most in the Devils' current lineup.

Mercer and Nico?

 

[Hockey Sports Fan]

Mercer and Nico?

If you're asking if I'd want more Nicos and Mercers on the Devils roster, I would have to say that I do!

But I actually don't think either of those players have exceptionally high IQs, I think for them it's more about their work ethic. If Hischier really had an elite IQ he'd be Bergeron already, and we haven't really seen that level of game control from him. I seem him as more of a Ryan O'Reilly type.

 

[devilsblood]

If you're asking if I'd want more Nicos and Mercers on the Devils roster, I would have to say that I do!

But I actually don't think either of those players have exceptionally high IQs, I think for them it's more about their work ethic. If Hischier really had an elite IQ he'd be Bergeron already, and we haven't really seen that level of game control from him. I seem him as more of a Ryan O'Reilly type.

Thought they were examples of guys on the roster who produce without elite physical tools.

 

[Hockey Sports Fan]

Thought they were examples of guys on the roster who produce without elite physical tools.

What elite physical tools do you think they have? Maybe this is where we're disagreeing.

 

[devilsblood]

What elite physical tools do you think they have? Maybe this is where we're disagreeing.

I don't think they have elite physical tools.

 

[Captain3rdLine]

But his IQ gives him a very high floor,

Don’t agree with this statement at all. Seemiing like an intelligent player at a lower level does not give you a high NHL floor whatsoever.

 

[Oneiro]

Ya not at all. Holtz’s IQ was literally one of his strengths. High IQ goalscorer.

The problem with “drafting IQ above everything else” is that it is by far the hardest thing to evaluate. Especially with so many guys playing in so many different leagues, at different levels, on different teams with different systems. Ridiculously hard and so situational. A guy can be a really smart player who all of the sudden with slightly less time at a higher level struggles to keep up with the pace of play and make decisions quick enough.

Fair argument at the end re: translating IQ, but regardless of whatever pre-draft profiles said, Holtz was a tools pick. As in the shot is why he was selected, unlike Mercer, Hameenaho, etc. Nothing else in his game was very standout - yes he had some playmaking and he got into soft areas easily against players at or close to his age but no one was looking at those things in a team context.

 

[Hockey Sports Fan]

I don't think they have elite physical tools.

apology accepted

 

[Guadana]

I hope Fitz will not pick between Iginla and Eiserman, because if it’s his vision of players from the draft and roster issues, we’re stucked.
I hope Fitz will have Lindstrom as an option to pick, but only hope can help this come true.

 

[Davegarri]

Hopefully we just win the lottery lol I don't really care for a lot of these guys all that much

 

[ZachaFlockaFlame]

I hope Fitz will not pick between Iginla and Eiserman, because if it’s his vision of players from the draft and roster issues, we’re stucked.
I hope Fitz will have Lindstrom as an option to pick, but only hope can help this come true.

Eiserman would be another admission of liking the Holtz pick in theory but the player just didn't work out. I don't think they'll go for a guy like that again. They're gonna try to go for a power forward or flat out scorer to be next to Bratt/Jack for the next decade. I don't think Eiserman is where he would look to

 

[devilsblood]

I hope Fitz will not pick between Iginla and Eiserman, because if it’s his vision of players from the draft and roster issues, we’re stucked.
I hope Fitz will have Lindstrom as an option to pick, but only hope can help this come true.

Is you’re concern the respective players? Or Fitz’s vision?

Eiserman would be another admission of liking the Holtz pick in theory but the player just didn't work out. I don't think they'll go for a guy like that again. They're gonna try to go for a power forward or flat out scorer to be next to Bratt/Jack for the next decade. I don't think Eiserman is where he would look to

Isn’t Eiserman a flat out scorer?

 

[ZachaFlockaFlame]

Is you’re concern the respective players? Or Fitz’s vision?


Isn’t Eiserman a flat out scorer?

Ah shit, forgot to add with respectable defensive game as well but I was typing too fast lol. Eiserman's bit of a dunce so I don't see him being an option

 

[Guttersniped]

Trevor Connelly rockets up @My3Sons draft board with this hit in the U18 gold medal game:



Canada scored 3 power play goals during Conelly’s 5 minute major and won 6-4.

Canada this is Canada’s 3rd Gold Medal in the last 15 U18 Tournaments, they don’t dominate it like the U20 because of the CHL playoffs. (They also have 4 Bronze Medals, and no Silver, in those 15 tournaments.)

 

[My3Sons]

Trevor Connelly rockets up @My3Sons draft board with this hit in the U18 gold medal game:



Canada scored 3 power play goals during Conelly’s 5 minute major and won 6-4.

Canada this is Canada’s 3rd Gold Medal in the last 15 U18 Tournaments, they don’t dominate it like the U20 because of the CHL playoffs. (They also have 4 Bronze Medals, and no Silver, in those 15 tournaments.)

Is the guy who was hit one of the other team’s best players?

 

[StevenToddIves]

Looks like there are multiple goal scorers in our range, if we want to lean that way. Tij, Eiserman, maybe Lindstrom.

Lindstrom looks higher on most boards I'm guessing based on size, but it looks like he missed some games, so I'm wary of that.

Wonder when Tij was measured, and as a young guy, wonder if he has a bit more room to grow.

Out of Lindstrom, Eiserman and Iginla it's an easy call for Lindstrom -- however there's also no chance the Devils can get him unless some lottery luck moves them up to the #2 or #3 overall slot.

Here's the easy breakdown. Eiserman -- by far -- has the best shot of the three, and he's probably about even with Iginla in skating and passing vision. In any other quality you would rate players by, he's last of the three, and in many cases by a country mile (defensive play, compete level, physical play).

Lindstrom is by far the best skater of the the three, by far the best when it comes to hockey IQ and compete level, by far the biggest, strongest and most proactively physical, the only center of the three but can also play wing, the most complete in his offensive skill set and the best 200-foot player of the three.

It's not close, Lindstrom has to be considered the best prospect of these three.

Then, when it comes to Eiserman vs. Iginla? Well, Eiserman certainly has more upside, simply based on his immense goalscoring potential. But Eiserman's scouting card is also filled with red flags, whereas Iginla -- also a terrific goalscorer though not in Eiserman's league -- has no red flags to speak of. Iginla is a very high floor kid -- he'll make the NHL no matter what, the question is will he be a high scoring 2nd line winger, or a 3rd line grinder who can pop in more points than the average 3rd line grinder?

With Eiserman there is a lot more projection. One cannot deny his potential to one day lead the league in goals, but one also must factor in how far he is from that ultimate talent ceiling. Right now his 200-foot game and general decision making are basically not even at the level of an average 7th round pick, much less a top 10 pick. This is a kid with a lot to learn and a long way to go, and therefore he's a scary pick early in a draft.

I would take Lindstrom #3 overall, after only Celebrini and Demidov.

Iginla is a good pick in the 10-20 range, though I would also add he would be a good pick for Calgary at #9 due to obvious reasons.

Eiserman? I would certainly take a chance on his immense upside if I were picking in the late teens and he fell that far. But I couldn't justify taking him in the first dozen picks because there will simply be better hockey players available. Eiserman hasn't really proven to be a hockey player yet, he's just sub-par everywhere but in the offensive zone in space, where he admittedly becomes an instant scoring machine.

Is the guy who was hit one of the other team’s best players?

Connelly is a tremendous talent who is unfortunately also the Tony DeAngelo of this draft, character-wise. I'll write him up later, but he would be on my no-draft list if I were an NHL GM due to the obvious character concerns.

 

[My3Sons]

Out of Lindstrom, Eiserman and Iginla it's an easy call for Lindstrom -- however there's also no chance the Devils can get him unless some lottery luck moves them up to the #2 or #3 overall slot.

Here's the easy breakdown. Eiserman -- by far -- has the best shot of the three, and he's probably about even with Iginla in skating and passing vision. In any other quality you would rate players by, he's last of the three, and in many cases by a country mile (defensive play, compete level, physical play).

Lindstrom is by far the best skater of the the three, by far the best when it comes to hockey IQ and compete level, by far the biggest, strongest and most proactively physical, the only center of the three but can also play wing, the most complete in his offensive skill set and the best 200-foot player of the three.

It's not close, Lindstrom has to be considered the best prospect of these three.

Then, when it comes to Eiserman vs. Iginla? Well, Eiserman certainly has more upside, simply based on his immense goalscoring potential. But Eiserman's scouting card is also filled with red flags, whereas Iginla -- also a terrific goalscorer though not in Eiserman's league -- has no red flags to speak of. Iginla is a very high floor kid -- he'll make the NHL no matter what, the question is will he be a high scoring 2nd line winger, or a 3rd line grinder who can pop in more points than the average 3rd line grinder?

With Eiserman there is a lot more projection. One cannot deny his potential to one day lead the league in goals, but one also must factor in how far he is from that ultimate talent ceiling. Right now his 200-foot game and general decision making are basically not even at the level of an average 7th round pick, much less a top 10 pick. This is a kid with a lot to learn and a long way to go, and therefore he's a scary pick early in a draft.

I would take Lindstrom #3 overall, after only Celebrini and Demidov.

Iginla is a good pick in the 10-20 range, though I would also add he would be a good pick for Calgary at #9 due to obvious reasons.

Eiserman? I would certainly take a chance on his immense upside if I were picking in the late teens and he fell that far. But I couldn't justify taking him in the first dozen picks because there will simply be better hockey players available. Eiserman hasn't really proven to be a hockey player yet, he's just sub-par everywhere but in the offensive zone in space, where he admittedly becomes an instant scoring machine.


Connelly is a tremendous talent who is unfortunately also the Tony DeAngelo of this draft, character-wise. I'll write him up later, but he would be on my no-draft list if I were an NHL GM due to the obvious character concerns.

If that’s the guy who essentially admitted to a racist past I’d rather he go somewhere else .

 

[evnted]

Trevor Connelly rockets up @My3Sons draft board with this hit in the U18 gold medal game:



Canada scored 3 power play goals during Conelly’s 5 minute major and won 6-4.

Canada this is Canada’s 3rd Gold Medal in the last 15 U18 Tournaments, they don’t dominate it like the U20 because of the CHL playoffs. (They also have 4 Bronze Medals, and no Silver, in those 15 tournaments.)

ive tried to bite my tongue on the player since i wont be ranking him anyway, but what a pitiful performance in the playoff rounds. sure, he had a good game against norway and secured his highlight reel michigan goal against latvia (in a 6-1 3rd period...), but the last few games exhibited nothing but forced, low iq plays and outright selfishness. feel bad for team usa, and particularly someone like hagens who went superman mode. especially frustrating considering connelly was an "outsider" insomuch as the ntdp specifically invited him to join this group for the tournament

while on the topic, eiserman, in spite of breaking caufield's record, was also very disappointing in this tournament. struggled to get shots through at even strength (particularly today), constant cheating, lots of low percentage entry attempts failed, decent passing ideas squandered by misfires into the player's skates or just behind them. he had one play today where he went about 3 feet offside and just...stood there, there was no attempt to tag up and let bednarik come in onside. dont think ive seen that before. i agree with all the praise of his scoring upside (and i largely expect eiserman will be a superb college scorer), but i have next to no interest in us undertaking this project

the stiga-hagens-ziemer trio and most of the US defense core (particularly emery) definitely deserved a better outcome today. but, to canada's credit, they stuck with that game. tij especially stood out to me today. i know his game can sometimes feel a little...simple or shoot-happy, but today i thought he showed off some excellent passing vision and greater overall awareness on the puck. his offensive zone retrieval and small area handling to set up mckenna for his first of the day was sublime

 

[StevenToddIves]

ive tried to bite my tongue on the player since i wont be ranking him anyway, but what a pitiful performance in the playoff rounds. sure, he had a good game against norway and secured his highlight reel michigan goal against latvia (in a 6-1 3rd period...), but the last few games exhibited nothing but forced, low iq plays and outright selfishness. feel bad for team usa, and particularly someone like hagens who went superman mode. especially frustrating considering connelly was an "outsider" insomuch as the ntdp specifically invited him to join this group for the tournament

while on the topic, eiserman, in spite of breaking caufield's record, was also very disappointing in this tournament. struggled to get shots through at even strength (particularly today), constant cheating, lots of low percentage entry attempts failed, decent passing ideas squandered by misfires into the player's skates or just behind them. he had one play today where he went about 3 feet offside and just...stood there, there was no attempt to tag up and let bednarik come in onside. dont think ive seen that before. i agree with all the praise of his scoring upside (and i largely expect eiserman will be a superb college scorer), but i have next to no interest in us undertaking this project

the stiga-hagens-ziemer trio and most of the US defense core (particularly emery) definitely deserved a better outcome today. but, to canada's credit, they stuck with that game. tij especially stood out to me today. i know his game can sometimes feel a little...simple or shoot-happy, but today i thought he showed off some excellent passing vision and greater overall awareness on the puck. his offensive zone retrieval and small area handling to set up mckenna for his first of the day was sublime

Yet another great performance by Tij Iginla makes it easier for Calgary to justify taking him at #9, where I think it's getting safer and safer to project him going.

Eiserman is clearly the wild card of this draft. I would not rule out a team taking him in the top 5, and I would also not rule out his falling out of the top 15 entirely. He's going to wreck a lot of mock drafts.

Connolly is interesting to project, draft-wise. I would say the mix of his inconsistent play and character concerns would knock him off several draft boards entirely, but there will also likely be a couple of teams who look at his raw skill set and have him ranked highly. We'll see how scared off teams are by the racism/character concerns come draft day. Personally, I see him dropping into the 20s despite the high-level skill set. And no, I would not draft Connolly if I were an NHL GM, no matter where he fell. The potential talent boon is just completely overshadowed by the potential s**tstorm.