The Real JT
No diving allowed
Overestimated: The prospect list
Underestimated: The value of first and second round draft picks on a team with a deficit of high end talent.
Prospect Info: 2023 Top Islanders Prospects - Final List
- Thread starter SI
- Start date
Underestimated: The value of first and second round draft picks on a team with a deficit of high end talent.
SI
Registered User
- Feb 16, 2013
- 7,715
- 3,982
It seems as if they did not include 2023 1st's or players who played in the NHL like Bolduc and Holmstrom.
The one thing I don't like about our list is that Jefferies and Finley are too low - they should be top 10.
At this point in the season (most especially in taking the current AHL seasons of several prospects into account), and with Bolduc and Holmstrom each now taking a regular NHL shift, the current list would likely be as follows:
1. Nelson, C, NCAA
2. Dufour, RW, 21, AHL
3. Finley, C/LW, NCAA
4. Iskhakov, LW, AHL
5. Gill, 20, QMJHL
6. Jefferies, RW, NCAA
7. Salo, LHD, AHL
8. Maggio, RW, AHL
9. Koivula, C, AHL
10. Berg, C, NCAA
***
11. Odelius, LHD, SHL
12. George, LHD, OHL
13. Malinen, LHD, Liiga
14. Nurmi, LW, Liiga
15. Lennox, G, AHL/ECHL
Naturally, everyone hopes that each of Odelius, George, and Nurmi will make big jumps in these rankings by the end of next season.
To be denoted is that Odelius and George have each signed their ELCs.
leeroggy
Registered User
- Jan 3, 2010
- 9,435
- 5,743
crashthenet
Registered User
- May 17, 2011
- 60,462
- 9,764
Long-term, for sure.
They're both just very hot right now scoring-wise down on the farm. That's my only real motivation for having either in the top 10. They're also approaching age 25, if they're not already.
I just like to get guys like them into lists like this because it might help whet the appetites of the NHL people who are surely reading these boards for insight.
Agreed, it’s the norm players get drafted finish their junior career then move to the A , learn the pro game then a decision is made if they are NHL ready. It seems many posters are ready to label them a bust if their not in the show in a year or two.
After a slow start, Dufour was gone for a good long while tending to family issues back home. He's been on a burner of late and is scoring one signature snipe after another in recent weeks. Up to 7 goals now, with many of them being exactly what we hope and expect of him.
As was surely expected by those who have been around the block, Maggio simply ain't all that yet. The jump to pro hockey has proven difficult for him, at least in establishing himself in a scoring capacity. He's had some good outings, but this is looking like one of those 10-12-22 style rookie campaigns with several stretches without much ice time. One thing no-one should forget is that he's 5'11" and really not the best skater. It's gonna take a while for him to learn how to get things done in this bone-cruncher of a league.
I've gotta once again say that it really is quite something how promising Dufour's 48-point rookie season was. You only get about 3 or 4 rookies per season coming straight out of the CHL or NCAA at age 21 and putting up numbers like that in the AHL.
The Real JT
No diving allowed
Way, way too early but so far Maggio has had a disappointing season considering his progression over the prior 2 years.
Both have plenty of time.
And Dmen generally need a heck of a lot more than forwards.
This said, Odelius was quiet in the HockeyAllsvenskan before getting hurt and I was watching a recent Djurgarden game in which they gave an update on his status, saying he's expected to be out until March. This disappointed me. I had been reckoning with early February.
Meanwhile, George isn't even on pace to tie the 22 points he had last season. This was supposed to be the year where he becomes a bonafide top 3 Dman for one of junior hockey's premiere franchises. Heck, even his +6 in 38 games pales in comparison to the +23 he's had the past few seasons.
MattMartin
Killer Instinct™
Uh, what's the issue with the trades? That's a weird one. I don't remember many if any brutal trades and mostly really good ones.
Pageau
Martin
Engvall
Horvat
Bortuzzo
Most on the way out were cap dumps or nothing much. The Toews trade obviously worked out the worst but he was the odd man out at the time and most believed it when he got traded. Now everyone will play MMQB and say they knew at the time Toews would become the next Lidstrom.
he chose to use a cba mechanism that backed the isles into a corner . Had he really wanted to remain with the Isles he would have given Lou more time to work with .
The Real JT
No diving allowed
32nd is a little harsh but our offseason signings of Engvall, Mayfield and Varly look good only to a handful of wide eyed Isles optimists. I wasn’t one of them and so far I’d say my take is on target.
Coulda, woulda, shoulda on guys like Toews and Verhaege. It’s fair to say that few people saw the ascension of those player’s careers. Still, why can’t we be the franchise with the astute scouting department that holds onto the promising prospects and dumps the ones that have hit a wall and will never make it?
Wouldn’t it have been nice if we cut bait on guys like MDC and Wally? Maybe we could have also traded Bailey and Beau while they actually had some value. In an ideal world who knows maybe there could’ve been some cap space cleared to allow Toews to be signed. Again, I’m not saying I ever saw that, but for once I’d love to be the franchise that has the top notch scouting foresight to make those type of astute decisions.
You're right, no-one saw Verhaege coming when he was a part-time ECHLer for this franchise.
He's done tremendously for himself and come a long, long way to be an impact player. Congrats to him!
But I think everyone knew Toews was a goodin' who would thrive in a number of situations around the league. No-one "wanted" him gone, but with a dead trade market at the worst point of the pandemic era, we knew the team could only keep two of Barzal, Pulock, and Toews. One had to go and his contract was going to be the cheapest of the three, thus he could bring something back.
Sure, we would have loved seeing Leddy moved instead, but there was aboslutely no market for him and that contract.
I think that's what this franchise thought it was doing by picking up Engvall.
For what it's worth, I had Wahlstrom involved in every imaginable fantasy trade scenario for Laine back in the day (along with other good stuff) when it was clear that Winnipeg was gonna have to part ways with him.
But I also sat around here right from his draft day making the regular claim that he'd = Boeser and Dobson would = Pietrangelo. At least I'm looking to have been 50% correct with those statements.
The Real JT
No diving allowed
I think that's what this franchise thought it was doing by picking up Engvall.
For what it's worth, I had Wahlstrom involved in every imaginable fantasy trade scenario for Laine back in the day (along with other good stuff) when it was clear that Winnipeg was gonna have to part ways with him.
But I also sat around here right from his draft day making the regular claim that he'd = Boeser and Dobson would = Pietrangelo. At least I'm looking to have been 50% correct with those statements.
I want to get in early on this, and I’m speaking as someone who is typically in favor of keeping our best prospects rather than trading them.
We all know Lou does Lou so it’s pretty likely that a TDL move is upcoming and that might include one or two prospects along with a pick.
I just hope that out of all the prospects that potentially might be flipped Lou at least holds onto Dufour and Finley.
The whole hockey universe is staring at Henrique right now as the likely sample.
And like every year, I can't see Lou having any interest in keeping that 1st rounder. This team has all the makings of needing a TDL upgrade just to slip into the playoffs in a very tight conference.
As mentioned in another post, we only have 5 picks this summer, but the 1st and 2nd are still part of that. We know Lou uses the firsts for upgrade and the 2nds to help with the cap.
I pretty much agree and I'd throw Nelson's name in there too, 'cause something tells me that they have no intention of moving him. I'm not really worried.
Just feels like he was drafted to be an Islander.
I guess if I had to pick one prospect I see as being absolutely safe from trade, it would be Nelson.
***
Going back to the post that talked about us not cutting ties with prospects while they still have value, I think we know that's not a game Lou plays. I think he would if another GM would come knocking and "surprise" him with a suggestion he couldn't refuse, but I think he otherwise has zero interest in making prospect for prospect deals or worrying about moving someone he doesn't think will fit or cut it.
Whatever his take on it is, the reality is that we've seen 3 first rounders from the prior regime fizzle away into obscurity and become non-NHL topics. That's ultimately on them. Did they have trade value along the way while looking like uncertainties for a Lou Lamoriello Isles outfit?
I think most the fanbase would argue yes.
In trying to apply this to recent (non-first rounder) samples, I've spent the past few years wondering if particularly Koivula and Salo weren't the kind of prospects where a deal could be made to bring in more fitting prospects from another franchise? They just don't seem to fit in the plans here whatsoever, but they do bring things that perhaps a couple of other franchises could make use of.
We picked up Gauthier as a UFA, but he was a bit of a staggering bubble prospect in recent years and there are guys like him that dot organizational depth charts around the league. Maybe he's not the best example, but you guys get my drift.
All this in mind, there was the recent Durandeau for Thompson move.
For those curious, Thompson has 5 assists and a -11 in BPort in the 15 games he's played there. Durandeau has 6 assists and a -2 in 6 games for Utica. Just bye the bye...
I guess one thing I'd loved to have seen added in a prospect-for-prospect move is a quiet, Bortuzzo/Mayfield type (thus, righty shot, lower line fill-in for the right side) who is stuck in the numbers game for another franchise. Anaheim is going to have a couple of those in the very near future. Carolina and Detroit likely as well.
Will we see that kind of thing take place?
Ad
Latest posts
-
GDT: WCQF (Game 5) Edmonton Oilers vs. Los Angeles Kings, 10pm ET, ESPN- Latest: Megaterio Llamas
-
