Speculation: 2023-24 Free Agency/Trade Thread II

[CrazyDuck4u]

I don't think it's an issue, PV has been active every year in free agency and not exactly bringing in the dregs, either.

In fact the only guy I can think of who took less money to go somewhere else is Lindholm.

Its the Taxes... The gotta include alot of bonuses to overlap those taxes..

 

[Deuce22]

Id just make Gibson our backup next year. Let him try to earn his way back to a #1 goalie spot. See if that sparks anything in him at all and then the following year if he still sucks either trade him with 50% retention or buy him out. I still have hope that he will get better as the team rebounds next year.

My impression of Gibson is that he wouldn't be good with being designated a backup. He's had it his own way here for a long time.

 

[The Midnight Burrito]

Its the Taxes... The gotta include alot of bonuses to overlap those taxes..

This is a truism that I just don't think is generalizable. If the goal of every UFA were to make as much money as possible, then sure, but that's not the case. Some players will prioritize the location, or the situation, or comfort/familiarity with the orgnization or teammates, over min-maxing their tax situation.

 

[TopShelfWaterBottle]

Also sponsorships play a big role in UFA signings. It’s free money without dealing with the nhl and salary cap implications

 

[Bender66]

This is a truism that I just don't think is generalizable. If the goal of every UFA were to make as much money as possible, then sure, but that's not the case. Some players will prioritize the location, or the situation, or comfort/familiarity with the orgnization or teammates, over min-maxing their tax situation.

This. Not to be mean ... but people who say "CA" taxes play a part in decisions when we're talking about salary in the millions of dollars are ... um lacking in correct perspective ...

Sure, there needs to be minor adjustment to take into consideration of taxes and living expenses ... but there is no amount of lower income and property taxes that would make me consider ever moving to floriduh or tejas, all things being equal (same job, same responsibilities, same salary etc). That's just the flat out truth from MY perspective. And i sure as hell don't make anything even close to a million dollars

So when i hear people that say "oh, pro athletes making tens to hundreds of millions of dollars in salary and endorsement don't want to play for CA teams because of taxes" are just trying to apply their own world view bubble and that's just not applicable when you're talking about people who can buy a house in CDM or Newport with cash, like even the most basic level minimum salary scrub in the NHL.

PLD is prime example of that. you think he gives a damn about being in a higher income tax bracket in LA? lol. That shit doesn't even hit the radar of he and his partner. He's too busy living the good life in manhattan beach or where ever the f*** he's living in LA to give a damn about bullshit extra 15% income tax hes paying. He can't thank his lucky stars enough that hes not in that boring igloo hellhole that is manitoba roflmao

 

[Bender66]

The problem has nothing to do with taxes. That's such a dumb strawman very typical of .... i'll shut my mouth now because i don't want to get infracted for talking politics.


But its obviously the talent and current rebuild status of the team.
Murray had no difficulty attracting UFA like Kesler when the team was competing for a cup.
You're not going to attract shit for UFA when your defense is swiss cheese and you're in middle of a rebuild. Only guys you can get when you're one of those teams is guys like Vatrano and Killorn. Guys who are near end of career, or guys like Frank the tank who were willing to bet on themselves to buff up their resume and score a better contract on a team where he can get more icetime than a cup competitor.

 

[12ozPapa]

If I’m a talented player, why sign with a shit team just long enough to not be re-signed right when they are about to compete? Not many players like that

 

[tomd]

The problem has nothing to do with taxes. That's such a dumb strawman very typical of .... i'll shut my mouth now because i don't want to get infracted for talking politics.


But its obviously the talent and current rebuild status of the team.
Murray had no difficulty attracting UFA like Kesler when the team was competing for a cup.
You're not going to attract shit for UFA when your defense is swiss cheese and you're in middle of a rebuild. Only guys you can get when you're one of those teams is guys like Vatrano and Killorn. Guys who are near end of career, or guys like Frank the tank who were willing to bet on themselves to buff up their resume and score a better contract on a team where he can get more icetime than a cup competitor.

Kesler was acquired via trade.

 

[tomd]

Taxes, cost of living (especially housing), TRAVEL, lifestyle, and lack of endorsement opportunities are all reasons why players don't generally come to California.

Anonymity and warmer climate are two things that California can offer that other big markets can't.

 

[Deuce22]

To say that tax rates and cost of living here in CA aren’t a factor is just guesswork. Every player is an individual and may prioritize different things when deciding where to sign.

 

[Dr Johnny Fever]

Kesler was acquired via trade.

Yes, but he told VAN it was either here or Chicago, neither of which is a low tax state.

I've read articles that discuss this exact issue with agents who say it is far less of an issue than the public makes it out to be. For one thing players now pretty much pay taxes in ever state they play in so it isn't even the whole salary that is subject to CA taxes.

 

[DuckDuckGetz]

Taxes, cost of living (especially housing), TRAVEL, lifestyle, and lack of endorsement opportunities are all reasons why players don't generally come to California.

Anonymity and warmer climate are two things that California can offer that other big markets can't.

Not sure I follow this one.

In addition to other factors already listed in this there, there are so many others that haven't been mentioned yet (school systems for for kids, family nearby, previous relationships with staff, politics, etc.) and so many different personalities in the league that I think it's a fool's errand to try to generalize it in any way.

 

[Anaheim4ever]

Miller wanted to come to Anaheim, his wife is an actress so being near LA/Hollywood was a plus.
Pronger also requested a trade to Anaheim cause his wife wanted to come to California.

 

[CrazyDuck4u]

Henriques wife still hasn't left CA last I heard. I think she has a Business here.. Which is why I'm speculating henrique might be back. We will see

 

[Rybread86]

The whole tax argument is often flawed on both sides. People either try to make too much or too little of it.

It does play a part in decisions for SOME players and in certain circumstances. Sometimes that number can be offset by other business ventures or personal factors. But its also 1 of who knows how many things that go into a decision. Do you want term, do you want to win, do you just want to get paid, do you have family in the area, wifes family, do you love the beach/mountains/desert/big city, is it a home town, do you have good friends already playing there, do local politics matter... list goes on.

 

[DuckDuckGetz]

Henriques wife still hasn't left CA last I heard. I think she has a Business here.. Which is why I'm speculating henrique might be back. We will see

Maybe. I think it's probably more likely that they don't have a passport for the newborn yet and don't want to go through the process for what might be a short stay in Edmonton.

Although if Pat says he's targeting a top 6 winger and re-signs Henrique, is he technically correct?

 

[91Fedorov]

Henriques wife still hasn't left CA last I heard. I think she has a Business here.. Which is why I'm speculating henrique might be back. We will see

I don't know how much room we have on LW or C. That's the reason I question it. Beeker really seems to care about handedness. He already said he wants to sign a right shooting RW.

Gautier / Leo / Terry
Vatrano / MacTavish / Strome
Killorn / Zegras / UFA RW

I'm not making a line-up, just showing spots available. Where would Henrique play? I can't see him accepting a 4th line role. He's playing top line with McJesus right now.

 

[lwvs84]

I don't know how much room we have on LW or C. That's the reason I question it. Beeker really seems to care about handedness. He already said he wants to sign a right shooting RW.

Gautier / Leo / Terry
Vatrano / MacTavish / Strome
Killorn / Zegras / UFA RW

I'm not making a line-up, just showing spots available. Where would Henrique play? I can't see him accepting a 4th line role. He's playing top line with McJesus right now.

It's really too bad Gauthier only played 1 game... the his line with Carlsson and Killorn looked good. If we had more time to see it, there might be a chance Rico is brought back as the wind for Zegras and Terry/Strome. Solid defense and could take Faceoffs for Z.

 

[ADHB]

Players generally don’t come here as FA (although that has changed some under Verbeek), but virtually everyone who was traded here in the past has signed extensions if the team wanted them to stay.

 

[SmokeyDuck]

There is nothing wrong with adding in free agency. We aren't trading all our young assets ala the Kings, and our drafting has been better than theirs.

 

[gilfaizon]

Yes, but he told VAN it was either here or Chicago, neither of which is a low tax state.

I've read articles that discuss this exact issue with agents who say it is far less of an issue than the public makes it out to be. For one thing players now pretty much pay taxes in ever state they play in so it isn't even the whole salary that is subject to CA taxes.

Both significantly lower than British Columbia.

 

[Smirnov2Chistov]

If Verbeek really were to get Henrique back I would be disappointed.

Stop trying to run it back with the same batch of veterans and players that didn’t improve the success around here. Different voices and leaders are needed, Henrique is definitely not one of them

 

[Hockey Duckie]

Maybe. I think it's probably more likely that they don't have a passport for the newborn yet and don't want to go through the process for what might be a short stay in Edmonton.

Although if Pat says he's targeting a top 6 winger and re-signs Henrique, is he technically correct?

Pat was a bit more specific in that he's targeting a top-6 RW. Although, if Rico returns, then we vastly improve our FO's at ES, PK, and PP.

 

[robbieboy3686]

If Verbeek really were to get Henrique back I would be disappointed.

Stop trying to run it back with the same batch of veterans and players that didn’t improve the success around here. Different voices and leaders are needed, Henrique is definitely not one of them

Agree we need to move on from Fowler and Gibson next summer latest as well and move on.

 

[eaterfan]

If you are making so much money that taxes make a big difference, you can afford to hire an accountant who can get you out of paying them.