Speculation: 2014-15 Stars Trade Talk 4: Jim Nill's Trading Tactics are Classless

[Mr Invidious]

Cody Eakin? Plays at C but has the flexibility to play wing.

I highly doubt Brett Ritchie is involved. Nichushkin definitely isn't. Curtis McKenzie or Colton Sceviour I could see.. but they are bottom 6 options.

The Sens board is currently discussing Eakin at the moment as well thinking that he would be the main piece coming back if a trade did happen.

Sounds like that very well might be the case.

 

[BigG44]

FYI for Dallas fans ... this isn't a bit of a rumor ... it's a guy on the Sens board with only a few thousand posts saying he heard something without giving any indication of a source (to be fair while also acknowledging it's not something he often is privy too).

This is closer to water cooler talk than a rumor without an additional source.

Dallas did scout the hell out of Ottawa for a while including Les Jackson. They have a surplus of D like Dallas, but one in particular who might be available based on usage is Cowen. He fits the teams state goal of getting someone who focuses more on their own zone, and he's a big body like Ruff has talked about acquiring.

The more I've considered Cowen, the less I have any interest. I'd rather see Nemeth and Goligoski with either Jokipakka or Oleksiak as the other LD. If they didn't acquire another RD and played Benn as the 7th .... I'd be on the fence about replacing Jokipakka with Cowen. They're the same age, and Cowen's size is impressive. I just don't know ... Jokipakka's upside is probably smaller, but he seems like a safer bet IMO.

I just don't know if the first lineup is really much better than the 2nd, and it is unlikely to be worth the cost to acquire him even if he was a part of a Lehner trade.

Goligoski-Klingberg
Nemeth-Demers
Cowen-Oleksiak

VS.

Jokipakka-Oleksiak

I mean on one hand you could have a Hatcher-Matvichuk Light with Cowen-Oleksiak potentially, but I just really want to see Jokipakka one more time. at least if he or Oleksiak aren't being moved for a veteran.

 

[BigG44]

The Sens board is currently discussing Eakin at the moment as well thinking that he would be the main piece coming back if a trade did happen.

Sounds like that very well might be the case.

The only way Eakin makes sense is if Dallas signs/ trade for another 3rd line center or they view Dickinson, Shore, or Faksa as NHL ready. They aren't trading Eakin before a replacement is under contract, and I doubt the organization is ready to commit to those young players yet.

Bottom line, Eakin is only available contingent on another move. They wouldn't fill a hole by creating another unless something was already in place, IMO.

 

[Satan]

I don't think trading Eakin away is that big of a deal. You can sign a stopgap of your choice during free agency and let the boys keep developing in Cedar Park.

 

[BigG44]

I agree it's not a big deal if you get the right stop gap ... not any stop gap.

One of Dickinson, Shore, and Faksa will be ready very soon for NHL duty ... maybe later this year ... maybe the start of the following season.

I've been in the camp, and still am, that see's trading Eakin as an eventual necessity likely, but they won't do it without a plan already in place IMO. It would be silly with playoff hopes to cut out your checking line center and gamble that you'll get someone "good enough".

He doesn't fill a minor role. He plays in all situations, and he's an above average contributor in most areas. That's what makes him a valuable trade chip.

Honestly though ...it's the goalie. From a value stand point, it's a bad trade. I have to admit that's my hesitation. Give me Bernier 2 years ago over Lehner right now every day and twice on Sunday. If Bernier didn't cost a pick and player equivalent to Eakin, I'm pissed if that's what they're paying.

Goalies traditionally have low values, and Lehner isn't even a proven commodity, and he's coming off a poor season. I get he's talented and that's great. I wouldn't pay a single roster piece for that player though. The market is flooded with goalies. There's no need to overpay for an unproven assset. Give me Lack for a 2nd (rumored asking price) before I pay a dime more for Lehner.

I'd gladly trade Eakin for an upgrade elsewhere.

 

[BigG44]

Just for giggles ... we know Dallas scouted the hell out of the Habs. We've all talked about Eller and maybe he was a guy they coveted.

Say Dallas added Eller to be the 3rd line center, I'm still not trading Eakin for Lehner. That's just my personal opinion. It's poor asset management.

You can get a goalie for less, and Eakin will get you a decent roster player in return elsewhere.

 

[Satan]

I don't see any of those 3 as NHL ready.

Faksa still hasn't played a full season down there. Has 2 ELC years remaining(??).
Devin Shore - 22 AHL games. 3 years of ELC. Let him develop in CP.
Dickinson - 5 AHL games. 3 years of ELC.

The question mark in my opinion is Mattias Janmark. He's been seasoned well in the SHL, top 20 in scoring last year. Only played 9 AHL games. 2 years on ELC.

We've got time for these guys to marinade in the minors, why not use it to our advantage? It's not like we absolutely need them playing in the NHL next year.

 

[BigG44]

I don't see any of those 3 as NHL ready.

Faksa still hasn't played a full season down there. Has 2 ELC years remaining(??).
Devin Shore - 22 AHL games. 3 years of ELC. Let him develop in CP.
Dickinson - 5 AHL games. 3 years of ELC.

The question mark in my opinion is Mattias Janmark. He's been seasoned well in the SHL, top 20 in scoring last year. Only played 9 AHL games. 2 years on ELC.

We've got time for these guys to marinade in the minors, why not use it to our advantage? It's not like we absolutely need them playing in the NHL next year.

That just solidifies my point. I said I didn't think they were NHL ready, and that really Eakin was only available when they were or they acquired a suitable replacement (who also must be signed short term to not block the young talent).

Janmark has already told multiple sources though he's returning to Sweden. There's only a slim chance he plays in NA next season. He's not really a part of the discussion IMO until he and the organization bring him over. I'm very intrigued by the guys so don't get me wrong, but I don't think he's at the level of a Dickinson or Shore for sure.

My bottom line is you can't just replace Eakin with anyone, and Fiddler/Horcoff as the 3rd and 4th line centers isn't good enough. You're not going to give a guy a ton of term so that limits free agent options, and it'd be silly to pay a ton to acquire an Eakin replacement when the ultimate goal should be to replace him internally.

I'd rush trading Eakin for the right defender ... not a decent goalie asset with the amount of talent on the market. We're for sure on the same page that Eakin's name could and should be out there. I just think you should be selective unless it's truly an impact asset coming back right now. Otherwise, I'm not interested in weakening next year's team for just some random asset that we could have found similar value for less elsewhere.

 

[BigG44]

Now that is an interesting comment to make:



That sounds like a trade to me.

 

[Satan]

I'm not sure how Grigorenko has developed but I remember I wanted Dallas to draft him or Girgensons.

Buffalo got both. Go figure.

 

[Satan]

Discussing trades with my non-Stars friend.. he believes that Eakin may be a little too much to give up for Robin Lehner.

I tend to agree with that.

 

[BigG44]

Discussing trades with my non-Stars friend.. he believes that Eakin may be a little too much to give up for Robin Lehner.

I tend to agree with that.

Not that it was clear ... but that's why I went off on the Cowen tangent. If Eakin's going the other way, it doesn't seem balanced at all. Wiercioch should probably be off the block so their other D don't make any sense.

 

[Ambassador Of Fun]

Why are we all so ready to give up Eakin? His replacements, who are unlikely to be better than him, aren't NHL ready. Even if they were ready, Nill just brought him to Worlds. That's gotta say something about where Nill thinks he fits.

 

[LT]

We're not... that's what this last page has been about.

He seems to be on the outs with management based on the last couple of seasons (various things), and it seems relatively likely that he gets moved eventually.

 

[Ambassador Of Fun]

We're not... that's what this last page has been about.

He seems to be on the outs with management based on the last couple of seasons (various things), and it seems relatively likely that he gets moved eventually.

Why? I've seen nothing to suggest this except that there are three prospects that could maybe possibly potentially be as good or better than he is. That's like saying we are thinking about getting rid of Nemeth because Klingberg's already here and Lindell had a great season.

 

[FirstRowUpperDeck]

Why do you say Eakin was on the outs with management? I have never heard that, and as mentioned, why would Nill put him on the Canada roster?

 

[LT]

There was that team suspension earlier this season, and I believe someone here said there were rumblings of that as well.

 

[Satan]

Why isn't Cody Eakin expendable? Other than the fact that we don't have a prospect ready to make the jump for the 2015-16 season, why else should we keep him?

 

[Ambassador Of Fun]

Why isn't Cody Eakin expendable? Other than the fact that we don't have a prospect ready to make the jump for the 2015-16 season, why else should we keep him?

He's 24, he scores at a .5 ppg clip (number 59 in Center scoring in the NHL) playing mostly on the 3rd line, is decent defensively and getting better, PKs, can fill in on the power play, and I own his jersey and he's in my avatar.

 

[Satan]

He's 24, he scores at a .5 ppg clip (number 59 in Center scoring in the NHL) playing mostly on the 3rd line, is decent defensively and getting better, PKs, can fill in on the power play, and I own his jersey and he's in my avatar.

To expand on my point, he doesn't suppress shots and our team shot rate FOR is higher without him than with him.

What he has going for him is he is 24 years old and has a 40 point season, on the 2nd highest scoring team in the NHL.

He should have decent trade value. Let another team have him and shore up an area of weakness on our team.

 

[Mr Misty]

Last year showed that Roussel-Eakin-Garbutt is not a shutdown line. I don't see any upside from his wingers, but there's still room for Eakin to grow and I'd like to see him not paired with high volume shooters. I think he can be a Peverly type top 9 guy who can win draws, kill penalties, and play on any line. The only way to make that happen is by getting a shutdown 3C with size and moving Eakin to wing.

 

[Ghost of Kyiv]

To expand on my point, he doesn't suppress shots and our team shot rate FOR is higher without him than with him.

What he has going for him is he is 24 years old and has a 40 point season, on the 2nd highest scoring team in the NHL.

He should have decent trade value. Let another team have him and shore up an area of weakness on our team.

That comes with the territory of being (mostly) a 3rd line center who starts more shifts in the defensive zone than he does in the offensive zone. I haven't looked it up, but I doubt that out of the thirty third line centers in the NHL, that much more than a handful are able to generate more shots then they suppress. And if they are able to do that, then they are probably outperforming their role and may even deserve a place in someone's top 6 since it's a fairly impressive accomplishment to out-shoot your team in a (primary) defensive role.

And Dallas is still getting the majority of the scoring chances when Cody Eakin plays at even strength, so I'm still quite content with how the Stars preform when Eakin is on the ice. And just as general team building theory, if you can break even when your top 6 is resting, then your probably in very good shape for when your Stars come out to play.

Personally, "the fact that we don't have a prospect ready to make the jump for the 2015-16 season" is reason enough for me not to trade him this year. And I don't think Eakin's stock will depreciate much in value over the next year (or it could even increase) so I think the best course of action would be to keep him this year, and wait for the kids to (hopefully) be able to replace him in the years coming at which point you could more comfortably deal him.

 

[Satan]

I wasn't comparing his shot suppression vs shot generation.


I was trying to say

We suppress shots better without him than with him.

We generate shots better without him than with him.

 

[tjcurrie]

I agree BigG - even with a replacement for Eakin, I don't trade him for Lehner. Aim higher if you're trading a fixture like that.

Obviously this couldn't happen until July 1, but I wonder if Nill would have any interest in Carl Soderberg. 6'3, 215 LB center, 29, set to become a UFA. Boston came out and said they won't be re-signing him.

Oh and no interest in Cowen.

 

[Ghost of Kyiv]

I wasn't comparing his shot suppression vs shot generation.


I was trying to say

We suppress shots better without him than with him.

We generate shots better without him than with him.

I know, apologize if I didn't illustrate that in my point better. I'm just saying it's unreasonable to ask for a player who gets a bunch of defensive zone starts against fairly tough competition to do either of those things. I don't think it is fair criticism without context. And Dallas still breaks roughly even with him in most categories (shots, shot attempts, scoring chances, goals) at even strength when he is on the ice. So he is getting (mildly) buried in his role and is doing a pretty good job of digging himself out of it. Not to say he is a Star by any means (besides in the obvious way ), but I think he does more things right then he does wrong and he's still got some youth on his side.