zzZZzz.... Uhh.. Habs won? 2-1

[Monctonscout]

Anybody who didn't think it was going to be very bad when we lost to injury both our Hart trophy goalie and our best forward was seriously deluding themselves. The Habs played well when Condon's save % was over .915, then it dropped to like .850, and gee, the losses started. The coaches fault!

Unless you have a really strong back up, take the starter of any of the top 10 NHL goalies and the team will struggle to play .500.

Washington has a decent back up and he hasn't had to play more than 1 game because Holtby has not been hurt, their record with him is 4-3-1.


Nashville is 3-2-1 without Rinne.

Chicago is 4-3-2 without Crawford.

NYR is 4-3-1 minus Lundquist.

TB is 4-4-1 minus Bishop

NJ is 3-4 minus Schneider

St.Louis is 5-4-3 when Allen sits.


Plus those starts are usually against ****** teams, Condon had to face Washington Boston Florida TB

Condon only started really struggling when he started 13 of 15 and Tokarski played poorly, and that affected him along with the heavy workload.

 

[CauZuki]

Unless you have a really strong back up, take the starter of any of the top 10 NHL goalies and the team will struggle to play .500.

Washington has a decent back up and he hasn't had to play more than 1 game because Holtby has not been hurt, their record with him is 4-3-1.


Nashville is 3-2-1 without Rinne.

Chicago is 4-3-2 without Crawford.

NYR is 4-3-1 minus Lundquist.

TB is 4-4-1 minus Bishop

NJ is 3-4 minus Schneider

St.Louis is 5-4-3 when Allen sits.


Plus those starts are usually against ****** teams, Condon had to face Washington Boston Florida TB

Condon only started really struggling when he started 13 of 15 and Tokarski played poorly, and that affected him along with the heavy workload.

Although I agree with the tone of your argument , the stats are a bit misleading.

Most teams with an MVP goalie usually only play their backup on back to back nights.

I don't believe you can use the stats you are laying out to justify our current state.

With the way Condon was playing even when he had some ruff nights (understandable for a rookie) the team was simply not producing and that can't be just because Carey is a 3rd defenceman.

The team had no issues potting goals during the 10 + games where Condon was having success.

The catalyst for me is Therriens inability to shuffle his lineup when Gallagher went down due to our weak RW depth (GM's fault there).

 

[Lshap]

Everything since December has been crap. You can argue that the slump is over because they won 2 games, but I say it's still very much happening. The win vs the Devils is not enough to convince me the slump is over. Not at all.

...the "slump" is still going on...we were terrible against the Devils and needed last minute heroics against the Bolts; two teams who have also been terrible lately...we've won and dominated ONE GAME since Therrien's blender act...ONE GAME against a depleted Bruins...you're lying to yourself here, Lshap...

If you're going to poke holes in our wins, it's just as easy to poke holes in the opposition's wins. During the slump we outshot and outplayed a few teams (Washington, SJ, LA) but lost. Those teams didn't 'deserve' to win against the Habs, just like you feel the Habs didn't 'deserve' to win against the Devils. If wins and losses were determined by who 'deserved' it -- shots, chances, possession -- we'd gain more wins than we'd lose. Bottom line is the other team won games they 'shouldn't have', just like the Habs did.

Sure, our team has holes, but it's the same hole as when the season started -- a top-six forward. Scoring's better than last year but still thin at the top. The only other concern I have is the PP. If it levels off at a decent % we'll be fine; if the PP sinks down to the same bad habits/bad coaching as last year, we'll be handicapped in the playoffs. You cannot pass real judgment based on small chunks of the season.

 

[Lshap]

The part some posters seem to miss is that not having Price hurts the offense also. Not sure if this a coaching adjustment or the players themselves doing it by human nature, but they are not jumping into the rush as much lately compared to early on..

Much easier to support the attack if you have Price back there vs the goaltending we have had. Condon was good in spurts but also had a few stinkers. Scrivens...jury is still out. Tokarski is an AHL goalie you can play 2-3 games a year MAX.

The other part is, Price is like a 3rd d-man back there, that makes a huge difference in transition. Teams with good puck handling goalies spend less time in their zone and their d-men take less hits. Go look at the NYR series after Price went out, the d-men got run the rest of the series and had nothing left by the end.

Condon is ok handling the puck but not great. Scrivens is a bit better, Tokarski is brutal, often doesn't even come out to stop dump ins.


Any teams would struggle with ****** goaltending. look at LA when Quick struggled or Crawford in Chicago? Are they ****** teams that still won the cup?

This bears repeating because it's important and very true. Our subpar goaltending not only let in goals at an alarming rate, it forced our D and forwards to adjust their system. They clearly don't trust their goalie and are compensating by tightening up in our zone. It's limited the opposition's offence and our own.

 

[Lshap]

Although I agree with the tone of your argument , the stats are a bit misleading.

Most teams with an MVP goalie usually only play their backup on back to back nights.

I don't believe you can use the stats you are laying out to justify our current state.

With the way Condon was playing even when he had some ruff nights (understandable for a rookie) the team was simply not producing and that can't be just because Carey is a 3rd defenceman.

The team had no issues potting goals during the 10 + games where Condon was having success.

The catalyst for me is Therriens inability to shuffle his lineup when Gallagher went down due to our weak RW depth (GM's fault there).

It's more than one thing. Yes, the line shuffling also doesn't help. But so much we've been seeing on the ice is symptomatic of a lack of trust in the guy between the pipes. Condon started off playing well but soon got in over his head. Not really his fault, but as his weaknesses were exposed the team lost trust and had to work harder to cover shots they'd let Price take.

 

[Lshap]

Everybody is cherry picking stats here to fit their agenda.

There are no two ways about it , it's a fact , Habs had the worst month in their history after having the best start in their history.

This to me shows a team that lost confidence and although the start of the season was ridiculously unsustainable , I don't think anybody thought losing Carey was going to be this bad. What is even more puzzling is that the Habs played very well with Condon in net but once Gallagher went down the line shuffling broke the whole team.

I think we can start expecting over .500 hockey from now on and a marked improvement if and when Price comes back.

I am not worried but all this shows is that Therrien was not able to adjust and find chemistry within his lineup when faced with some adversity.

Many teams reshuffle when injuries to star players happen but the impact isn't a severe as we have seen here.

I don't think we will ever win a cup with Therrien even with perfect health.

He clearly demonstrates that he has an issue adjusting to a change in scenarios and that he can easily get out coached when it comes down to being creative (which is something that happens often in playoffs).

Needless to say I have little faith in our coaching staff.

I agree that whatever the cause -- bad goalie, bad lines, bad luck -- the team's confidence took a major hit last month. Mental states are huge and very tricky to predict, but they change and then change back pretty quickly. I'll predict the Habs will recover their winning mindset, obviously when Price gets back, but also because over a few seasons they're much more accustomed to winning than losing.

Only thing I disagree with is Therrien being an insurmountable obstacle to the Cup.