Confirmed with Link: Zadorov to Calgary for Toronto's 3rd round pick

[Pez68]

Yes, it's definitely easier to operate within the parameters of the cap instead of being over and backing yourself into a corner. How does that not align with cap implications? Just because you can go over the cap, doesn't mean that's the position you want to be in.

Because making statements like "they don't have the cap space to sign anyone" is not accurate. Not having it, and not wanting to go into the overage are two different things.

 

[Backyard Hockey]

Addition by subtraction. Good move getting something in return. Anything more than a Tim Horton’s coffee and a plate of week old poutine is a bonus.

 

[Hawkaholic]

They have 6.3M, if Shaw goes to LTIR. They're apparently signing McCabe, I'm just assuming he's going to cost around 3.5M. So now they're down to 2.8. Lets assume Nylander gets Gaudette money 998K and Hagel gets 1.5M. That leaves them with 300k in space.

They will want to be as close to the cap as possible when they put Shaw (maybe Toews too), on LTIR.

 

[ozzzie19]

Ah my bad, it's hard to keep track with you ozzzie. Of course, who responded to who bears no weight on the arguments presented, so that's kind of an odd conclusion to draw.

As to the bolded. Then why are the Hawks trying to trade CdH and why haven't they signed anyone yet? Seems like there could be some cap implications.

No problem, Stan has made the last few days pretty darn fast and furious! And I probably should have just showed it in Capfriendly, which is much more clear what I'm talking about.
I'm not disagreeing that CdH is on the block and McCabe hasn't come through yet, but I think thats more roster than cap. See below with McCabe at 4M (who knows?) and with CdH still on the Hawks. Shaw on LTIR and Carpenter sent to minors (to get to 13/7/2). We still have 2.7m in cap space. I don't know what the plan is with Kampf (or who he would replace) so he's not here. Maybe he bumps Connolly to the minors...then we'd still have ~2M in cap space.

 

[HockeySauce]

Because making statements like "they don't have the cap space to sign anyone" is not accurate. Not having it, and not wanting to go into the overage are two different things.

I never said they don't have the cap space to sign anyone. But I definitely wasn't thinking within the context of the 10% cushion. It's not a desirable position to be in and not one I imagine they'd willingly put themselves into. So their actual cap space, whether they can go above that in the off-season, still matters. That's my frame of thinking.

 

[Cowch]

Oh people think the Panarin trade tree is over, but that 3rd round pick will definitely become the NEXT panarin and we will have gone full circle. Who knows maybe that guy gets traded and it just never ends.

 

[ozzzie19]

They will want to be as close to the cap as possible when they put Shaw (maybe Toews too), on LTIR.

Yes, which means we still need to add more to be able to utilize LTIR to the fullest.

 

[DisgruntledHawkFan]

Round and round we go.

 

[hockeydoug]

Stan the genius is highlighted again. Could have kept Saad and traded him at the deadline with salary retention and got more than a 3rd.

This isnt the first time they have traded for a player they wanted and then given away a short time later. Something is wrong with the Hawks pro scout evaluation.

Late 2nd for the most confusing draft in decades? Saad wasn't getting that much. Trade didn't go well but I don't think it was going to be much better if they kept him.

 

[HockeySauce]

Late 2nd for the most confusing draft in decades? Saad wasn't getting that much. Trade didn't go well but I don't think it was going to be much better if they kept him.

I think they could have gotten a better futures package but I don't think they wanted that. Seems like they wanted a player back. Zadorov's who they got.

 

[nmgrbhfn]

Big Z wasn't who other teams drove their offense through last season. That title belonged to de Haan all season and Keith towards the end. SB's first goal this off-season defense-wise wasn't to move Z, it was to find an alternative to Keith playing 1d minutes and de Haan playing second pairing minutes. SB is only half-done with solving those two issues.

In retrospect, it is clear SB had already concluded that big Z was too expensive / cap unfriendly to play third pairing minutes on the Hawks, and SB had anticipated that and addressed it by trading for and signing Stillman.

 

[nmgrbhfn]

Addition by subtraction. Good move getting something in return. Anything more than a Tim Horton’s coffee and a plate of week old poutine is a bonus.

Its only addition by subtraction if Stillman plays the d-side of the game as well as Big Z. Stillman hasn't shown anything on the o-side of the game (even less than Big Z) if you look at the stats. If Stillman somehow is allowed to play second-pairing minutes without some upgrade on the o-side of his game the Hawks are right back to the big Z predicament - an offensively-challenged d being asked to play too many minutes in the wrong situations. If Stillman plays third pairing minutes slightly worse or as well as Big Z it is addition by subtraction only from the perspective of cap management, not on ice play.

 

[nmgrbhfn]

Skip

 

[Blackhawkswincup]

Fine with this

He has tools that tease the potential to be a top 4 but just never is going to put it together at this point

You cant continue to live off potential after 8 years in NHL

A fine bottom pairing defender but that is it

 

[Blackhawks]

Its amazing Stan Bowman turned prime Brandon Saad into a 3rd round pick (Saad -> Anisamov, Panarin -> Saad, Saad -> Zadorov, Zadorov -> 3rd round pick).

Only Stan the man can accomplish something like this, you literally have to be brain dead to turn Panarin into a third rounder lol

 

[ozzzie19]

Its only addition by subtraction if Stillman plays the d-side of the game as well as Big Z. Stillman hasn't shown anything on the o-side of the game (even less than Big Z) if you look at the stats. If Stillman somehow is allowed to play second-pairing minutes without some upgrade on the o-side of his game the Hawks are right back to the big Z predicament - an offensively-challenged d being asked to play too many minutes in the wrong situations. If Stillman plays third pairing minutes slightly worse or as well as Big Z it is addition by subtraction only from the perspective of cap management, not on ice play.

Seems like Stillman and Jones will be battling for 3LD, which is the right play both ice play and cap management.

 

[BobbyJet]

Fine with this

He has tools that tease the potential to be a top 4 but just never is going to put it together at this point

You cant continue to live off potential after 8 years in NHL

A fine bottom pairing defender but that is it

I hear ya but I'm disappointed... and damn, Zadorov can be so much better - I think it is a mental thing why he can't put it all together. Still, that physicality he brought can't be dismissed. Stan seems to think that Stillman will replace him. Time will tell but I reckon the soft Hawks just got softer.

 

[ozzzie19]

I hear ya but damn, Zadorov can be so much better - I think it is a mental thing why he can't put it all together. Still, that physicality he brought can't be dismissed. Stan seems to think that Stillman will replace him. Time will tell but I reckon the soft Hawks just got softer.

I mean the guy is one of the best 1:1 defenders in the game. Unfortunately he can't play in a system and is hot garbage when the puck is on his stick. It's really unfortunate that he excels at one component but can't even be passable at everything else.

 

[ChiHawks10]

I hear ya but I'm disappointed... and damn, Zadorov can be so much better - I think it is a mental thing why he can't put it all together. Still, that physicality he brought can't be dismissed. Stan seems to think that Stillman will replace him. Time will tell but I reckon the soft Hawks just got softer.

Yes, the Hawks got softer by getting rid of Zadorov, and bringing in Jones, Johnson, McCabe, and Khaira.

 

[Giovi]

delete

 

[BobbyJet]

Yes, the Hawks got softer by getting rid of Zadorov, and bringing in Jones, Johnson, McCabe, and Khaira.

I sense this is sarcasm.
I wasn't referring to the team year-to-year, but rather that Hawks roster is softer when they trade away Z..... softer today than yesterday that is. I don't think anyone can argue that.

 

[nmgrbhfn]

I hear ya but I'm disappointed... and damn, Zadorov can be so much better - I think it is a mental thing why he can't put it all together. Still, that physicality he brought can't be dismissed. Stan seems to think that Stillman will replace him. Time will tell but I reckon the soft Hawks just got softer.

I don't know - it seems a significant portion of the Hawks draft the last couple of years and especially this year is finding that mythical big d-man that fulfills Big Z's promise - a big guy with some grit to his game that is just good enough offensively to play second pairing minutes and will do it on an entry level contract for three years. It's kinda a left-handed compliment to Big Z. "You're too big and too good at the limited part of the game you have mastered to make you too expensive, but I'm burning a lot of draft picks to find a guy like you I can ride for three years on an ELC."

 

[Panzerspitze]

I hear ya but I'm disappointed... and damn, Zadorov can be so much better - I think it is a mental thing why he can't put it all together. Still, that physicality he brought can't be dismissed. Stan seems to think that Stillman will replace him. Time will tell but I reckon the soft Hawks just got softer.

Wait a minute, why did the soft Avs who got bounced in Round 2 year after year get rid of this big "tough" D-man?

 

[nmgrbhfn]

I sense this is sarcasm.
I wasn't referring to the team year-to-year, but rather that Hawks roster is softer when they trade away Z..... softer today than yesterday that is. I don't think anyone can argue that.

Anyone who watched the first half of last year knows that other teams (e.g., Carolina) were aware when Big Z was on the ice. Aho comes to mind. The way he rode forwards into the boards was a thing of beauty.

 

[clydesdale line]

I sense this is sarcasm.
I wasn't referring to the team year-to-year, but rather that Hawks roster is softer when they trade away Z..... softer today than yesterday that is. I don't think anyone can argue that.

Not a chance they got softer. All the guys they've acquired this offseason are tough to play against (with grit). In fact, they'll be even tougher to play against once they get rid of Strome.