Zadina probably starting out in GR

Discussion in 'Detroit Red Wings' started by lhsgolf19, Sep 26, 2018.

  1. Whoshattenkirkshoes

    Whoshattenkirkshoes Registered User

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    He didn’t play tonight. Anybody know what’s up?
     
  2. Oddbob

    Oddbob Registered User

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    They just found out he is a confirmed Bust and scratched him!
     
  3. GrGriffins

    GrGriffins Registered User

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    Zadina played tonight. He was on the ice on the IceHogs only goal late in the 1st period. Took 3 shots.
     
  4. WesNichols14

    WesNichols14 Registered User

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    He did play tonight. He was - 1 and had 3 shots.

    Edit: beat to it lol
     
  5. lilidk

    lilidk Registered User

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    Come on people Zadina is not bust , he needs to work on his physicality and speed , He is not complete player , it will take some time , he needs good teammates to give him passes , he is the only skill player in GR.
     
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  6. GrGriffins

    GrGriffins Registered User

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    Lines are jumbo around this week as the Griffins leading scorer, Chris Terry has not played this week due to an injury. Zadina was placed on the top line where Terry would have been placed in tonight's game. Will see where he ends up tomorrow night back home vs Milwaukee. Just have to be patient with this kid.
     
  7. ChrisReevesLegs

    ChrisReevesLegs Registered User

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    Where is everyone at with Zadina these days?

    I was hoping my opinion of him would have changed for the better by now, but unfortunately it's only getting worse...

    Last year I got on him about his skating and decision-making. I think his skating is actually improved now. I still wouldn't define him as a particularly fast player, but he definitely has the legs to keep up.

    Also, I think I was wrong about his decision-making being the problem. I'm now questioning his entire hockey IQ. He is an incredibly frustrating player to watch. So much ability, yet he has seemingly no idea how to use it. He's like a Ferrari with a chimp behind the wheel. He's constantly behind the play - not because he is slow - but because his anticipation of the play is so poor. I was hoping finishing out the season last year and having this summer to prepare would have better acclimated him to the systems in GR. I don't think it took at all.

    To his credit, he seems frustrated at times, like he knows things are not going his way.... The effort is there, he still backchecks hard, but it's like he doesn't always know what his assignment is or something. I see the same sort of thing continuing in the O zone as well. I'm still super doubtful that he's ever going to be much of a playmaker/play-driver. He needs to just set up at the top of the circle like Stammer does and endlessly bean the goalie off feeds from someone who CAN make a play. It will be a tough pill to swallow if a former #6 ends up as a passenger player like that, but it might be his best shot at racking up big goal totals. Or maybe he hits the squat rack and works on his dangles and he can be an AA type. I just don't see him ever functioning in a proper cycle that well.

    Any GR watchers seeing the same or different?
     
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  8. Rzombo4 prez

    Rzombo4 prez Registered User

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    That is exactly what he should not do. Truth of the matter is that he doesn't work hard enough off of the puck as it is and depends upon his line mates to do too much of the lifting. You are asking him to become a worse version of himself. I don't think he is dumb, but he is a pretty passive player all things considered when he does not have the puck and spends a lot of time watching the puck instead of moving his feet. The harder he works off of the puck the more he will find himself with the puck. He needs to start fighting for the middle of the ice more and getting his nose dirty. He spends far too much time on the perimeter at the moment.

    More importantly, he was very going to truly drive the play at the professional level. He has always been a very dependent scorer with good skill,even at the junior level. If you are expecting something else, you are going to be frustrated. Please appreciate his draft position does not dictate or indicate the style of a player.

    I do agree though that the skating has gotten better. There is still obviously room for improvement but the stride is looking much better.
     
  9. ChrisReevesLegs

    ChrisReevesLegs Registered User

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    "That is exactly what he should not do"

    I assume you're referring to being a trigger man at the top of the circle?

    "You are asking him to become a worse version of himself"

    If I was going to ask him of anything, it would be to become the dynamic more complete player we thought we had drafted. I'm not asking him to become a passenger type player, but I think he already is one.

    "More importantly, he was never going to truly drive play at the professional level. He has always been a very dependent scorer"

    And it sounds like you agree with me.

    Although this is certainly not the assessment I read of him going into the draft and directly after the draft. Sounds like revisionist history on your part. Can you produce a scouting report that corroborates this? I'll give you the benefit of the doubt for now, maybe you read something I didn't...

    "Please appreciate his draft position does not dictate or indicate the style of a player."

    This is kind of an odd thing to say... Of course it doesn't, and I never suggested it. Although I will contend, that if a players style is poor work ethic, shys away from the puck and dirty areas, and is completely dependent on his line-mates to score... that player should not be going 6th overall. Or even in the 1st round.

    I disagree with your notion that he doesn't work hard though. I think it can look like that sometimes, because he is always behind the play, but his feet are moving... he just doesn't know where to go. His hockey IQ is poor. Which to me, is pretty alarming for a supposed scorer. I agree on the passiveness though... but to be honest... passiveness coming from a very young average sized skill player doesn't surprise me all that much. Of course still a bit disappointing though you're right.
     
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  10. Darkseider

    Darkseider Almost as good as a Marvel reference

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    NBC's Pierre McGuire: Don't be surprised if Red Wings GM Steve Yzerman trades Filip Zadina

     
  11. Oddbob

    Oddbob Registered User

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    Pierre McGuire know very little (other than where every person ever went to college) and his opinion should be treated as mostly fluff on most things. Also, the person who wrote this story suggesting that Zadina should never have been drafted that high is ridiculous, as him falling to 6 was considering shocking and/or surprising and was definitely considered the Wings catching a break that he fell there, not that they reached well above. Just because he is disappointing right now, doesn't change how he was viewed then.
     
  12. ChrisReevesLegs

    ChrisReevesLegs Registered User

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    The writer didn't suggest that. The writer asked whether or not Yzerman believed Zadina was worth a 6th at the time.

    Everyone was excited to draft Zadina at the time. Apparently the Wings thou were the only ones in the room who didn't understand why he was falling...
     
  13. Oddbob

    Oddbob Registered User

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    He suggested it with his wording right there in the bold.
     
  14. ChrisReevesLegs

    ChrisReevesLegs Registered User

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    Interview questions are suggestions now? I get that you don't like the wording, but asking whether or not Yzerman had reports about Zadinas draft position is what it is... a question. And I don't find this particular question unwarranted given the topic.
     
  15. MBH

    MBH Registered User

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    It was interesting.
    And I think McGuire's comments about first rounders and a new regime probably apply to Svech more than Zadina at this point.

    Regardless, what's everyone's take on Zadina right now.

    Is he a legit top 9er?
    Top 6er?
    Top liner?
    Is he ready for the NHL by October 2020? 2021?
     
  16. ChrisReevesLegs

    ChrisReevesLegs Registered User

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    Honestly think Svech is now, and will continue to be, more fit to be an NHL hockey player than Zadina. Yzerman is keeping him out of the fire this year exercising that weird injury loophole, but after this year Svech willl be up full time.

    Zadina is Hudler 2.0 so top9 I guess
     
  17. Winger98

    Winger98 Moderator

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    I think he's a top6 guy. I get people being frustrated with him, and I don't get to watch the GR games, but watching him in the preseason I thought he was clearly working hard, he didn't float defensively, but he looked like he was still trying to pull crap that worked in juniors but won't work in the pros. Another year of experience, and then a summer of conditioning, I think will be big for him. I still don't see him making the team out of camp next fall, but I'm betting he fights for a callup mid way through the season.
     
  18. 2xJack

    2xJack Registered User

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    I completely agree with you on Svech. He could play now on our team and be an upgrade. I think he'll be on the roster full time before the end of the season. We need to find a way to score more goals, and that's something he can help with. Even if he doesn't make it this season he'll almost surely be on the roster next year. I'll be shocked if Yzerman has written him off or moves him, because he's exactly the kind of reclamation project that Yzerman has been fishing for lately.

    As far as the Zadina and Hudler comparison.... maybe? If Zadina turns things around he could possibly be a poor man's Hudler. That's the ceiling I believe. I think Hudler was far more creative offensively than Zadina is. Like you posted earlier, Zadina is a passenger.

    Let's break down his 3 goals on the season.

    Goal #1 - Griffins have the man advantage. Zadina follows the rush into the offensive zone, slightly behind the play. Terry loses control of the puck as he's closing in on the crease, the D immediately coughs it up and it goes straight to Zadina. He one-times it home from between the circles. It showcased his deadly shot, but was a garbage / clean-up type goal. He was rewarded for following the play.

    Goal #2 - Zadina was playing net front and tipped a waist high shot from the blue line.

    Goal #3 - Griffins are on the PP. Zadina is parked in the open at the left faceoff dot and one-times a pass.

    Zadina can shoot, there is no question about that. He's not showing much in the way of offensive creativity, though. He may have a better chance at a pro career if he goes Happy Gilmore and switches to golf. Joking aside, Jiri Hudler showed way more spark even early in his Griffins career. I have a hard time believing that Zadina will reach that level even with additional time to grow.
     
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  19. Steve Yzerlland

    Steve Yzerlland Registered User

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    What "crap in junior's " are you referring to?
     
  20. Winger98

    Winger98 Moderator

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    Remember when he would repeatedly have the puck in the offensive zone, wander over to the half wall, and then just try skating to the middle of the ice? Then he would either give it up then and there or get flushed back to the half wall where the defense would pressure and he'd give the puck then. That was a biggie, and he'd revert to that move all of the time because he just didn't seem comfortable with what the defense was showing him and it was a move he could make work for himself in the past.

    As I said, I think the guy was working out there, though. It wasn't a lack of effort, and I thought he was good defensively. He didn't try cheating on that side of the puck to drive his offense. He just has to learn the pro game.
     
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  21. MBH

    MBH Registered User

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    Yeah. I wouldn't say he gives great effort.
    But he totally tries too many moves that work in amateur hockey but don't work in pros.
    No-look passes to the opposition...
     
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  22. Henkka

    Henkka Registered User

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    Hudler was always more of a playmaker from his game-mind.

    That 2005-06 season as 22-year old is still quite awesome, 36+60=96 points in 76 games. Same continued at playoffs, 6+16=22 points in 16 games.
     
  23. lomekian

    lomekian Registered User

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    Totally different players with different mindsets, skillsets and even to a degree, body type. Hudler was an extremely intelligent and creative player limited by size, speed and possibly his 'extracurricular activities'. Zadina is a scorer with some ok playmaking aspects to his game, who has a superior shot, but nothing like the passing or vision. He is quicker, a little bigger and a bit more slippery. Unlike Hudler he had far less exposure to men's hockey prior to being drafted. He's also still a couple of years younger than Hudler was when he had his AHL breakout.

    Are we ok to be disappointed that a #3 dropping to #6 to us hasn't had a significant impact yet? Sure. Does writing him off as a bust or a 3rd liner have any justification? Not yet.
     
  24. Henkka

    Henkka Registered User

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    Zadina has 8th most NHL games of 2018 draftees.
    Zadina has 7th most NHL points of 2018 draftees.
    Zadina also has 5th highest average ice-times of 2018 draftees.

    Everybody should once look outside from the window and see somebody else "childs" than your own. Other prospects from 2018 draft aren't doing any different. Young players are struggling. Quinn Hughes is THE only player who is playing better than Zadina who was drafted after him.

    So Zadina is kind of where he was picked. Not booming, but not busting either. People just have too high expectations.

    It was "relaxing" to see player like Kaapo Kakko suffer totally, when I though he would shine instantly in NHL. It ain't easy for others either. Kakko's first 9 games were absolutely worse than Zadina was on his 9-game stint.

    So that gave me hope. NHL ain't easy for kids, if you are not the supertalent of the draft at the level of McDavid, Eichel, Matthews, Laine.
     
    Last edited: Nov 9, 2019
  25. Henkka

    Henkka Registered User

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    Slowly heating up.

    4+2=6 points in last 8 games.

    First 6 games 1+0= 1 point.
     
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