Series Talk: Your Top 5 Under the Gun Leafs this Playoffs

ToneDog

56 years and counting. #FireTheShanaClan!
Jun 11, 2017
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1. Andy - all the reasons have been given
2. Dubas/Keefe/Shanny - if their run and gun vision cannot exploit the layoff, their sands of time in Toronto will start running out.
3. The big 3 - got the big bucks, time to get it done for the G.M. that takes the heat over your contracts when results are not there.
4. Tavares - you wanted to win a cup in your home town. Get it done.
5. The defence - time to prove you are not as bad as most of the hockey community thinks you are.
6. Team toughness - cannot allow teams to push you around.
 

ACC1224

Super Elite, Passing ALL Tests since 2002
Aug 19, 2002
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1. Andy - all the reasons have been given
2. Dubas/Keefe/Shanny - if their run and gun vision cannot exploit the layoff, their sands of time in Toronto will start running out.
3. The big 3 - got the big bucks, time to get it done for the G.M. that takes the heat over your contracts when results are not there.
4. Tavares - you wanted to win a cup in your home town. Get it done.
5. The defence - time to prove you are not as bad as most of the hockey community thinks you are.
6. Team toughness - cannot allow teams to push you around.
I think we just have to accept that this will happen and hope it isn't a factor .
 

Mess

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Feb 27, 2002
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I think we just have to accept that this will happen and hope it isn't a factor .

Some Leaf players don't respond well to the physical style of play and attention they receive.

Case in point Nylander ... 2016-17 .. 6 games 1 goal & 2017-18 .. 7 games 1 goal & 2018-19 .. 7 games 1 goal..

Total 20 NHL Playoff games 3 goals or 1 per 1st round series.

Nylander for me is one of those "under the gun" players in this series that claims he is ready to step up his game to the next level after 3 previous disappointing outings.
 

Notsince67

Papi and the Lamplighters
Apr 27, 2018
15,854
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Confused are you asking me what i ment by exceeded his contract? I mean I didnt say that in 2 years of a 6 year contract he has exceeded both. Which it appears you have assumed. i did say exceeded his contract...which one would assume means he has exceeded his completed contract (which is 6 years and not 2). Which makes no sense..... so if id expect someone who wants to criticize may want to clarify a confusinf statement first to ensure they understand.

Or else the person may just want to be difficult or play devils advocate.

When i said exceeded his contract... i ment this year he has exceeded expectations. Also i am sure most woulf agree...this year Nylander was probably the better overall player between he and Marner. Or it was at the very least extremely close. Marner had more points but Nylander had twice as many goals and goals are typically favored over assists in a player assessment.

my statement i stand behind. If Nylander is on peoples list... then Marner surely should be on the very same lists too. Marner makes nearly 40% more than Nylander... so expectations need to be much higher than Nylanders. Based on season performance and contracts... Marner should be feeling the heat much more than Nylander.

Now if you disagree with my actual statement, which is that Marner belongs on lists that already have Nylander.... i would very much enjoy for your explanation on why. I have admittedly been wrong in the past and enjoy others angles that i may have missed. But my preference is for people to respond to my actual statements and not ones they have taken out of context
I dont believe either are in the list but my confusion was that you seem to feel that Willy has somehow earned his contract and removed all doubt that he is of greater value relative to pay. I dont see that yet. Time will tell.
For the record, I think that Matthew's, Marner, Reilly, Nylander, Tavaris, Muzzin, Sandin, Lil , Hyman, Dermott and Mik are safe. I see everyone else as requiring a long term evaluation including Anderson.
 

ACC1224

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Some Leaf players don't respond well to the physical style of play and attention they receive.

Case in point Nylander ... 2016-17 .. 6 games 1 goal & 2017-18 .. 7 games 1 goal & 2018-19 .. 7 games 1 goal..

Total 20 NHL Playoff games 3 goals or 1 per 1st round series.

Nylander for me is one of those "under the gun" players in this series that claims he is ready to step up his game to the next level after 3 previous disappointing outings.
I think he'll be fine, expecting a big playoff from him. IMO, he has matured more as a player than any other Leaf.
Keefe will have them prepared for the physical game. They have to find a way for it not to be a factor.
 

JT AM da real deal

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Oct 4, 2018
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1. Andy - all the reasons have been given
2. Dubas/Keefe/Shanny - if their run and gun vision cannot exploit the layoff, their sands of time in Toronto will start running out.
3. The big 3 - got the big bucks, time to get it done for the G.M. that takes the heat over your contracts when results are not there.
4. Tavares - you wanted to win a cup in your home town. Get it done.
5. The defence - time to prove you are not as bad as most of the hockey community thinks you are.
6. Team toughness - cannot allow teams to push you around.
Here here ... it couldn't have been said better
 
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Dekes For Days

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Sep 24, 2018
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Nylander for me is one of those "under the gun" players in this series that claims he is ready to step up his game to the next level after 3 previous disappointing outings.
Nylander does not have 3 previous disappointing outings.
 
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SlpLessInMuskoka18

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Aug 13, 2018
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People have this grand image of Nylander.. and use his projected advance stats versus his real stats way too much to pump him.

Confident high flying Willy is an amazing talent and I'm glad we have him but he can't hold mitchy's jock strap when he's on his game.
 

kb

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Aug 28, 2009
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Are we still on this lacking toughness thing? We lost to 3 better teams, and pushed them all to the limit.
 
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ACC1224

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Are we still on this lacking toughness thing? We lost to 3 better teams, and pushed them all to the limit.
I don't think anyone has said that.
You're correct though, they did lose 3 series to teams that could play a little heavier.
 
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1specter

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Sep 27, 2016
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The supporters of the Barrie trade/hardcore Dubas worshippers (FYI I like Dubas and want him to be GM, I just don't lick his gooch) will be desperately hoping Barrie and Kerfoot have good performances to salvage what has been a bust of a trade. Then there's Andersen who has laid multiple playoff eggs, and the big dough boys Matthews, Marner, Tavares (to a lesser extent, Nylander).
 
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kb

Registered User
Aug 28, 2009
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I don't think anyone has said that.
You're correct though, they did lose 3 series to teams that could play a little heavier.
They may have, but ultimately that isn't the reason they lost. Leafs outhit and outsized the Bruins last year.

IMO the Bruins won because they got timely goaltending, plus they thoroughly outcoached the Leafs, and took advantage of a coach who stubbornly rolled a PK featuring a W playing C with a torn ligament, while also playing a 4th liner more than his #1C in the 3rd period of game 7.
 
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1specter

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Sep 27, 2016
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Nylander does not have 3 previous disappointing outings.
People have amnesia with that 2017 Washington series. Because Matthews and Nylander were bad in 2018 they just lump it in together which is inherently wrong, Nylander was one of our best players against Washington and had a great series overall. Hell, Jake Gardiner was amazing that series and was the #1D, and was also great in 2013 against Boston, but sadly that gets overshadowed by the last two years (one of which he had a bad back).
 

ACC1224

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They may have, but ultimately that isn't the reason they lost. Leafs outhit and outsized the Bruins last year.

IMO the Bruins won because they got timely goaltending, plus they thoroughly outcoached the Leafs, and took advantage of a coach who stubbornly rolled a PK featuring a W playing C with a torn ligament, while also playing a 4th liner more than his #1C in the 4rd period of game 7.
Never said it was 'the reason'. It was one of the reasons as was everything else you listed.
Number of hits isn't a good way to determine the more physical team, IMO.
Being big doesn't mean you'll play heavy either.

I see this playoff being the same. Hopefully their skill with experience will make a bigger difference.
 

X66

114-110
Aug 18, 2008
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Never said it was 'the reason'. It was one of the reasons as was everything else you listed.
Number of hits isn't a good way to determine the more physical team, IMO.
Being big doesn't mean you'll play heavy either.

I see this playoff being the same. Hopefully their skill with experience will make a bigger difference.

Do you think the Leafs were pushed out of either series?

That's a good indicator to show the team can't handle physicality.

Can't say that for any of the last 3 series.
 

1specter

Registered User
Sep 27, 2016
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Hasn't been a factor in the a single playoff series yet under this regime.
IMO, where it does factor in is that since the Bruins have the 'reputation' of being a heavy and physical and dirty team, it works in their favour in terms of what they are allowed to get away with. People here give Kadri shit for what he did, but they don't look at all the things the Bruins got away with, many of which were on par to what Kadri did, if not worse, and were often not even penalized let alone suspended for. Look no further than Zdeno Chara blatantly crosschecking Brendan Gallagher in the face this past season, and even mocking him when he jerked his head back from being hit in the face. What did he get? A f***ing fine, and no penalty.

The narrative around the Leafs is that they are soft, so when they do actually push the physicality and go over the edge they get punished with penalties and suspensions. There is even data that shows that teams that get penalized more also receive more power plays....the refs work a lot based on 'reputation' and 'image' of teams, which is pathetic.

While in game physicality may not be a sole factor or driver in the Leafs not winning the series, it does work against them from the perspective of playing dirty and being able to take liberties like Boston so often does. There is a definite double standard.
 

meefer

Registered User
Jun 9, 2015
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1. Andy - all the reasons have been given
2. Dubas/Keefe/Shanny - if their run and gun vision cannot exploit the layoff, their sands of time in Toronto will start running out.
3. The big 3 - got the big bucks, time to get it done for the G.M. that takes the heat over your contracts when results are not there.
4. Tavares - you wanted to win a cup in your home town. Get it done.
5. The defence - time to prove you are not as bad as most of the hockey community thinks you are.
6. Team toughness - cannot allow teams to push you around.

Fairly stated.
 

ACC1224

Super Elite, Passing ALL Tests since 2002
Aug 19, 2002
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Do you think the Leafs were pushed out of either series?

That's a good indicator to show the team can't handle physicality.

Can't say that for any of the last 3 series.
Not sure what you mean by 'pushed out' but I do think that at times over the course of the series that the Bruins or Capitals were able to dictate the game by playing a heavier style which in part led to their winning. These series were very close with any edge contributing to the outcome.

Columbus will try and do the same but it shouldn't be enough to tilt the series in their favour.
 

BlueBaron

Registered User
May 29, 2006
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1. Freddy-Show us you are the man and our guy going forward.
2. Rielly- Can you play the playoff D we need from our #1?
3. Marner- You are overpaid, prove me wrong.
4. Dermott- You better define a role for yourself before Sandin pushes you out.
5. Keefe- Torts is no slouch, are you up to the task?
 
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ACC1224

Super Elite, Passing ALL Tests since 2002
Aug 19, 2002
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1. Freddy-Show us you are the man and our guy going forward.
2. Rielly- Can you play the playoff D we need from our #1?
3. Marner- You are overpaid, prove me wrong.
4. Dermott- You better define a role for yourself before Sandin pushes you out.
5. Keefe- Torts is no slouch, are you up to the task?
What would Marner need to do to prove himself?
 

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