Your opinions on how to jumpstart hockey in the U.S

[tmunnuch]

Seems like a no brainer: promote roller hockey. Its vastly cheaper to play organized roller hockey than ice hockey. Lower costs => more players => more fans => hockey becomes ingrained in American consciousness.

 

[ChompChomp]

Seems like a no brainer: promote roller hockey. Its vastly cheaper to play organized roller hockey than ice hockey. Lower costs => more players => more fans => hockey becomes ingrained in American consciousness.

Been done. You must not remember the league called "Roller Hockey International."

I am surprised no one looks to TV watchability. Television is how the NFL surpassed the MLB as the national pastime in the US. Nothing else.

 

[Caeldan]

Been done. You must not remember the league called "Roller Hockey International."

I am surprised no one looks to TV watchability. Television is how the NFL surpassed the MLB as the national pastime in the US. Nothing else.

Well both MLB and NFL are the most 'watchable' sports out there, in that they appeal to the ADD crowd. You can sit and watch them in 5 minute intervals, the game is broken down to specific start and stop points.
They're also easier to watch and 'cheer' for without actually having a vested interest in the teams playing. Example in NFL, you can just cheer for the offense either way.
Basketball and Hockey are more fluid, there's no distinct stop/start points outside of the intermissions between frames.

As far as the 'soccer revolution' goes, well in the kids leagues in Canada - soccer (year-round) vs hockey (year-round) associations, I believe soccer now has a higher membership. Again, it's just simply because the cost is lower to get involved. That by far is the biggest barrier of entry to getting a grassroots campaign going anywhere for hockey is that it has a large cost of entry.
As far as why a professional soccer league hasn't taken off in NA (MLS still is largely considered an 'other' league imo) - it's because they're not the premiere league in their respective sport. If you could somehow get EPL games played in NA on a regular basis and have NA teams participate to the point where they can get into the Champions league - you'd probably see it considered more of a major sport in NA.

 

[2023FriendshipTour]

I think it's been said but the NHL needs more advertisment you only really see advertisment during NHL games which doesn't really get the league new fans, Also the idea of getting floor hockey going in schools would be great a lot of kids in the US don't have the luxary of playing ice hockey because all they have is expensive arenas they don't have ice out side... Floor hockey is a fun and cheap alternative a bunch of plastic sticks a little foam type puck ( I loved them ) some cheap goalie pads ( 20 $ for those little street hockey ones ) and a couple nets.

 

[TheSchwab]

Well both MLB and NFL are the most 'watchable' sports out there, in that they appeal to the ADD crowd. You can sit and watch them in 5 minute intervals, the game is broken down to specific start and stop points.
They're also easier to watch and 'cheer' for without actually having a vested interest in the teams playing. Example in NFL, you can just cheer for the offense either way.
Basketball and Hockey are more fluid, there's no distinct stop/start points outside of the intermissions between frames.

As far as the 'soccer revolution' goes, well in the kids leagues in Canada - soccer (year-round) vs hockey (year-round) associations, I believe soccer now has a higher membership. Again, it's just simply because the cost is lower to get involved. That by far is the biggest barrier of entry to getting a grassroots campaign going anywhere for hockey is that it has a large cost of entry.
As far as why a professional soccer league hasn't taken off in NA (MLS still is largely considered an 'other' league imo) - it's because they're not the premiere league in their respective sport. If you could somehow get EPL games played in NA on a regular basis and have NA teams participate to the point where they can get into the Champions league - you'd probably see it considered more of a major sport in NA.

The bolded part I couldn't agree with more. People really don't consider this when they think of what makes a fan, but I really think it factors in. Plus, with sportscenter, you get your highlights and you're on your way.

As for your take on the MLS, its growing. The MLS' interior focus is to grow as a league, but not to forget its roots, which was FIFA suggesting to USA Soccer that it create a small league to develop its National Team program; a program that has made leaps and strides since MLS started in '96. The MLS doesn't necessarily want to become a Super-League like the NHL, NBA, and MLB has. What I mean by this is that its the best league in the world that attracts a lot of foreign talent.

Moreover, ESPN plans on making a major bid for the US broadcast rights for the EPL, which is coming up soon. The UEFA Champions League broadcasts in the early afternoon on ESPN2 have been considered a success, along with ESPN and ESPN2's coverage of the '06 World Cup too.

The CONCACAF (the body that makes up all the teams in North America) does have its own Champions League, and some MLS teams do partake and do well in. But, you'll never see an MLS team in the Champions League you're talking about, because that is under UEFA, and is limited to Europe.

I think it's been said but the NHL needs more advertisment you only really see advertisment during NHL games which doesn't really get the league new fans, Also the idea of getting floor hockey going in schools would be great a lot of kids in the US don't have the luxary of playing ice hockey because all they have is expensive arenas they don't have ice out side... Floor hockey is a fun and cheap alternative a bunch of plastic sticks a little foam type puck ( I loved them ) some cheap goalie pads ( 20 $ for those little street hockey ones ) and a couple nets.

I was just thinking this the other day. Growing up in Central NY, I have skated on Backyard Rinks and Ponds, but not as frequently as the generation before me did. We always liked playing Street Hockey after school and on summer days at the school bball court, and all you need is a stick and a tennis ball for that. We always got kids that didn't play hockey with us to play, as they would play goalie or defense.

Either way, I think the NHL should look into sponsoring nation-wide street hockey tourneys. They are a lot of fun.

 

[ChompChomp]

Well both MLB and NFL are the most 'watchable' sports out there, in that they appeal to the ADD crowd. You can sit and watch them in 5 minute intervals, the game is broken down to specific start and stop points.
They're also easier to watch and 'cheer' for without actually having a vested interest in the teams playing. Example in NFL, you can just cheer for the offense either way.
Basketball and Hockey are more fluid, there's no distinct stop/start points outside of the intermissions between frames.

As far as the 'soccer revolution' goes, well in the kids leagues in Canada - soccer (year-round) vs hockey (year-round) associations, I believe soccer now has a higher membership. Again, it's just simply because the cost is lower to get involved. That by far is the biggest barrier of entry to getting a grassroots campaign going anywhere for hockey is that it has a large cost of entry.
As far as why a professional soccer league hasn't taken off in NA (MLS still is largely considered an 'other' league imo) - it's because they're not the premiere league in their respective sport. If you could somehow get EPL games played in NA on a regular basis and have NA teams participate to the point where they can get into the Champions league - you'd probably see it considered more of a major sport in NA.

Thanks, but you are missing my point though.

My point was that baseball was revered in this country, and since about 1970 the NFL came out of nowhere and took over the mantle as most popular sport in the US. Why? Television. Monday night football made the NFL a big event in primetime TV (and although that has diminished, MNF and SNF still get better ratings than most other sports in the US during the regular season), and the Super Bowl has become the largest television event (sports and non-sports) in the world.

It's all about TV. Yes MLB is watchable on TV, but compared to the NFL, MLB is too slow. The NFL caters to TV (all the TV timeouts make the game horrible to watch in person). For the same reasons that the NFL surpassed the MLB in catering to TV, the NHL could make similar strides and it would have a profound effect.

Soccer in the US flows from a similar premise. Youth soccer has ALWAYS been popular in the US. But soccer on TV is considered a boring watch for Americans, so they don't care about following ANY soccer leagues.

Hockey suffered because it was a horrible watch for the casual viewer in SD. Too hard to follow the puck. HD makes MAJOR improvements, so simply get more broadcasts in HD (all games in HD), get it in as many homes as possible, and get as many HDTV's in homes as possible. More americans will watch the NHL in that case.

Advertisting will help, but for some reason Bettman and the NHL are conservative about advertising and only do it where they broadcast NHL in the US (Versus, NBC, NHL Network). They need to do it everywhere.

 

[TheSchwab]

Some of my ideas for marketing the game we all love:

1. Partnership with the MLS? Hockey and Soccer in this country share a lot of the same fans.

2. NHL 09. There has to be something here, as the game is great and appeals to a lot of typical non hockey fans.

3. Tinker with the newly launched NHL GameCenter. I know I wouldn't pay $165 for all the games online. I do have access to NHL Center Ice, though.

What ya think?

 

[teddygmr]

Get rid of Bettman!
He is simply obnoxious and has absloutely no charisma. Give the job to Pat Quinn!

 

[Guest]

One major theory I've always had with hockey and it's success being limited is two fold.

1) The rules are too complicated for the casual fan. Why are they always stopping the play and waiting around to start back up again? If you watch long enough, or have played, you understand offsides, icing, penalties, etc. However, to the novice fan, it makes no sense and completely breaks the flow of the game.

2) The resources required to take up the sport, safely, are typically too expensive to generate growth. In the cold climates where you can find ice outside, it's relative to being able to find a basketball court or soccer field. The majority of the continent and time of the year conditions do not permit for ice to be down solid enough to skate. On top of that, the gear required to play the game is much more expensive. I don't know how much it costs to play hockey for a kid or group of kids, but compare that to the cost of a basketball, baseball and bat, or soccer ball and the cost is significantly more.

 

[TheSchwab]

One major theory I've always had with hockey and it's success being limited is two fold.

1) The rules are too complicated for the casual fan. Why are they always stopping the play and waiting around to start back up again? If you watch long enough, or have played, you understand offsides, icing, penalties, etc. However, to the novice fan, it makes no sense and completely breaks the flow of the game.

2) The resources required to take up the sport, safely, are typically too expensive to generate growth. In the cold climates where you can find ice outside, it's relative to being able to find a basketball court or soccer field. The majority of the continent and time of the year conditions do not permit for ice to be down solid enough to skate. On top of that, the gear required to play the game is much more expensive. I don't know how much it costs to play hockey for a kid or group of kids, but compare that to the cost of a basketball, baseball and bat, or soccer ball and the cost is significantly more.

Really? Hockey actually has the most sporting action time compared to other sports.

And I don't totally disagree with #2 there, but at the same time I can tell you I played hockey my whole childhood, and some of the best times I had weren't on the ice. Off the ice, during the summer, with 20 neighborhood kids playing ball hockey down at the schools basketball court. All you need is sticks, a net, and a tennis ball. From the business perspective, all I care about is getting kids to become fans of the game so they could maybe have their kids play the game.

 

[Jonas1235]

They should promote hockey video games more. NHL 09 is a terrific game and has probably gotten a ton of people into hockey. I don't think it is a coincidence that viewership amongst 18-25 year olds have gone up two-fold since the lockout. The hockey video games are terrific and gets young people into the game. The games help explain the rules and strategy that goes into hockey.

 

[Caeldan]

Off the ice, during the summer, with 20 neighborhood kids playing ball hockey down at the schools basketball court. All you need is sticks, a net, and a tennis ball. From the business perspective, all I care about is getting kids to become fans of the game so they could maybe have their kids play the game.

Compared to just bringing a basketball or soccer ball down if you wanted to play on that same court for those sports.

 

[TheSchwab]

Compared to just bringing a basketball or soccer ball down if you wanted to play on that same court for those sports.

OK, yes, but at the same time ball hockey is 10X easier to be able to play than ice hockey.

 

[Jonas1235]

One of the big problems is that hockey is only "popular" in lets say 20 states. That's less than half the country. The states like New Mexico, Louisiana, Alabama, Arkansas, Utah, Montana and others don't have experience in hockey. These states could build rinks and youth hockey systems but it is expensive and there's no influence there.

Hockey in Nashville has taken off because they have a team and know what hockey is. Hockey in California has also taken off because they have 3 teams. States that don't have teams or solid college systems don't follow hockey. That's what the problem is.

 

[Buffaloed]

The only way I see for hockey to become massively popular is a return to the 70's "Old Time Hockey":

Make helmets optional
Eliminate the instigator rule
Eliminate the 3rd man in rule
Allow hitting from behind
Goalies out of the crease are fair game
Eliminate the 2nd referee
Get rid of the rigid boards/seamless glass

Violence is a highly marketable commodity. I honestly don't think we'd be seeing the kind of cheap shots we do these days if players were held accountable by each other.

 

[DHD14]

Introduce gambling into hockey and more people would be interested and become much more passionate about their teams with their money on the line! I know some may say this is a bit ridiculous but I am currently working at an English premier league club handling pre game betting and it is so ingrained to their fan culture that not only does it produce millions based on the actual betting, but it creates fans who follow the action that much more intensely, creating an atmosphere in which everyone wants to be a part of. This drives up TV viewership and attendance.

To implement this into hockey would obviously take a lot of time (This has been custom in the UK for years) but I really do feel it could work. Getting around all of the legislation and everything is another story however...

 

[TheSchwab]

Introduce gambling into hockey and more people would be interested and become much more passionate about their teams with their money on the line! I know some may say this is a bit ridiculous but I am currently working at an English premier league club handling pre game betting and it is so ingrained to their fan culture that not only does it produce millions based on the actual betting, but it creates fans who follow the action that much more intensely, creating an atmosphere in which everyone wants to be a part of. This drives up TV viewership and attendance.

To implement this into hockey would obviously take a lot of time (This has been custom in the UK for years) but I really do feel it could work. Getting around all of the legislation and everything is another story however...

You can bet on games, easily as a matter of fact...

How would you suggest to promote it in a good fashion in the US, though?

Proline.ca does some good commercials which I catch sometimes on CBC, but I don't understand how a good connection between gambling and the league could happen.

I don't disagree with your idea though. I have bet on tennis matches and watched them in entirety because of this.

 

[Buffaloed]

You can bet on games, easily as a matter of fact...

How would you suggest to promote it in a good fashion in the US, though?

It could catch on if online betting is legalized in the US. I don't expect the US to continue to defy the WTO ruling. Currently games can only be bet on in Las Vegas and there really aren't enough betters there who understand the game well enough to wager on it. One result of the lack of wagering on hockey is the vague injury reports. If a lot of money was riding on it that injury info would have too much value to be kept secret. They'd have to adopt a policy similar to the NFL.

 

[Stone87]

1. More American Born Players

The only American born player near the top of the scoring race is Zach Parise. If the NHL is going to get bigger in the U.S it needs more marketable star players from the United States.

2. Successful Teams in Major Metro Areas

New York, Los Angeles, Chicago, Miami, Washington, Atlanta, and Boston are some of the biggest metros in the nation and have not put consistently good teams on the ice during the past decade. Houston doesn't even have a team leaving Dallas, and Philly as the only consistently successful franchises in the top 10.

3. More Scoring

I think the NHL really missed an opportunity after the lockout when it implemented all of the rule changes. What was obstruction then is not what is being called obstruction today and that has caused scoring to drop. There were a lot of complaints as the time that the game wasn't physical enough and I think that may have been accurate. The NHL should bring in real fans of the game and review lots of different plays in order to figure out exactly what is the difference between a boring game, and an exciting one.

4. Better Presentation

I've watched a lot of hockey with people who are not fans of the game and like it or not people who don't watch much hockey can't follow the puck. If you want new fans then you're going to have to find a way around this. I'm not sure if the answer is another more hi-tech variation of the glow puck, hd tv, or different colored ice, but there has to be a better way to present the game.

5. Outdoor Games

This is sort of a no brainer. I think the NHL could bump the number of these from one to two per year. Have one in the United States on New Years Day and another one in Canada on Thanksgiving or Christmas. This way the NHL doesn't have to worry about a Canadian team winning the bid which would kill ratings in the United States.

 

[DHD14]

You can bet on games, easily as a matter of fact...

How would you suggest to promote it in a good fashion in the US, though?

Proline.ca does some good commercials which I catch sometimes on CBC, but I don't understand how a good connection between gambling and the league could happen.

I don't disagree with your idea though. I have bet on tennis matches and watched them in entirety because of this.

Yeah it is easy to bet on games definitely, but in Ontario(not sure how different parts of the US do it) we have Pro Line, which is an accumulator and so you have to bet on more than one game (3-6 choices) generally and this betting is all done away from the arena, at least I cannot recall ever seeing a Pro Line booth at the ACC.

At the club I work at there is an entire department devoted to pre game betting done at the stadium. Odds on everything from the win, what the score will be, who will score, when the first goal will be scored, etc are produced onto betting cards. These cards are then distributed throughout the stadium. This would be a huge money maker for teams and the league and also enhance its popularity I feel. Obviously this is something that would take a long time to implement as there are so many rules and regulations regarding gambling, but I feel it is an area for potential growth for the NHL.

 

[NANDOAL]

Introduce gambling into hockey and more people would be interested and become much more passionate about their teams with their money on the line! I know some may say this is a bit ridiculous but I am currently working at an English premier league club handling pre game betting and it is so ingrained to their fan culture that not only does it produce millions based on the actual betting, but it creates fans who follow the action that much more intensely, creating an atmosphere in which everyone wants to be a part of. This drives up TV viewership and attendance.

To implement this into hockey would obviously take a lot of time (This has been custom in the UK for years) but I really do feel it could work. Getting around all of the legislation and everything is another story however...

I agree. Hockey betting is money lines and odds, which doesn't excite the average gambler. Why can't it be Capitals -1.5 Lightning? I'd bet If it were easier like that.

 

[Caeldan]

OK, yes, but at the same time ball hockey is 10X easier to be able to play than ice hockey.

Yeah, but the issue is that there's easier sports out there.

What my friends and I used to do was play something we called 'sockey'...

Essentially you kick a tennis ball around, but goalies are allowed a glove/hat to catch with and potentially a mini stick...

It was hell on shoes (i think i went through a pair a month during fall/spring school years) since our entire playground was blacktop There was also the issue of the tennis ball going through (or over) the chainlink fence into the grumpy old lady's backyard.

 

[ChompChomp]

leaving Dallas, and Philly as the only consistently successful franchises in the top 10.

You forgot San Jose, a part of the SF Bay Area, the #4 US Media market in the Country, just behind NYC, LA, and Chicago. The Sharks have been more successful in the last 10 years than the Flyers that's for sure.

 

[Captain Mittens*]

Stop having labor disputes