Speculation: Would Buffalo be interested in Zaitsev?

[Gabrielor]

I’ll never understand why people on this site make a proposal that includes them getting a player (Nylander), that they then proceed to shit on in multiple posts.

Why do you want him then??? Because the humble fans of Toronto want to “help Buffalo out”? Get out of here with this.

 

[Bufbro]

Can someone explain to me why Nylander is so highly touted?

Nylander:
0.43 PPG (18 Years Old) 28P/65GP [AHL]
0.53 PPG (19 Years Old) 27P/51GP [AHL]
0.57 PPG (20 Years Old) 24P/42GP [AHL] (This Year)

Bracco:
0.64 PPG (20 Years Old) 32P/50GP [AHL]
1.02 PPG (21 Years Old) 49P/48GP [AHL] (This Year)

Now, I get that Nylander was an 8th overall pick, but he plays the same position as Bracco, his contract is the same length as Bracco (Nylander is $21,000 more/year), he is scoring at a lower rate than Bracco even at the same age.

Is he rated so highly because of his name? Does he play a style I don't know about? Or is he rated high simply because he was an 8th OA pick?

Or am I missing something here?

Pedigree, tol
Ols, draft position all factor in. He has all the parts to make him a star and he's still young enough to realize them. If you compare him only based on points, that's short sighted. You don't trade for 20 year Olds based on what they ARE, you trade for them based on what they could become.

 

[LucicAndChong]

Pedigree, tol
Ols, draft position all factor in. He has all the parts to make him a star and he's still young enough to realize them. If you compare him only based on points, that's short sighted. You don't trade for 20 year Olds based on what they ARE, you trade for them based on what they could become.

And what about Bracco says he can’t be a star?

Also remember, Nial Yakapov was a 1st OA pick and now he isn’t in the NHL so tell me again how Draft position matters, and pedigree based on what? Name? Leafs have a Subban who plays defence too, can we ask for a 1st for him? He’s younger than his brother too!

 

[Cardiac Jerks]

I’ll never understand why people on this site make a proposal that includes them getting a player (Nylander), that they then proceed to **** on in multiple posts.

Why do you want him then??? Because the humble fans of Toronto want to “help Buffalo out”? Get out of here with this.

That’s the standard procedure.

I’d really like to see one of those posters try it out during their next car purchase and see how it goes for them.

 

[Canes]

That’s the standard procedure.

I’d really like to see one of those posters try it out during their next car purchase and see how it goes for them.

It's okay, they can just get mommy and daddy to negotiate for them.

 

[bleedgreen]

This isn’t even a real rumor, just baseless and hopeless speculation. I doubt you could pay someone to take him. No point to the thread, Buffalo isn’t interested.

 

[is the answer jesus]

can you explain to me how 2 players who are scoring at almost the same PPG can be considered a high upside prospect and a dime-a-dozen prospect?

Or is it just because he is a leafs prospect? Nylander isn’t as good as you think, and only reason people rate him better than he is is because of name recognition

Nylander was a top 10 pick and is still just 20 years old. At this point his development hasn't gone anywhere near as well as expected, but there has been flashes (he had a very good camp this year, some good showings at the WJC). Again the potential is high. That's why he was an early 1st round pick. Would I bet the farm that he reaches that potential? No. Would I rather have him than a prospect that's 2 years older and doesn't have the same pedigree? Yes. Every team in the NHL has a late round guy that has done ok in the AHL and looks like they might become an NHL player. Hence he's a dime a dozen prospect.

 

[Baksfamous112]

Absolutely no one is touching Zaitsev contract, let alone sending assets the other way.

You’re stuck with him. End of story

 

[ChurchOfMatthews]

Contract aside how is Zaitsev is he a serviceable 3rd pair or is he hot trash?

The latter.

 

[TheDoldrums]

But I have to wonder if his Euro Scouting gave him bad advice on this one. Vuori and Bergman?

Now you're trying to blame an amateur scout based in Sweden for the extension? The idea that Bergman was giving advice to Lou on Zaitsev's contract is completely nonsensical. Next you'll be blaming Carlton.

 

[Blitz]

Hard no. Only way I'm touching Zatsiev's contract is if the Leafs take Okposo's. You can shop elsewhere for help getting out of cap hell.

This.

The only way I touch that Zaitsev deal is if I'm getting rid of the K.O. deal and getting a #2C back in Kadri... Toronto would literally have to pay me to take it...

To
RW Kyle Okposo ($6M AAV UFA in '23/'24
D Nathan Beaulieu ($2.4M AAV RFA in '19/'20

To
C Nazem Kadri ($4.5M AAV UFA in '22/'23
D Nikita Zaitsev $4.5M AAV UFA in '23/'24

 

[The Winter Soldier]

Now you're trying to blame an amateur scout based in Sweden for the extension? The idea that Bergman was giving advice to Lou on Zaitsev's contract is completely nonsensical. Next you'll be blaming Carlton.

I think it's funnier that you think you know he didn't. By the way do you have any proof on that. Bergman has been the chief European scout for the Leafs for over a decade. You think being the chief Eurpean scout for a team he would have never heard of Zaitsev. lol. The thought he had no input on Zaitsev is laughable.

 

[LucicAndChong]

This.

The only way I touch that Zaitsev deal is if I'm getting rid of the K.O. deal and getting a #2C back in Kadri... Toronto would literally have to pay me to take it...

To
RW Kyle Okposo ($6M AAV UFA in '23/'24
D Nathan Beaulieu ($2.4M AAV RFA in '19/'20

To
C Nazem Kadri ($4.5M AAV UFA in '22/'23
D Nikita Zaitsev $4.5M AAV UFA in '23/'24

This... this is actually ridiculous. How does my post get mocked and this is ok???

 

[LucicAndChong]

That’s the standard procedure.

I’d really like to see one of those posters try it out during their next car purchase and see how it goes for them.

That’s literally how you negotiate... like, what?!?

 

[82Ninety42011]

The latter.

Interesting others have said he's an over paid 3rd pairing caliber layer.

 

[LucicAndChong]

I’ll never understand why people on this site make a proposal that includes them getting a player (Nylander), that they then proceed to **** on in multiple posts.

Why do you want him then??? Because the humble fans of Toronto want to “help Buffalo out”? Get out of here with this.

I want him because his brother is on the leafs, and I’m sending you back a better player in Bracco...

 

[Cardiac Jerks]

That’s literally how you negotiate... like, what?!?

Not the way it’s done on hf.

 

[TheDoldrums]

I think it's funnier that you think you know he didn't. By the way do you have any proof on that. Bergman has been the chief European scout for the Leafs for over a decade. You think being the chief Eurpean scout for a team he would have never heard of Zaitsev. lol. The thought he had no input on Zaitsev is laughable.

This simply isn't true. He's not the chief European scout. He only scouts Swedish draft prospects, finding late round gems like Johnsson. He would have zero input on the contract extension of a Russian pro who had already been with the Leafs for a year.

 

[Mickey Marner]

Way too much happening in these trades. Retaining on Zaitsev makes trading him redundant if the entire point of trading him is to lose his salary. Might as well buy him out if you need to retain and attach an asset.

 

[indigobuffalo]

Contract aside how is Zaitsev is he a serviceable 3rd pair or is he hot trash?

He gets a lot of hate in Toronto because someone has to.

He’s actually got some decent skills, he’s being thrust on the responsibility of playing a defensive role on a pairing with Gardiner but actually historically he’s more of a mobile offensive dman, at least that’s what he was back in the KHL.

He’s got a good shot but seldom uses it. I’m not sure why his development has stagnated so much in Toronto. A large part of it seems to be due to Gardiner being seen as the go-to offensive guy, so Zaitsev usually dishes to Gardiner who then feeds the forwards.

Zaitsev has a lot of comparables to Lidstrom. And yes, obviously no where near the same overall skill level, but Lidstrom-lite is a good way of qualifying him.

Where he’s doing poorly is gap control, and hockey IQ. He too often is letting the opposition gain the zone and establish a cycle with impunity, and he seems to be quite uncoordinated with Gardiner in the defensive zone, leading to a lot of scoring chances that seemed highly preventable.

In the few games where he’s been partnered with someone else, he’s done a lot better. I feel like it’s just a by-product of the Leafs’ backend. He’s unquestionably our best RHD but not good enough to be on the top line. So he defaults to the 2nd pairing but he’s not well suited to pairing with Gardiner.

Babcock still wants him used more than the 3rd pairing though. So he won’t keep him Dermott, although that’s probably the best slot for him.

His contract is fair. Not great and not an albatross like some Leafs fans believe.

And in years 5-7 will look like a steal because he’s only going to get better.

 

[LucicAndChong]

Not the way it’s done on hf.

so youre saying the way people do it in real life is wrong, but the way strangers argue over the internet is right...?

ok now I see your logic thank you.

 

[LucicAndChong]

Way too much happening in these trades. Retaining on Zaitsev makes trading him redundant if the entire point of trading him is to lose his salary. Might as well buy him out if you need to retain and attach an asset.

retaining $675K isnt going to break the leafs, that wont even be the value of a league min contract next year. It is still possible to get everyone signed with zaitsev, but it will be a hell of a lot easier without him, even without 85% of him.

 

[The Winter Soldier]

This simply isn't true. He's not the chief European scout. He only scouts Swedish draft prospects, finding late round gems like Johnsson. He would have zero input on the contract extension of a Russian pro who had already been with the Leafs for a year.

Do you know this as a fact? I doubt it. Ari Vuori is the Director of European scouting. Thommie Bergman is the chief european scout. If 2 guys know more about eurpean players it is these 2 guys. It's not that hard keeping track with the KHL in europe. Not sure why you so defensive here for Bergman.

 

[Cardiac Jerks]

so youre saying the way people do it in real life is wrong, but the way strangers argue over the internet is right...?

ok now I see your logic thank you.

Nope, I’m saying the way people do it on hf is not how you negotiate in real life.

Being rude and trying to devalue someone’s asset isn’t going to get you a better price - it’s going to get you hung up on or shown the door.

 

[TheDoldrums]

Do you know this as a fact? I doubt it. Ari Vuori is the Director of European scouting. Thommie Bergman is the chief european scout. If 2 guys know more about eurpean players it is these 2 guys. It's not that hard keeping track with the KHL in europe. Not sure why you so defensive here for Bergman.

I'm defending the logic that an amateur scout whos job is to scout Swedish draft prospects wasn't involved in the contract negotiations for Zatisev. You're just spinning your wheels trying to find any way to take the blame off of Lou.