Prospect Info: With the #86 pick, the Wild select (C) Alexander Khovanov (QMJHL, Moncton Wildcats)

[FrodoBeggins]

Kaprizov - Khovanov - Sokolov )))

 

[FrodoBeggins]

I think he should not play in Quebec. Send it to Finland or Sweden.

 

[Wabit]

I think he should not play in Quebec. Send it to Finland or Sweden.

I feel that way about the entire CHL.

 

[Dr Jan Itor]

Nah. Keep him there. Let's see what he can do with full healthy season.

 

[Atas2000]

A Russian playing in the QMJHL is different than a Russian playing in the KHL.

Yes, a Russian playing in the KHL is way more likely to become a productive NHLer.

 

[Digitalbooya]

Yes, a Russian playing in the KHL is way more likely to become a productive NHLer.

Way more likely to stay in the KHL (vs other leagues) and never become an NHLer too.

 

[Atas2000]

Way more likely to stay in the KHL (vs other leagues) and never become an NHLer too.

LOL Ignore the facts. Preach a false narrrative. Can I have a list of names?

 

[Digitalbooya]

LOL Ignore the facts. Preach a false narrrative. Can I have a list of names?

I’m not particular with names but if you choose to ignore the KHL as a serious issue to players coming to the NHL that’s your own prerogative. The KHL isn’t like other leagues. They have the resources and the means to keep players in their league (see Kaprizov politics). Junior leagues are not like that.

 

[Atas2000]

I’m not particular with names but if you choose to ignore the KHL as a serious issue to players coming to the NHL that’s your own prerogative. The KHL isn’t like other leagues. They have the resources and the means to keep players in their league (see Kaprizov politics). Junior leagues are not like that.

The problem of that narrative of yours is that you make it sound like players are not free to choose. It is Kaprizov's personal choice to mature in the KHL. The proper choice too if you look at all the failures produced out of young Russians in NA. In the end NHL teams if they were smart should pursue Russians to develop in the KHL instead of NA minors and not the other way round. For their own good. They'd get more out of their prospects in due time. Presenting a player developing in Russia as a risk is the very mistake ppl in NA make.

Look it up. All Russians who have success in NA developed in Russia beyond their draft day while the players who chose to go to NA more often than not become dissappointments. It's mind boggling how NHL teams just waste their resources(picks/prospects) with a strategy proven wrong empirically. Yes, it's different with Russians, but can't we expect some smarts and flexibility from people who are designated pros at scouting/developing players? Btw a lot of Swedes develop at home too, because the SHL has proven to be a good enough league for that. Better than NA minors. Ask Dahlin who hasn't played a day in NA leagues.

And then each and every Russian who's had any success in the KHL has ultimately given the NHL a try. Not everyone succeeds, but that's natural.

If you think that there even an outside chance Kaprizov would never come to NA you are just terribly mistaken. Same goes for all russian prospects who are worth mentioning. And if a guy is just not progressing in Russia, do you think he would rip it in the NHL?

By now there are numerous examples for everthvariation of a development path. There is Nichushkin who ran off to NA early and regressed. Mark my words, Dallas will be very unhappy with the contract they gave him now. Maybe if they hadn't rushed him to leave Russia they'd have a better asset now. There are guys tried and failed like Tikhonov. There are players successfully revived by the KHL like Dadonov. But they all try to make the NHL at some point.

 

[gphr513]

This might be my favorite pick of the draft, seems to have some real potential.

 

[nickschultzfan]

The problem of that narrative of yours is that you make it sound like players are not free to choose. It is Kaprizov's personal choice to mature in the KHL. The proper choice too if you look at all the failures produced out of young Russians in NA. In the end NHL teams if they were smart should pursue Russians to develop in the KHL instead of NA minors and not the other way round. For their own good. They'd get more out of their prospects in due time. Presenting a player developing in Russia as a risk is the very mistake ppl in NA make.

Look it up. All Russians who have success in NA developed in Russia beyond their draft day while the players who chose to go to NA more often than not become dissappointments. It's mind boggling how NHL teams just waste their resources(picks/prospects) with a strategy proven wrong empirically. Yes, it's different with Russians, but can't we expect some smarts and flexibility from people who are designated pros at scouting/developing players? Btw a lot of Swedes develop at home too, because the SHL has proven to be a good enough league for that. Better than NA minors. Ask Dahlin who hasn't played a day in NA leagues.

And then each and every Russian who's had any success in the KHL has ultimately given the NHL a try. Not everyone succeeds, but that's natural.

If you think that there even an outside chance Kaprizov would never come to NA you are just terribly mistaken. Same goes for all russian prospects who are worth mentioning. And if a guy is just not progressing in Russia, do you think he would rip it in the NHL?

By now there are numerous examples for everthvariation of a development path. There is Nichushkin who ran off to NA early and regressed. Mark my words, Dallas will be very unhappy with the contract they gave him now. Maybe if they hadn't rushed him to leave Russia they'd have a better asset now. There are guys tried and failed like Tikhonov. There are players successfully revived by the KHL like Dadonov. But they all try to make the NHL at some point.

I think the primary "concern" with drafting Russian KHL players has little to do with the players or the league really.

It is all about the compensation and non-league forces that want a 22 year old star player to forgo the NHL and make millions of dollars tax free by "staying home".

High end Russian players often have to take a pay cut to play in the NHL, at least at first.

Nobody can really just pretend that isn't a factor when drafting players.

 

[AKL]

This might be my favorite pick of the draft, seems to have some real potential.

Same. I'm practically salivating at the thought of what this guy could be if he puts it together. Another Kaprizov maybe?

 

[TaLoN]

Same. I'm practically salivating at the thought of what this guy could be if he puts it together. Another Kaprizov maybe?

We don't even know what Kaprizov is yet though at this point.

 

[AKL]

We don't even know what Kaprizov is yet though at this point.

An exciting prospect whom the sky is the limit for. I'm not about to go comparing Khovanov (or Kaprizov for that matter) to someone like Kuznetsov yet. Though, at least Kaprizov has put up similar numbers at the same age in the KHL as some of the Russian greats, as you know.

 

[TaLoN]

An exciting prospect whom the sky is the limit for. I'm not about to go comparing Khovanov (or Kaprizov for that matter) to someone like Kuznetsov yet. Though, at least Kaprizov has put up similar numbers at the same age in the KHL as some of the Russian greats, as you know.

I think the new kid is already an exciting prospect where the sky is the limit though is my point...

You said once he puts it together and we find out what he could be... Kaprizov maybe?

I think that ends up as a redundant statement is all.

 

[AKL]

I think the new kid is already an exciting prospect where the sky is the limit though is my point...

You said once he puts it together and we find out what he could be... Kaprizov maybe?

I think that ends up as a redundant statement is all.

Fair, he's definitely exciting. But he still hasn't shown the (albeit, limited) results that Kaprizov has. What I mean is, Kaprizov is an exciting prospect for whom the sky is the limit, AND he's put up some numbers to give you a reason to believe he could get there. Khovanov is an exciting prospect for whom the sky is the limit, but he hasn't put those numbers up anywhere that truly matters yet.

 

[TaLoN]

Fair, he's definitely exciting. But he still hasn't shown the (albeit, limited) results that Kaprizov has. What I mean is, Kaprizov is an exciting prospect for whom the sky is the limit, AND he's put up some numbers to give you a reason to believe he could get there. Khovanov is an exciting prospect for whom the sky is the limit, but he hasn't put those numbers up anywhere that truly matters yet.

Kaprizov hadn't when he was drafted either... lack of opportunity to do so doesn't make me down on him by comparison.

I'm just as excited to have this kid now as when we drafted Kaprizov is what I'm saying.

I will admit, my excitement has not changed on Kaprizov since we drafted him. Putting up the numbers he's put up just didn't cause the excitement to dim any.

We still don't know what we have in him as an NHL player, but we are excited at the possibilities if/when we find out.

 

[WildcatMapleLeafs28]

This kid could be a steal or a bust. He looked a little out of place this season in Moncton. Speed wasn't there either but I'll cut him some slack due to missing the first half with Hep A. He does have good vision , great hands and quick release. He also plays with an edge, certainly doesn't shy away from the physical play. He'll need to improve his speed and conditioning this season and well as cutting down on penalties. Big off season for him , hopefully he makes the best of it. He certainly will have a great opportunity next season in Moncton.

 

[Zine]

I think the primary "concern" with drafting Russian KHL players has little to do with the players or the league really.

It is all about the compensation and non-league forces that want a 22 year old star player to forgo the NHL and make millions of dollars tax free by "staying home".

High end Russian players often have to take a pay cut to play in the NHL, at least at first.

Nobody can really just pretend that isn't a factor when drafting players.

Money is just part the larger equation.
Concern exists because the KHL is a lucrative alternative to the NHL, and it provides Russians with options. The NHL is very weary of not having complete control over their assets.

Sans a few players here and there, all our best will eventually go to NA, so that’s only a piece of the contentious issue. However because the KHL offers options, you’re unlikely to see a Russian willing to ‘pay his dues’ for too long if sent to the AHL, or if he thinks he’s getting jerked around in the NHL. I’d assume this plays more of a factor.

 

[Wabit]

Money is just part the larger equation.
Concern exists because the KHL is lucrative alternative to the NHL system, and it provides Russians with options . The NHL is very weary of this because they prefer complete control over their assets.

Sans a few players here and there, all our best will eventually go to NA, so that’s only a piece of the contentious issue. However because the KHL offers options, you won’t see many players willing to ‘pay their dues’ for too long if sent to the AHL, or if they think they’re getting jerked around in the NHL. I’d assume this plays more of a factor.

Culture shock, ego, better players top to bottom on most NHL rosters, and smaller ice play a role too.

 

[Zine]

Culture shock, ego, better players top to bottom on most NHL rosters, and smaller ice play a role too.

Agree, except for the ego part. Our players aren't more egotistical than anyone else.

But I understand how doing what’s in one’s perceived best interest (given more options to work with) can be come across as egotistical, entitled or spoiled.

 

[BagHead]

Agree, except for the ego part. Our players aren't more egotistical than anyone else.

But I understand how doing what’s in one’s perceived best interest (given more options to work with) can be come across as egotistical, entitled or spoiled.

I agree, they're not more egotistical than anyone else, and I don't want to put words into Wabit's mouth, but I think ego is a factor. It's not that Russian guys have a larger ego, it's just that they're used to being one of the best players on their team, but when they come over, they may just be a middle six player, or even need AHL time to adapt. It's hard for anyone to take a "demotion" like that. You don't even need a big ego to not enjoy such a thing.

 

[Saga of the Elk]

The ice sheet is the bigger adjustment than any psychology. Guys grow up with time to handle the puck, to shoot, to make passes. This benefits the most skilled. In North America it can be much more of a chip, grind, game that takes away your best skills and rewards strength and skating. Guys that aren't skilled at the level of Malkin, Radulov, Kucherov find themselves in the AHL trying to learn a new style after 20 years. I'm sure that sucks for some so they head to the KHL for more money and familiarity.

Back to Khovanov, pretty interesting that the top three U-17 scorers in the MHL a couple seasons ago all got drafted: Marchenko to Columbus (2nd round), Denisenko to Florida (1st), Khovanov to MN (3rd). Similar stat lines but the other guys flatlined in their draft seasons in the MHL, while Khovanov came to the Q as 2nd overall pick in the Import Draft. How was this guy rated so low?

 

[Bazeek]

The ice sheet is the bigger adjustment than any psychology. Guys grow up with time to handle the puck, to shoot, to make passes. This benefits the most skilled. In North America it can be much more of a chip, grind, game that takes away your best skills and rewards strength and skating. Guys that aren't skilled at the level of Malkin, Radulov, Kucherov find themselves in the AHL trying to learn a new style after 20 years. I'm sure that sucks for some so they head to the KHL for more money and familiarity.

Back to Khovanov, pretty interesting that the top three U-17 scorers in the MHL a couple seasons ago all got drafted: Marchenko to Columbus (2nd round), Denisenko to Florida (1st), Khovanov to MN (3rd). Similar stat lines but the other guys flatlined in their draft seasons in the MHL, while Khovanov came to the Q as 2nd overall pick in the Import Draft. How was this guy rated so low?

On the one hand I kind of wonder if Russians and Euros are more likely than Canadians or Americans to get written off after health/injury issues, but hepatits A does inject some legitimate uncertainty into his development. Falling to the 7th a la Sokolov would have been pretty ridiculous, but maybe dropping the mid-3rd in a draft where 20-50 was seen as kind of a jumble was inevitable?

 

[Nsjohnson]

On the one hand I kind of wonder if Russians and Euros are more likely than Canadians or Americans to get written off after health/injury issues, but hepatits A does inject some legitimate uncertainty into his development. Falling to the 7th a la Sokolov would have been pretty ridiculous, but maybe dropping the mid-3rd in a draft where 20-50 was seen as kind of a jumble was inevitable?

Yeah exactly. He didn't fall to the end of the draft. He went in the 3rd where many guys can fall to.

I think if scouts saw a healthy Khoconut all season he would have put up better numbers, developed a bit more, and have gone in the 1st round, mid to late, as he's a C.

The kid is talented. Period.