Winnipeg Police arrest Scalpers (Jets Ticket Scalpers)

Discussion in 'Fugu's Business of Hockey Forum' started by Fehr Time*, Oct 7, 2011.

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  1. Fehr Time*

    Fehr Time* Guest

    http://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/manitoba/story/2011/10/07/mb-ticket-scalping-winnipeg.html

    Can you believe this nonsense? Apparently the police in Winnipeg are now acting as the exclusive law enforcement of TNSE. Who the heck goes out of their way to enforce scalping laws these days? Apparently supply and demand economics are a foreign concept in Winnipeg. The only ones who did anything wrong here was TNSE for incorrectly reading the marketplace for tickets when determining their pricing. Now it looks like they are whining about it.

    A black mark IMO on the return of the NHL to Winnipeg. For shame. :shakehead
     
    Last edited by moderator : Oct 7, 2011
  2. Swedish Puck Mafia

    Swedish Puck Mafia Best Poster 2013

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    The free market doesn't determine ticket prices, the originator of the tickets determine the prices.
     
  3. The King of Town

    The King of Town Registered User

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    Seriously?

    Scalping's against the law. Deal with it.
     
  4. No Fun Shogun

    No Fun Shogun 34-38-61-10-13-15

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    Scalpers suck, so what?
     
  5. Fixed to Ruin

    Fixed to Ruin Come wit it now!

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    Book em' Lou
     
  6. Duke749

    Duke749 Formerly "BigTuna49"

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    Black mark? :laugh: Yeah, ok. :whatever:
     
  7. Bozle

    Bozle Showtime, baby

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    Scalping is against the law.

    When you break a law, you pay the consequences.

    I don't see the issue.
     
  8. Buckets and Gloves

    Buckets and Gloves klaatu barada nikto

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    scalpers are the scum of the earth who leetch on the hopes and dreams of unwavering fans.... I hope they lock up these sorry excuses of human beings who prey on fans of the game.
     
  9. Sundance

    Sundance You Can Never Get To

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    Scalping is perfectly legal...as long as it's not on the premesis of the event.
    This is a dick move by TNSE, sticking it to the fans. Tut, tut.
     
  10. Fehr Time*

    Fehr Time* Guest

    Really? Do we need to have a lesson on basic supply and demand economics here?
     
  11. pdxshark

    pdxshark Registered User

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    someone just learned about adam smith :sarcasm:

    Scalping is wrong. Jacking up prices due to low supply is not a market dynamic, its called taking advantage of a shortage. Not going to go on a pedestal or anything but why would there be outrage over the police enforcing a well known law?
     
  12. Fordy

    Fordy the kid signify

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    I don't know anyone that likes and supports scalping except... scalpers.
     
  13. SJSharks2010

    SJSharks2010 Registered User

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    Wow really? Sympathy for the scalpers (criminals)? How about some sympathy for the people who can't afford to pay exorbitant prices for tickets to a sporting event?
    MOD
     
    Last edited by moderator : Oct 7, 2011
  14. Duke749

    Duke749 Formerly "BigTuna49"

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    No, but I think we need a lesson in what is against the law...
     
  15. Fehr Time*

    Fehr Time* Guest

    That is in the eyes of the beholder, as per usual.
     
  16. Whileee

    Whileee Registered User

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    Didn't season ticket purchasers sign and agreement indicating that they would not scalp tickets? If so, would you also say that signing a contract should not bind the parties signing it?
     
  17. Fugu

    Fugu Guest


    I think there are two key issues, obviously. If scalpers can charge exorbitant prices, it indicates that the issuing party (TNSE) left a lot of money on the table. It could be argued that they didn't want to make it a rich man's game in Winnipeg, but altruists are hard to find in the business world.

    Of course, as you point out, a contractual agreement was entered into, and perhaps more importantly, business was able to get government to pass laws that disallow resales.

    That said, what exactly is illegal about buying a product and then selling it at a profit. It is a market, and the products aren't illegal or otherwise controlled substances.
     
  18. Silver

    Silver Registered User

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    Sure, but you can make the argument that the Winnipeg Police shouldn't be acting as TNSE's contract enforcement agents.
     
  19. Burningblades

    Burningblades Registered User

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    Manitoba law, you are not allowed to scalp tickets for more then face value.

    when you are breaking the law I think it is ok for the Police to get involved
     
  20. VelvetJones

    VelvetJones Registered User

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    Professional scalpers are scum.
     
  21. ur almost right

    ur almost right Registered User

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    A serious over-look in all of this.

    At what point is it "scalping"?

    Not sure of all the practices of MOST of you're respective cities, but I'm aware of events that happen in MB, AB, and BC. (as I have lived in all).

    A company, and I will link it if needed (though don't find it to be, as there have been MANY) has "auctioned off" some of their season tickets to Wpg Jets home opener.
    The company paid, "insert amount here" for their season tickets, and decided to offer up a pair for an "open market", providing they made a donation to a local charity.

    Said tickets went on to fetch $11,000+. Does "chairity" trump "scalping" ?

    I LOVE the fact that people/companies are doing this; offering up tickets for those who didn't get any. But, those same tickets, sold for $11,000+.

    Radio stations, online contests, in-store draws, and "$1-2-3 etc" raffles actually DO give the tickets out. The respective companies/individuals bought the tix, and choose to give them out "luck" style.

    I think the whole "scalping" idea has to be looked at a little more. I DO NOT support the greasy guy under the bridge selling me a $100 ticket for $900, but in the same breath, "donating" $11grand seems JUST as bad. Thoughts?
     
  22. Kimota

    Kimota ROY DU NORD!!!

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    What's the law relating to this? Is it punishable? Is it allowed? And if it's a crime then why do organization allow them to do it?
     
  23. Whileee

    Whileee Registered User

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    I am not commenting on how Winnipeg Police should spend their time.

    I think that the very fact that TNSE controlled season ticket sales the way they did, and in effect licensed Season Ticket packages, suggests that they understood the demand. As a business, they also need to maintain a positive reputation in the community. They might have been able to sell out a few games this year charging $500 or more per ticket and earned a bit more money, but this would have alienated a lot of fans, including those who they hope to keep as fans even if they are not current STHs. They are in it for the long term and want to maintain their strong reputation while still charging top dollar.

    Similarly, with an incredibly tight ticket supply they controlled sales and want to control resale to maintain a strong reputation with current and potential ticket-holders. Consider the reputational loss, for example, if a large percentage of Moose Season Ticket holders who were given preference for purchasing tickets decided to scalp their tickets. It would create substantial unrest in the market.

    If STHs wanted to resell tickets for a huge profit, they should have known that TNSE was serious about closing this out. Nobody forced anyone to enter into the contractual agreement about the use of season tickets. Some will get caught by the police or TNSE and lose the privilege of holding season ticket packages.
     
  24. Fugu

    Fugu Guest

    The good will argument is a very valid and insightful point.

    I don't buy this argument from the point of view that one set of interests is being protected (the company's) versus another set (the market interested in a legal product at various price levels). You don't have to buy a $900 ticket. The scalper cannot sell a $900 ticket if no one will pay. They're actually the best barometer available of spot demand as they adjust on the fly, even selling under their cost if necessary to avoid taking a total loss. If you don't read the market demand that well, you won't survive as a scalper.

    It could be argued that government is being used, by virtue of passing and enforcing these laws, to stifle commerce that individuals wish to pursue. You're free to re-sell your couch, have a garage sale, your car, bike, clothes. Why are tickets placed in a special category?



    Are you arguing that the law is pursuing breach of contract, or scalping (as many cities have these types of laws regardless of the STH agreement)?
     
  25. kdb209

    kdb209 Registered User

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    Note that the Jets are planning on setting up a legal "scalping" exchange through the team website:

    http://jets.nhl.com/club/page.htm?id=73398

    I'm assuming that this will be similar to the Sharks Power Play Ticket Window and other team exchanges of that ilk.

    For the Sharks, a STH can list their tickets for any price ( with a minimum of single game ticket price) - if sold, the Sharks/Ticketmaster keep 10% plus TicketBastard fees, and the STH is paid in an account credit, not cash.

    It would be interesting to see if/how they work around the MB Scalping law.
     

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