Winnipeg Naming discussion

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PitbulI

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Dec 22, 2010
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I'm hoping for the Winnipeg Falcons.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Winnipeg_Falcons

Aside from the historical significance, there is already a huge tribute to the team at the MTS Center:

MTS_Centre_Falcons_Display.jpg

Only if our Mascot can be named captain falcon and our wave called the Falcon Punch.
 

Hugh Mann*

Guest
With the time constraints on the 2011-12 season, they probably only have 2 options. Keep the Thrashers logo, colors and name for 1 season and make the change next summer, or go with the Manitoba Moose because they already have the artwork and marketing materials. However - while the AHL (Moose) uses RBK Jerseys, they certainly don't appear to the the same Edge-II or pattern that the NHL uses, so a new NHL compliant RBK Moose jersey might be required.

I'm sure it really doesn't take that long to design a jersey and manufacture a few dozen copies. Might take a little while to get them to the stores but for the team it wouldn't be a problem.
 

cutchemist42

Registered User
Apr 7, 2011
6,705
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Winnipeg
I personally hope they don't go with the name Moose. I like names like: Storm, Freeze, Falcons and Bulls. I like the idea of Falcons since the team is coming from Atlanta. Just seems fitting.

No offense, but those are the cheesy names reserved for minor league teams...
 

berklon

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Dec 24, 2008
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Using the state/province name makes sense when there are 2 or more major cities that you want the team to represent, but Manitoba is basically just Winnipeg. It has a population of around 700k, 2nd most is around 50k and everything else is less than 15k.

Plus I have to believe more people in the US have heard of Winnipeg than Manitoba.

As for the Moose... good for AHL or junior... but not for the NHL. While it's not as lame as the "Mighty Ducks" or even just "Ducks"... it's got a sort of Canadian stereotype going. It'd be like calling it the Beavers or the Geese. Plus even though it is plural, it doesn't sound like it. I don't like that.

Not wanting to waste money on the Moose branding is a dumb reason to continue to use it. The Jets is a great name and is more sellable... and is already known.

I'll take the Falcons over the Moose as well. It sounds decent enough.
 

southpaw24

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Dec 3, 2005
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Owen Sound, ON
Winnipeg Warriors would never fly.

First off names based on Native origins aren't particularily accepted nowadays.

Secondly there is a gang named the Manitoba Warriors.

Im pretty sure I told chewick that in the other thread... would be a good name if it wasnt for the native gangs it could be alright.



Im not sure what would be good if "jets" wont go...

as long as they dont make it something dumb
 
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Dupree13

Registered User
Aug 2, 2005
4,158
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Pittsburgh
I believe the virtue of these names comes primarily from familiarity and tradition. For example if somebody if the Maple Leafs never existed and somebody came up with that name today, it would be panned as the stupidest name ever.

With that said though, why in the he'll would you try to build ambrand from the ground up when there is already pre-made popular brand just siting there? It's either they can't get it or pure ego.
 

LeftCoast

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Aug 1, 2006
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Vancouver
I'm sure it really doesn't take that long to design a jersey and manufacture a few dozen copies. Might take a little while to get them to the stores but for the team it wouldn't be a problem.

Branding and merchandising is not something you do in a rush at the last minute. If you are launching a new franchise, you have a marketing plan, and you execute it. You don't just hire an artist and order jerseys.

What ever brand they choose, the logo and colors have to go in a million places in a variety of different sizes and backgrounds. The NHL has to approve pretty much all aspects of Jerseys, logos and colors. Season Ticket Holder packages (which would have to go out ASAP), website (the NHL controls the website look and feel), TV commercials and in-game graphics (CBC/TSN/Sportsnet will all have different requirements); there is a lot to be done. I was involved with a much less complicated re-branding / renaming exercise for a much smaller firm with no franchise, TV or sponsorship issues and it took months and costs close to $100,000 (and that was without any kind of campaign related costs). Branding an NHL team is easily into the millions.

Merchandising is an important revenue stream. It's not just getting a couple dozen home and away jerseys for the team. They may not launch everything from ball caps to practice jerseys on day one, but they have to have team merchandise available. They have to be available in team stores (in some number) league wide.

TNSE has been working on this for quite a while. Chances are they have a lot of the ground work done, but it is understandable that they want to leverage the marketing collateral and market presence/awareness they already have with the Moose.
 

Ripper

Registered User
Sep 19, 2006
179
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Falcons is appropriate

I never thought of this before but the Winnipeg Falcons were an Icelantic group of players that had harsh welcoms to Canadian Hockey but perserveered and became Canadian heroes and Gold medal Olympic champions.

Fast forward to 1974 and the Winnipeg Jets begin to bring in a heavy contingent of Europeans (from Nordic countries) Hedberg, Ulf Nilsson, Kent Nilsson, Bergman, Larsson, Mattsson, Riihiranta, Ketola, Lindstrom, Sjoberg, Labraatten etc....


These palyers made up a Team that the above won or where large parts of the 3 Avco Cups the Jets won from 74-79, the last coming over the Gretzgy led Oilers.

When the Jets beat the Rusians in 75 they later challenged the Montreal Canadians to a world title match or series. The Canadian refused because they didn't want to lose to the WHA and neither did the NHL, it was and has been that history will only remember the Canadians 3-3 tie against the same Russians as the greatest game ever...Those of us who were at the Jets Russian game know better...


So why the Falcons, lets remember that the greatest hockey history that we have seen in Manitoba is from the Icelanders, Swedes, Fins etal ....The jersey logo should be the Canadian flag and Icelantic Falcon moderized from the old jersey's....of course it wouldn't hurt to put a 'Golden Jet' on the shoulder!
 

tbcwpg

Moderator
Jan 25, 2011
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The team won't be (shouldn't be I'll say since nothing, even getting the team, is definite yet) the Jets. If the team needs to rebrand the arena, tickets, etc etc, they will want to make some of that money back in merchandise sales. There will be fans that buy new stuff anyway, or there will be fans that will use their old Jets jerseys and call it a day. If they use Moose, they have the advantage of having the name and colour scheme already branded, plus the impact of the Moose was smaller so less people have jerseys, etc. It's the best option financially. I like Moose actually, the logo is pretty cool, and the colours are pretty nice. I like that colour green though so I may be partial. Gold, black, and white are good trim colours for it.

Falcons is tricky since there is an Atlanta Falcons team already. Will Atlanta view that as slap in the face, or some convoluted way of "recognising" the Atlanta heritage of the team?
 

saskganesh

Registered User
Jun 19, 2006
2,368
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the Annex
There are Jets fans all over the continent. I don't think there are as many Moose fans. For a small market team, TNSE are going to have to market their hockey socks off, and in my opinion, Jets has the branding advantage.
 

Huffer

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Jul 16, 2010
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The team won't be (shouldn't be I'll say since nothing, even getting the team, is definite yet) the Jets. If the team needs to rebrand the arena, tickets, etc etc, they will want to make some of that money back in merchandise sales. There will be fans that buy new stuff anyway, or there will be fans that will use their old Jets jerseys and call it a day. If they use Moose, they have the advantage of having the name and colour scheme already branded, plus the impact of the Moose was smaller so less people have jerseys, etc. It's the best option financially. I like Moose actually, the logo is pretty cool, and the colours are pretty nice. I like that colour green though so I may be partial. Gold, black, and white are good trim colours for it.

Falcons is tricky since there is an Atlanta Falcons team already. Will Atlanta view that as slap in the face, or some convoluted way of "recognising" the Atlanta heritage of the team?

So you say that using Jets isn't a good option because people would just keep their Jets jerseys, but you think that going with Moose is good even though people already have the Moose jerseys?

How is that better financially?
 

Huffer

Registered User
Jul 16, 2010
16,672
6,243
Could one of the legal eagles on this site, or someone who knows the CBA explain and show how much money teams get from Merchandise sales?

What I recall seeing is that all HRR (which includes merch sales) is evenly distributed among all the teams. The only merchandise sales that teams get to keep are the sales from their own Arena store.

If that's the case I think people try to make way to big of a deal regarding the financial aspect of the Jerseys. Not saying it's not important, just that it's not the golden goose some people want to make it out to be.
 

saskganesh

Registered User
Jun 19, 2006
2,368
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the Annex
That seems kind of silly.

Why not move them to Cleveland and call them the Barrons or to Kansas City and call them the Scouts? Nostalgia is fine, but should we rename the the Avalanche and Sharks to the Rockies and Seals?

Because the Rockies, Scouts, Barons and Scouts were never good hockey teams. There's also the Ottawa counter example.

Now the Jets had a spotty record in the NHL, but for a bunch of us fans, we go back to the WHA team. The Avco Cups, beating the Russians, Hedberg and Nilson's magic. I think almost every little kid in Manitoba met Bobby Hull -- which was a real thrill -- and that stuck (in my case he was the first hockey player I ever met). Based on what I see and read, I don't think I am overestimating the resonance of the name to fans.
 

ps241

The Ballad of Ville Bobby
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Mar 10, 2010
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That seems kind of silly.

Why not move them to Cleveland and call them the Barrons or to Kansas City and call them the Scouts? Nostalgia is fine, but should we rename the the Avalanche and Sharks to the Rockies and Seals?

Personally, I wonder if there is Provincial money involved in the TNSE financing. If the Province of Manitoba has some skin in the game, they may be pressing for the team to be a Manitoba team rather than a Winnipeg team. The other obvious thing is that the team names are mostly a local impact. While Manitoba Moose doesn't resonate very well outside of Manitoba, TNSE has undoubtedly invested a fair amount in the local branding and promotion of the Moose.

Hey - and maybe some Americans hockey fans will have to learn the name of another Canadian province. :sarcasm: I aways get a kick out of the way many Americans pronounce Saskatchewan - it's kind of like the way Canadians pronounce Louisiana where we tend to hit every syllable equally hard. Most Canadians pronounce Saskatchewan sort of like s-sKATch'wan and (I believe) Louisiana is pronounced like LOOsiana.

LeftCoast when the smoke clears on this i think you will find that the highlighted area above will be a serious contributing factor

I have a strong opinion on the naming but i will not discuss this until Winnipeg lands a team....i am not usually superstitious but don't want to stir up the taunt gods
 

Shawa666

Registered User
May 25, 2010
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Québec, Qc, Ca
The obvious long term choice would be to buy back the Jets brand from the NHL. The brand is already well implanted in North America, and Winnipegers would prefer it that way.

The Moose branding has the advantage of being easily transferable to the NHL team. However it lacks the notoriety the Jets brand has.
 

New User Name

Registered User
Jan 2, 2008
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The obvious long term choice would be to buy back the Jets brand from the NHL. The brand is already well implanted in North America, and Winnipegers would prefer it that way.

The Moose branding has the advantage of being easily transferable to the NHL team. However it lacks the notoriety the Jets brand has.

Buy back? Why can't the league allow them to use Jets for free?
 

BB79

Registered User
Apr 30, 2011
2,668
2,677
I'm sure TNSE already knows what they want to call the team and has logos and jersey designs ready to go...here's hoping they bring back the jets, with a slightly modernized version of their 1995 jersey. Similar to what Buffalo did.

Whatever it ends up being, I just hope they're better than the Thrashers logo. It took me 2 years to realize that their logo was a bird with a hockey stick, not a giant bee hive. Those are some of the fugliest jerseys in the league.
 
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