Wings Sign Mo Seider to 3 year ELC

[Pavels Dog]

We want 150% want control. "Earning" his ice time is some bull**** GM/coach speak that is used to keep the true decision making process private. Controlling his ice time doesn't mean that we just give him 25 minutes each night right off the bat because we want to, but it does mean that we determine what is the appropriate level of challenge to place on his shoulders.

Things we can control in Grand Rapids that are uncontrollable with Mannheim would be: quality of competition, overall ice time, situational ice time (powerplay and/or penalty kill), and timeline of progression. In Mannheim, there is nothing to stop their coach from casting him as a 3rd pairing defenseman with no powerplay time for a full season again. It's been suggested the way they operate in the DEL and how roles are awarded is tied to time served. In Grand Rapids, we would at least have the ability to control the minor variables to challenge him the right amount, and to adjust the variables on the fly as he develops and becomes more comfortable.

There is nothing to stop the GR coach from playing him like a 3rd pairing D either. At least I have never heard of the Wings actually controlling a prospects icetime down there.
Earning icetime is how it works in pro leagues and I don't know that there's any evidence for handing out icetime for free being a better strategy.

The thing is though; if Seider isn't good enough to be a legit top 4D this season in either Mannheim or GR, he should be in juniors instead. Better to let his own performance dictate where he plays rather than being set on playing him somewhere where he will play a lot regardless of whether he deserves it or not.

 

[obey86]

There is nothing to stop the GR coach from playing him like a 3rd pairing D either. At least I have never heard of the Wings actually controlling a prospects icetime down there.
Earning icetime is how it works in pro leagues and I don't know that there's any evidence for handing out icetime for free being a better strategy.

The thing is though; if Seider isn't good enough to be a legit top 4D this season in either Mannheim or GR, he should be in juniors instead. Better to let his own performance dictate where he plays rather than being set on playing him somewhere where he will play a lot regardless of whether he deserves it or not.

But going into the season the Red Wings will have an idea on how the AHL coach plans to use Seider. I would imagine these guys are in constant contact with each other when it comes to discussions on the younger players. Obviously things could potentially change as the season goes on, but if the AHL coach is saying in training camp "I don't see this guy playing much this year based on what I have seen in training camp," the Wings probably send him elsewhere.

Maybe that's not the Wings "controlling Seider's ice time" per se, but it's definitely the Wings having a much better idea of what they are getting into ice time wise if they send him to the AHL compared to if they send him back to Europe. If the AHL coach says prior to the season: "I love Sieder's skill set and I think he's ready. He's going to start playing the PK and PP and i'm not going to baby him," that's an indication he will be given a fair shot in the AHL and could help make the Red Wings decision easier to place him in GR, even if nothing is fully guaranteed as the season moves along.

 

[Frk It]

Thats all stuff that will shake out in camp though as well. They'll be able to get a good read on McIlrath and Saarjarvi compared to Seider and see if he could handle some of their minutes. Also just because those guys are right handed doesnt mean they necessarily play the right side. In his role and with his experience I could see McIlrath sliding over to the left side and actually playing on a pairing with Seider.

At this point I highly doubt Saarjarvi is taking minutes from Seider. Hes just not that good.

Hicketts, Lashoff, McIlrath, Lindstrom, Kaski.

I’m thinking 4 out of those 5 will be the top 4 in Grand Rapids unless there’s an injury or some player movement before the season.

 

[obey86]

Hicketts, Lashoff, McIlrath, Lindstrom, Kaski.

I’m thinking 4 out of those 5 will be the top 4 in Grand Rapids unless there’s an injury or some player movement before the season.

I think it's fairly likely that Hicketts ends up as the 7th defenseman in the NHL this year. Also, wouldn't be surprised if the Wings carry 8 defenseman at the NHL level and make 7 of them active on gameday. I believe the Lightning did this a few years ago under Stevie.

Ericsson, Daley, Green, Hronek, Dekeyser, Nemeth, Hicketts, Bowey.

 

[Frk It]

I think it's fairly likely that Hicketts ends up as the 7th defenseman in the NHL this year. Also, wouldn't be surprised if the Wings carry 8 defenseman at the NHL level and make 7 of them active on gameday. I believe the Lightning did this a few years ago under Stevie.

Ericsson, Daley, Green, Hronek, Dekeyser, Nemeth, Hicketts, Bowey.

I think we’ll carry 14 forwards. With guys like Hirose, Kuffner, Svechnikov, De La Rose, Ehn, etc I don’t see them carrying 8 defenseman.

I think one of Bowey, Hicketts or Kaski will be the 7th D. But even still I think the top 4 will be very hard to crack in GR.

 

[Hen Kolland]

Hicketts, Lashoff, McIlrath, Lindstrom, Kaski.

I’m thinking 4 out of those 5 will be the top 4 in Grand Rapids unless there’s an injury or some player movement before the season.

All the more infuriating that we brought Hicketts back. He is nothing but a road block in Grand Rapids. He has become the very thing that most hoped he would destroy.

 

[newfy]

Hicketts, Lashoff, McIlrath, Lindstrom, Kaski.

I’m thinking 4 out of those 5 will be the top 4 in Grand Rapids unless there’s an injury or some player movement before the season.

Definitely possible. One of Hicketts or Kaski could end up in the NHL I think. I also think Seider could come to camp and be better than all of those players and earn a big role in Grand Rapids as well. I think its pretty hard to speculate though until camp. Seider could come in and look like he needs another year at least in Germany before considering Grand Rapids

 

[HisNoodliness]

All the more infuriating that we brought Hicketts back. He is nothing but a road block in Grand Rapids. He has become the very thing that most hoped he would destroy.

You either die a prospect or live to see yourself become the veteran.

 

[MBH]

I don't mind Hicketts coming back.
To me, he's got a decent shot at being the #7 defenseman.
I'd go with Mcilrath or Hicketts. Honestly, I'd choose McIlrath, just to clear a RD spot in Grand Rapids.

Here's our roster of righthanded defense.
1 Hronek
2 Green
3 Bowey
---
4. McIlrath
5. Lindstrom
6. Saarijarvi
7. Seider
8. Kaski
----
There are a couple things Detroit can do.
1. If one of the bottom five is ready, Holland can trade or waive Bowey.
2. Use McIlrath as the #7 defenseman in Detroit,
3. Play one of these guys on the leftside in Grand Rapids.
4. Send Seider or Lindstrom or Kaski back to Europe.
5. Trade Saarijarvi

 

[jkutswings]

If one of the bottom five is ready, Holland can trade or waive Bowey.

I knew it was too good to be true. Kenny never really left, and is secretly the GM of two different teams.

 

[obey86]

I think we’ll carry 14 forwards. With guys like Hirose, Kuffner, Svechnikov, De La Rose, Ehn, etc I don’t see them carrying 8 defenseman.

I think one of Bowey, Hicketts or Kaski will be the 7th D. But even still I think the top 4 will be very hard to crack in GR.

None of Kuffner, DLR, and Ehn are any good or likely in the long term plans (same with Hicketts, I know that) so i'm not sure from a talent/potential standpoint that there will be a reason to carry them over Hicketts. They may very well not carry 8 D, but I don't think it will be because someone like Kuffner is better than someone like Hicketts. They all suck.

I just don't see where all these guys play in Grand Rapids. McIllrath, Lindstrom, Kaski, Seider (potentially, but this is where I see him ending up), Saarijarvi, Hicketts, Cholowski, Lashoff. Lashoff, McIllrath, and Hicketts are vets, so I don't see any of them sitting regularly. And that only leaves 3 spots for Lindstrom, Cholowski, Seider, and Kaski...who at least 3 of the 4 need to be playing more than just leftover minutes if they want to develop. If you have that many vets in GR playing regularly on D, with that many top Red Wing prospects also, it's going to potentially shaft our top prospects from getting the playing time they need IMO.

 

[vladdy16]

This board really needs to stop acting like managing fringe players is a high wire act.

The next few months are going to severely shake up the pecking order, and when that happens you start waiving and demoting people. Thats it.

There are no risks or roadblocks involved.