He had a DZ FOW% of 52.9% last season, so no only can he win them to save his life, he won them more often than not last season. He was 50% overall so pretty average at faceoffs.
Confirmed with Link: Wings sign Frans Nielsen 6 years 5.25m/yr
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He had a DZ FOW% of 52.9% last season, so no only can he win them to save his life, he won them more often than not last season. He was 50% overall so pretty average at faceoffs.
SLAPSHOT723
QU! Bobcats!
That's crazy. He must have gotten much better at it this year because for years it felt like he was around 30%.
If I'm being honest he 's only had 2 seasons over 50% in DZ FOW% since 10-11, but to be fair his lowest is like 45.2%.
Henkka
Registered User
Nielsen gives a great secondary option for Def.Zone Faceoff. Glendening still will be 1st guy, but it's good to have depth and options, when the defensive specialist is not there.
Nielsen is also more dangerous after the faceoff. Glendening can just dig the puck out from the Dzone which is important, but his skill end there. Nielsen can start dangerous counter-attack, he has skill to fly over the neutral zone and create a real scoring chance. Glendening (and Andersson) could just probably dump the puck in, or shoot for a OZone faceoff.
Nielsen is also more dangerous after the faceoff. Glendening can just dig the puck out from the Dzone which is important, but his skill end there. Nielsen can start dangerous counter-attack, he has skill to fly over the neutral zone and create a real scoring chance. Glendening (and Andersson) could just probably dump the puck in, or shoot for a OZone faceoff.
I just took a look at Pavel Datsyuks stats and I noticed that when Datsyuk was 32 he came in to the season just losing six games in the past four years. Kinda reminds me of Nielsen.
The rest of Datsyuk's career has been injury prone, right?
Datsyuk was also a pretty soft, but extremely smart player on the ice - now, of the top of my head I would kinda expect a player of such caliber to perhaps get slowed down a little and perhaps get hit just a marginal bit more as he gets older, so I would also probably expect a few more injuries to these types of players when they grow older.
I'm not saying this is what will definitely happen to Nielsen, I'm just saying I understand those that worry about the term.
Nielsen is absolutely worth $5,25M a year right now. I won't know about 2020 just yet.
For now he is pretty much a poor mans Datsyuk, so I think it's completely logical for Ken Holland and the rest of the organization to go down this road. Especially with the history of playing the "old teams".
Now, what do I mean by "a poor mans Datsyuk". I mean, I have always compared him to Datsyuk when it comes to his style of play, with the exception that he's just not as good as Datsyuk - not many players have ever been that good, right?
Nielsen is reading the game a lot like Datsyuk. Able to see where the play is going, able to be in the right position to interrupt the oppositions play. His best asset is how he plays without the puck and it also makes him very strong on the PK.
If you take a detailed look at his advanced stats, you will se, though, that his PK abilities suffers when he also plays a lot of minutes on the PP. Not really a surprise, but it's worth noticing that his best PK stats came several years ago and he has not been a league-over-average-effective player on the PK for the past 2-3 years.
Back then I believe he was even for one year the player scoring most points in a season on the PK. He played with tremendously fast Austrian Michael Grabner on the PK and they were the bomb. I think they scored maybe a combined 10-12 goals on the PK that season. Often Nielsen broke up the play and fed Grabner to probably a modern era record high amount of breakaways.
With the puck Nielsen is always playing a sound, safe game with the puck. Not taking major chances with the puck, but still able to make creative plays and open up the ice. A strong and slick skater. Fast without looking fast, if that makes any sense to you..
The speed and the smart distributions with the puck makes him a great neutral zone player both as a puck carrier and setting up simple but effective plays to enter the zone. He is also great at zone entries on the PP, not to mention that he has a great shootout record. Amzing, though, that the goalies of the league still doesn't seem to know him well enough to know that he relies a lot on the same move to the backhand. But one of the reasons it works well still is of course that he is also good to compensate and just shoot if the goalie knows about the backhand and tries to move too soon.
The reason why Nielsen is not having injuries so far - much like Datsyuk at the same age, I suppose - is because he is not involved in the physical play. That is very smart and he is often able to pick the puck away from the opposition in a smart way, but of course it also means, that he's not winning any physical battles, because he simply shies away from these.
So to me a lot of the value to this contract comes down to whether or not Nielsen will still not get slowed down just marginally and whether or not he all of a sudden gets hit.
That's just my 2 cents.
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Yemack
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- Oct 30, 2007
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Thanks for a nice write up on Nielsen but I think that's more of Zetterberg quality than Datsyuk. Datsyuk was known for more of takeaway artist, approaches from blindspots and take away the puck. Also Datsyuk was a beast along the board, using his calm demeanor and superior stick work to win the puck. Anyhow at least Nielsen is pretty proficient at reading plays in our zone based on your comment.
I guess it's not surprising Nielsen chooses to make safer plays based on what I heard and his comments post signing. It's just that I wished for a player who can make some preemptive passes into open ice behind the defender or between defender which our speedy forwards can jump into and skate down with speed. That would be pretty hard to stop for any D, and at worst, will make them back off which makes life easier.
Fair enough.
I agree, he is not as soft as Nielsen, but I do consider Datsyuk relatively soft. I don't see Datsyuk shy away from the physical play as much as Nielsen might do at times, but on the other hand he's not exactly Lindros, eh. ;-)
Nielsen is also very good at takeaways. Not as good as Datsyuk, though. Absolutely not - but who is?
Zetterberg is also not a bad comparison for Nielsen, so let's say that he meshes up between those two a little bit (without ever reacing their level of play, though), but for me it was just always easier to compare Nielsen to Datsyuk because their stature is also a bit similar in my opinion.
But I'll be looking forward to hearing you guys on this topic when you've seen Nielsen in the DRW jersey for some 5-10 games
Frk It
Mo Seider Less Problems
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On the plus side, at least we're still cool in Europe
http://www.nhlpa.com/news/nielsen-revved-up-about-playing-in-motor-city
http://www.nhlpa.com/news/nielsen-revved-up-about-playing-in-motor-city
Cyborg Yzerberg
Registered User
I think to casuals, the Red Wings will always personify elite hockey, even in down years. The team DOES have Yankees clout in casuals circles, imo, as far as hockey teams go.
jkutswings
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If it weren't for the terms, I'd be very excited about this deal. Getting Nielsen kind of seems like we're turning back the clock on Zetterberg. Nielsen seems like a smart player and with the set of wheels he's got, he may be able to avoid a big fall-off in his later years. If anything, its better that this deal happened now than almost any other time in the past, given the direction Holland wants this team to go. Nielsen being surrounded by Mantha, Abby, Bertuzzi, Svechnikov, Sadowy, Larkin, and AA is a lot better than the softies that were Huds, Filppula, Samuelsson, et al.
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Acoustic
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- Sep 29, 2014
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He's really not soft at all, though. He went nose to nose with guys like Chara and Weber and at some points knocked them on their *****.
Just look up 'Datsyuk hits' on youtube, and he was basically impossible to knock around or off the puck during his prime. Just check out some videos, you'll be impressed/surprised.
TheOctopusKid
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- Sep 24, 2010
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The idea of adding someone like Nielsen is a very positive thing. I think the analog to a younger Zetterberg sans the injuries is a very apt one. What it does is give us a legit top-6 center and allows us to slowly transition Larkin to the middle and decrease the offensive load off of Zetterberg.
I am surprisingly comfortable with a top six of Zetterberg - Nielsen - Abdelkadar with some nice possession and skill and then rolling a more explosive and quick minded second group of Tatar - Larkin - Nyquist - with Vanek subbing in on the wing when one of Gus or Tats slows down or even someone like Sheahan to add a net front presence and size like Abdelkadar on the first.
Not the worst top 6 in the league and will be more competitive than a lot of us are giving them credit for.
I am surprisingly comfortable with a top six of Zetterberg - Nielsen - Abdelkadar with some nice possession and skill and then rolling a more explosive and quick minded second group of Tatar - Larkin - Nyquist - with Vanek subbing in on the wing when one of Gus or Tats slows down or even someone like Sheahan to add a net front presence and size like Abdelkadar on the first.
Not the worst top 6 in the league and will be more competitive than a lot of us are giving them credit for.
WingedWheel1987
Registered User
It's not bad, but it will get bogged down by the Wings abysmal defenseman.
I would be very surprised if Nielsen puts up 50 points next season.
I think Vanek will have a bounce back year(40-50pts), as will Nyquist, Sheahan & Tatar barring trade;
I'd try this 1st:
Z-Nielsen-Nyquist
Tatar-Larkin-Vanek/Abby
Helm-Sheahan-Abby/Vanek
AA-Glend-Jurco
Miller & Ott rotate based on injuries, opponents, back to backs & home/away schedule.
Mantha 1st call up, unless Tatar++ traded for Fowler/Shatty.
jaster
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Only on a freaking hockey message board will you hear about how Pavel Datsyuk is "soft." I'd bet Dylan Larkin's career that not a single NHLer who has played against Datsyuk thinks he's soft.
I like Nielsen, and while he's not physical, I think he makes up for it in other areas, rendering it a non-issue. But he makes Pavel Datsyuk look like a Terminator.
I like Nielsen, and while he's not physical, I think he makes up for it in other areas, rendering it a non-issue. But he makes Pavel Datsyuk look like a Terminator.
TheOctopusKid
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Fair point - our defense does need to be addressed but Frans isn't going to help with that.
I'm comfortable with Nielsen hitting 45-50 and bringing solid first line minutes and night in and night out producing a fairly even GF/GA against the top line of the other team. If he can do that I'm fine with that point total.
Honestly, the Wings top lines aren't going outperform the top 10 offensive teams in terms of pure point getting but they can certainly mitigate how much damage is being done against them. If line 1 and line 2 roughly cancel each other out in terms of goals for and against and it becomes a question of our third line depth versus theirs - I'll typically take that any day of the week - especially if that third line is going to be something along the lines of Vanek (who I think has a nice bounce back), Sheahan and some winger like a Pulk/Helm/Jurco/Mantha.
We're not in the period of time anymore where we are lead by two ppg, two-way centers who are going to blow up for 80+. The talent is not there. But if we can have something along the lines of 10 players with 10-15+ goals and play the depth card, I think we'll be very competitive.
Frk It
Mo Seider Less Problems
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What team currently does this and is "very competitive"?
Any team that I can think of that I would consider to be very competitive has top end talent. Or any team that does not have top end talent at forward, does at defense.
WingedWheel1987
Registered User
Yeah but i don't see the Wings top six cancelling anything out. It's safe to say the majority of the teams the Wings play will have a more talented top six than Detroit's.
It comes back to the fact that the Wings cannot move the puck effectively. The forwards are basically always a step behind because the defenseman either fail to move the puck or take to long to get it to the forwards, and that gives the opposition the time to get into position.
To me, having no high end talent and a bunch of 10-15 goal scorers means you actually have no depth. You are just a very shallow pond.
I also think Nielsen will struggle more than Datsyuk did even with his body breaking down. Elite hockey IQ can overcome a lot of problems, which is something Nielsen doesn't have. I don't want people to think i don't like Nielsen or think he sucks, but he can't compete with Datsyuk's vision.
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Henkka
Registered User
Imo, he will help on one area, which usually has been a role of good offensive defencemen.
Power-play zone entries. He was hyped of these and did play as 1st PP unit pointman because of his skills.
This was our biggest problems last year, when Kronner lost his knees. He has been quite regular guy doing those entries in the past.
Now we have new guy for that duty. Not a defenceman, but doing a little bit of defencemen job.
TheOctopusKid
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You're right that our offense will be entirely limited by the fact that our defensemen can't make an effective breakout pass to our forwards to break the zone in stride. Similarly it hurts us because the contribution at the point makes it difficult to get any second changes on the power play.
Yeah, the defense is our problem. Has been since Rafalski left and doubly so when Lidstrom retired. I think the point I was trying to make is I don't think that we necessarily need a focal point on the offense (a 40g player in the mold of Stamkos or Benn) if we can roll three effective lines of players who can all chip in.
jkutswings
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To be fair, in the early stages of Datsyuk's career, I don't know that he was specifically labeled as soft, but there were definitely questions about whether he was tough enough or capable enough to raise his game in the playoffs.
He most definitely silenced those critics, but the talk was there, at least for awhile.
