Proposal: WIN - COL

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Avaholic29

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Feb 5, 2014
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Anyone who thinks Timmins is close to Bouchard is insane! And you have proven that with your ridiculous homeristic defense of Ehlers for late 1st, Timmins and Bust.

I mean, you are dead in the water with that one. There is no way to defend your complete lack of understanding of player value and fair value. Why? Because you can't see past the color of the jersey.

But keep continuing to dig yourself a hole....

You used the all star game as a credible point in player value. It doesn't get any worse than that. But keep continuing to obsess over me, it's flattering. You have a complete lack of understanding player value. Why? Because you can't see past the fan voted all star game.
 

Junohockeyfan

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Dec 16, 2018
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Just a side bar for a moment. Using Avaholic logic....

Byram Bowem is having a rather disappointing D + 1 season at less than 1 PPG after achieving better than a PPG in is draft season. Calen Addison meanwhile is better than a PPG this season and during the WHJC had a much bigger impact points wise for Team Canada compared to Byram. So therefore it stands to reason that Calen Addison is equal or better than Byram. I mean, these are facts right?
 

Avaholic29

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Feb 5, 2014
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Just a side bar for a moment. Using Avaholic logic....

Byram Bowem is having a rather disappointing D + 1 season at less than 1 PPG after achieving better than a PPG in is draft season. Calen Addison meanwhile is better than a PPG this season and during the WHJC had a much bigger impact points wise for Team Canada compared to Byram. So therefore it stands to reason that Calen Addison is equal or better than Byram. I mean, these are facts right?


You are obsessed. I'm in your head.
 

Snowman

Registered User
Oct 12, 2007
3,217
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Texas
Personally I'd prefer Timmins over Addison but ya, they're both pretty similar in terms of upside.




Actually... Using points to justify your opinion is a pretty good show of just how "knowledgeable" you are.

Ehlers is worth more, but not a tonne more. He's become pretty overrated after a couple good years, he's looking more and more like a 50-55 point 2nd liner than he is a 65+ point 1st liner people seem to value him as.


Both he and Zucker are solid 2nd line Wings but not 1st line guys if you're serious about contending to win.
Actually it's not even the points, I just threw that in to make your misguided post look even more foolish. It's that you are comparing a 28 year old 2nd/3rd liner to a 23 year old first liner and saying they have similar value. That is what shows your profound lack of knowledge and objectivity when trying to assess player values.
 
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Avaholic29

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Feb 5, 2014
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And with that, you take the L. hahahaha

You got nothing eh? ;)

Except maybe that Lethbridge is a way way better team than Vancouver? Lmao. Byram is just under ppg and has 16 pts in his last 5 games and was used as the number one DEFENSIVE dman on team Canada. Your grasping at straws because you can't get me out of your head. And since you want to use that lets lets bring up the fact Timmins was waaaay better than Bouchard was at the junior tournament :)
 
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Junohockeyfan

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Except maybe that Lethbridge is a way way better team than Vancouver? Lmao. Byram is just under ppg and has 16 pts in his last 5 games and was used as the number one DEFENSIVE dman on team Canada. Your grasping at straws because you can't get me out of your head. And since you want to use that lets lets bring up the fact Timmins was waaaay better than Bouchard was at the junior tournament :)


Cherry picking 4 games here and 8 games here doesn't change the fact that Calen Addison is above a PPG while Byram isn't. Its the body of work that matters and not what happens in a 5 game stretch. Plus, Addison absolutely blew Byram away at the WJHC with 9 points in 7 games. Byram had what? 2 measely assists? He was a total non factor.

And why am i grasping at straws? You are comparing points between Timmins and Bouchard. While ignoring glaring errors (like making a blunder every game per the Avs beat-writer). And ignoring accomplishments like AHL Allstar status.

This is the same logic you are using in your comparison of Timmins to Bouchard. So Addison > Byram. Timmins = Bouchard. This is what we are basing our arguments on right?

And since Ehler's is performing at top-line production. Then Ehlers is easily > Byram who has been a disappointment.

As for Bouchard vs Timmins. The Eagles are a much better team than the Condors, so i guess you have to reduce Timmins point totals to do a proper comparison right?
 
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Avaholic29

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Feb 5, 2014
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Cherry picking 4 games here and 8 games here doesn't change the fact that Calen Addison is above a PPG while Byram isn't. Its the body of work that matters and not what happens in a 5 game stretch. Plus, Addison absolutely blew Byram away at the WJHC with 9 points in 7 games. Byram had what? 2 measely assists? He was a total non factor.

And why am i grasping at straws? You are comparing points between Timmins and Bouchard. While ignoring glaring errors (like making a blunder every game per the Avs beat-writer). And ignoring accomplishments like AHL Allstar status.

This is the same logic you are using in your comparison of Timmins to Bouchard. So Addison > Byram. Timmins = Bouchard. This is what we are basing our arguments on right?

And since Ehler's is performing at top-line production. Then Ehlers is easily > Byram who has been a disappointment.

You are the only one saying Byram has been a dissapointment. He's been more defensive as his team is not good this year. Lethbridge is something like 34-12 and Vancouver is just over .500, you gonna try tell me Bouchard hasn't made mistakes or blunders now too? They are rookies buddy. Byram was also deployed as a defensive dman at the tournament and Addison played pp1 with the best they had. There's situations to everything. Like being on a better team means more chances at production or being on a top pp with the best players.
 

Avaholic29

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Feb 5, 2014
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Cherry picking 4 games here and 8 games here doesn't change the fact that Calen Addison is above a PPG while Byram isn't. Its the body of work that matters and not what happens in a 5 game stretch. Plus, Addison absolutely blew Byram away at the WJHC with 9 points in 7 games. Byram had what? 2 measely assists? He was a total non factor.

And why am i grasping at straws? You are comparing points between Timmins and Bouchard. While ignoring glaring errors (like making a blunder every game per the Avs beat-writer). And ignoring accomplishments like AHL Allstar status.

This is the same logic you are using in your comparison of Timmins to Bouchard. So Addison > Byram. Timmins = Bouchard. This is what we are basing our arguments on right?

And since Ehler's is performing at top-line production. Then Ehlers is easily > Byram who has been a disappointment.

As for Bouchard vs Timmins. The Eagles are a much better team than the Condors, so i guess you have to reduce Timmins point totals to do a proper comparison right?

The main point he’s trying to make in this video is that Bouchard needs to improve his overall hockey sense. After watching this video, I would agree. There are many plays here where Bouchard seemed to take the lazy route. A lot of his decisions don’t seem like the logical one to take.

A quote from an Oilers beat writer... Bouchard is a B prospect now. Take your L
 

Junohockeyfan

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You are the only one saying Byram has been a dissapointment. He's been more defensive as his team is not good this year. Lethbridge is something like 34-12 and Vancouver is just over .500, you gonna try tell me Bouchard hasn't made mistakes or blunders now too? They are rookies buddy. Byram was also deployed as a defensive dman at the tournament and Addison played pp1 with the best they had. There's situations to everything. Like being on a better team means more chances at production or being on a top pp with the best players.


Connor Timmins is on a better team than Evan Bouchard. So do we take that into consideration in favor of Evan?

All you have is excuses. But you are starting to see that when comparing players - like Timmins to Bouchard, you have to take into consideration a lot more than just PPG averages and 5 game stints. I have just used your illogic against you by showing you that you can make a case for Addison to be > Byram. When in reality, its not the case. Similarly, Bouchard is a far more superior prospect than Timmins. Points do not tell the story. Age / development, defensive game, team's performance etc. all play a role.

And for the record, Byram was expected to produce points at the WJHC - he wasn't supposed to be just a defensive dman. He just didn't produce and was rather disappointing. Now its a tournament and the end of the world or the be all and end all of his value. But call a spade a spade - he was very disappointing. His 6 goals in the Dub this season is very disappointing as well.

Maybe Addison is the better prospect... ;)

And Avaholic with the L!!! 2 L's in one thread dude - ouch! lol

Junoguy with the LOL!

BTW, Bouchard is absolutely creaming Timmins in points. How can you even compare these two? LOL
 

Avaholic29

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Feb 5, 2014
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Connor Timmins is on a better team than Evan Bouchard. So do we take that into consideration in favor of Evan?

All you have is excuses. But you are starting to see that when comparing players - like Timmins to Bouchard, you have to take into consideration a lot more than just PPG averages and 5 game stints. I have just used your illogic against you by showing you that you can make a case for Addison to be > Byram. When in reality, its not the case. Similarly, Bouchard is a far more superior prospect than Timmins. Points do not tell the story. Age / development, defensive game, team's performance etc. all play a role.

And for the record, Byram was expected to produce points at the WJHC - he wasn't supposed to be just a defensive dman. He just didn't produce and was rather disappointing. Now its a tournament and the end of the world or the be all and end all of his value. But call a spade a spade - he was very disappointing. His 6 goals in the Dub this season is very disappointing as well.

Maybe Addison is the better prospect... ;)

And Avaholic with the L!!! 2 L's in one thread dude - ouch! lol

Junoguy with the LOL!

Byram lead the dcore in minutes played and rarely jumped up in the play. Why do you think that is? He's not just an offensive dman like Addison. And I just used your logic against you as well, you mention Bouchard's defensive ability etc but I just showed you an Edmonton beat write saying he takes the lazy route often and focuses on his offense more. You are completely blowing off any potential fault in your arguments by bringing up other points. Hunter 100% deployed Byram defensively, he was on the PK and lead the team in minutes despite being one of the youngest dmen on the team. But yeah keep going you definitely are just hard headed and would never admit that you could be wrong. It's all good. By the way I didn't say Timmins was better or as good but he isn't "not even close" as the point production is close and both have made defensive mistakes based on both teams beat writers which you literally spammed to death and now want to ignore when I provide the same argument lmao take your L pleaaase and stop obsessing over me before I end up In your dreams tonight
 

Avaholic29

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Feb 5, 2014
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Connor Timmins is on a better team than Evan Bouchard. So do we take that into consideration in favor of Evan?

All you have is excuses. But you are starting to see that when comparing players - like Timmins to Bouchard, you have to take into consideration a lot more than just PPG averages and 5 game stints. I have just used your illogic against you by showing you that you can make a case for Addison to be > Byram. When in reality, its not the case. Similarly, Bouchard is a far more superior prospect than Timmins. Points do not tell the story. Age / development, defensive game, team's performance etc. all play a role.

And for the record, Byram was expected to produce points at the WJHC - he wasn't supposed to be just a defensive dman. He just didn't produce and was rather disappointing. Now its a tournament and the end of the world or the be all and end all of his value. But call a spade a spade - he was very disappointing. His 6 goals in the Dub this season is very disappointing as well.

Maybe Addison is the better prospect... ;)

And Avaholic with the L!!! 2 L's in one thread dude - ouch! lol

Junoguy with the LOL!

BTW, Bouchard is absolutely creaming Timmins in points. How can you even compare these two? LOL


Bouchard is at a .64 pace and Timmins is at a .63 pace but yeah keep going with your expert knowledge that I keep exposing flaws in.

Forgot I was supposed to spam this with every reply in bold to get the point across..you take the L on this one. 1-1

The main point he’s trying to make in this video is that Bouchard needs to improve his overall hockey sense. After watching this video, I would agree. There are many plays here where Bouchard seemed to take the lazy route. A lot of his decisions don’t seem like the logical one to take.
 

Junohockeyfan

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Dec 16, 2018
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Byram lead the dcore in minutes played and rarely jumped up in the play. Why do you think that is? He's not just an offensive dman like Addison. And I just used your logic against you as well, you mention Bouchard's defensive ability etc but I just showed you an Edmonton beat write saying he takes the lazy route often and focuses on his offense more. You are completely blowing off any potential fault in your arguments by bringing up other points. Hunter 100% deployed Byram defensively, he was on the PK and lead the team in minutes despite being one of the youngest dmen on the team. But yeah keep going you definitely are just hard headed and would never admit that you could be wrong. It's all good. By the way I didn't say Timmins was better or as good but he isn't "not even close" as the point production is close and both have made defensive mistakes based on both teams beat writers which you literally spammed to death and now want to ignore when I provide the same argument lmao take your L pleaaase and stop obsessing over me before I end up In your dreams tonight

Actually, it was Calen Addison that had a better +/- as well and he completely blew Byram away in points. So i guess he is the better player right? Byram has been pretty disappointing for sure.

Bouchard has had defensive issues in the past but being a year younger than Timmins and playing on a weaker team, he is much further ahead in his development. Timmins concussion issues and injuries also play a role in his lesser value. Its not even close in terms of their offensive abilities. Bouchard is far more talented offensively than Timmins. But nothing wrong with being a B prospect who has defensive issues.

What is completely unacceptable though was your ridiculous defense of Late 1st + B prospect + Bust for Ehlers. What were you thinking???

BTW, have you apologized yet for the L?
 
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hn777

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Apr 22, 2019
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Ehlers is worth more, but not a tonne more. He's become pretty overrated after a couple good years, he's looking more and more like a 50-55 point 2nd liner than he is a 65+ point 1st liner people seem to value him as
So, can you mention other players in the league pacing for 64 points from the middle-6 and with low PP, 3v3, 4v4 TOI?
Vrana maybe?
 

Avaholic29

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Feb 5, 2014
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Actually, it was Calen Addison that had more TOI than Byram. He had a better +/- as well and he completely blew Byram away in points. So i guess he is the better player right? Byram has been pretty disappointing for sure.

Bouchard has had defensive issues in the past but being a year younger than Timmins and playing on a weaker team, he is much further ahead in his development. Timmins concussion issues and injuries also play a role in his lesser value. Its not even close in terms of their offensive abilities. Bouchard is far more talented offensively than Timmins. But nothing wrong with being a B prospect who has defensive issues.

What is completely unacceptable though was your ridiculous defense of Late 1st + B prospect + Bust for Ehlers. What were you thinking???

BTW, have you apologized yet for the L?

Team Canada leaning even more on Byram today, as he’s far and away their ice time leader. Drawn penalty, power play assist, PK time. Looks like he might be their horse the rest of the tournament. Another beat writer. Byram had a good tournament, you keep saying stats isn't everything lmao live by your own words. Addison played almost the full two minutes of pp and rode the coattails of Hayton AL and veleno. Byram was leaned on for defense at 5 on 5 the most and with confidence over his older peers so enough of the Byram BS if your team is a losing team like the giants your gonna be on the defensive more than the previous year. He hasn't been a dissapointment at all lol. You keep bringing up that deal but we are onto something else now so just take the L. You say B prospect, avs management thinks otherwise as we didn't accept moving him for hall even with money to resign hall. I'll trust the avs scouts and pro scouts who have brought in guys all having career years. You enjoy your opinion but that's all it is
 

wetcoast

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Nov 20, 2018
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For this to even be considered one of byram or newhook need to be added, your players aren’t even close to Ehlers value


I think that you are really underarting timmins here or over rating Ehlers.

BTW I wouldn't trade Newhook or Byram straight up for Ehlers if I were in Joe Sakic's shoes.
 

surixon

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Jul 12, 2003
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And who on the jets is an A defense prospect? My argument has been he'd be one of the top dmen prospects on the jets. Still don't see where I'm wrong in that regard but cool.

His name is Heinola and he cracked the teams defense this year as an 18 year old. Posted similar draft numbers in the FEL in his draft year as Heiskanen and just had a darn good WJC. He is a significantly better prospect then Timmins imo.

Samberg has won back to back NCAA championships as their go to shut down dmen. He is big, mobile, strong in his own end and can move the puck.

Both I would take over Timmins fairly easily.

We also have a prospect in Chisholm that isn't far behind Timmins with regards to OHL scoring rates and a hand full of other good dmen in the system.

We have RD prospect Gawke who is the same age and has similar production on a much lower scoring AHL as Timmins. Niku won AHL dmen of the league at the same age Timmins is now.

The Jets have no need of B caliber D prospect, its the deepest position in our prospect pool.

Byrum would be nice but he isn't a need with the depth of the LD of our system.


What the Jets do need if they are to move on from a core winger piece is a 1A center or a number 1 RD that is of similar age as the Jets core piece. So 24-26.
 

Junohockeyfan

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Dec 16, 2018
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I'll trust the avs scouts and pro scouts who have brought in guys all having career years. You enjoy your opinion but that's all it is

And you should trust your coach who stated that Timmins isn't a top D performer on the Condors, hence he won't be promoted to the big league even with Makar's injury! That's pretty telling right there. Bouchard is 2nd in AHL rookie scoring. He's miles ahead of Timmins.

And Addison is probably the superior offensive talent compared to Byram while Byram has the edge defensively. Its close though right? I mean, similar to how you feel its close between Bouchard and Timmins. ;)

I'll trust Colorado Eagles beatwriters and the Eagles coach over your ultra-homeristic opinion any day. What was it they said about your inconsistent, injury riddled B prospect?

But the fact remains that Timmins consistently makes large, costly errors in nearly every game.

I asked Coach Bednar why Conor Timmins isn't in the NHL picture, especially with Makar out. Said Timmins just isn't one of top-performing D for CO Eagles.

Ehlers = Avs 1st + Timmins + Jost Bahahahahahaha

Try not to dream of me tonight Avaholic. Smooches! :)
 

Avaholic29

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Feb 5, 2014
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And you should trust your coach who stated that Timmins isn't a top D performer on the Condors, hence he won't be promoted to the big league even with Makar's injury! That's pretty telling right there. Bouchard is 2nd in AHL rookie scoring. He's miles ahead of Timmins.

And Addison is probably the superior offensive talent compared to Byram while Byram has the edge defensively. Its close though right? I mean, similar to how you feel its close between Bouchard and Timmins. ;)

I'll trust Colorado Eagles beatwriters and the Eagles coach over your ultra-homeristic opinion any day. What was it they said about your inconsistent, injury riddled B prospect?

But the fact remains that Timmins consistently makes large, costly errors in nearly every game.

I asked Coach Bednar why Conor Timmins isn't in the NHL picture, especially with Makar out. Said Timmins just isn't one of top-performing D for CO Eagles.

Ehlers = Avs 1st + Timmins + Jost Bahahahahahaha

Try not to dream of me tonight Avaholic. Smooches! :)


Again, bringing up my knowledge while claiming Timmins plays for the condors and that the quote of Timmins not being the top performer from a while ago is a quote from the avs coach not the Eagles coach lmao nice try though. Clueless player assessment. Timmins is on a heater and your as oblivious as it gets so please take your L and hit the road.
 

Halla

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Jan 28, 2016
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this is pretty bad. Jost isnt very good...probably never a top 6 F.
Timmins is the avs what 3rd/4th best prospect?
+ late 1st?

This would need to be newhook instead of jost and even then im not sure they do it
 

King Woodballs

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Sep 25, 2007
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This thread is hilarious. So much delusion.
Anyways, that proposal does not work from a jets standpoint and wouldn’t touch it with a 10 foot clown pole.
 

Pierce Hawthorne

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Actually it's not even the points, I just threw that in to make your misguided post look even more foolish. It's that you are comparing a 28 year old 2nd/3rd liner to a 23 year old first liner and saying they have similar value. That is what shows your profound lack of knowledge and objectivity when trying to assess player values.


Yeah like I said. Ehlers is overrated. Thanks for reconfirming your stance on the guy.
 

Guffman

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Apr 7, 2016
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The irony of this thread is that the OP stated the following in another thread:

Ehlers should go for a lot. He's a top 6 winner under contract for a while at $6M. That's incredible value

And then he barfs up this trade proposal. LMAO
 
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