William Nylander vs William Karlsson

[WetcoastOrca]

If Karlsson can't do it again - and his shooting percentage suggests he won't - then why pick him moving forward? Ultimately, what happened last year, while impressive, doesn't mean anything in regards to the future. You need to look at what the player is most likely to do in the future. Nylander has shown consistency over his 2 seasons so far. Karlsson has shown more upside. Really, its about if you think he can repeat or not. If he repeats, only fools would take Nylander. If not, well, you get it.

I don’t think Karlsson scores 43 goals this year. But Nylander is a 20 goal scorer unless and until he proves otherwise. That’s a huge gap between the two. Karlsson doesn’t have to repeat a 43 goal season for him to still be better.
And people using career stats ( not you) are being disingenuous. What Karlsson did early in his career has no bearing on the player he is now.

 

[ManofSteel55]

I don’t think Karlsson scores 43 goals this year. But Nylander is a 20 goal scorer unless and until he proves otherwise. That’s a huge gap between the two. Karlsson doesn’t have to repeat a 43 goal season for him to still be better.
And people using career stats ( not you) are being disingenuous. What Karlsson did early in his career has no bearing on the player he is now.

I agree that the career stat argument is pointless.

There is more to being an NHL player than scoring goals. Nearly 1 in 4 of his shots went in. I wouldn't be shocked at all to his point totals drop by 20. Nylander is a better skater, playmaker, and puck carrier. Karlsson is a better scorer and special teams player, or at least was last year. I just want to see him have more than one good season before I consider him that good. Lots of players have had one outlier season. If Karlsson isn't one of those, I'd gladly change my vote.

 

[WetcoastOrca]

I agree that the career stat argument is pointless.

There is more to being an NHL player than scoring goals. Nearly 1 in 4 of his shots went in. I wouldn't be shocked at all to his point totals drop by 20. Nylander is a better skater, playmaker, and puck carrier. Karlsson is a better scorer and special teams player, or at least was last year. I just want to see him have more than one good season before I consider him that good. Lots of players have had one outlier season. If Karlsson isn't one of those, I'd gladly change my vote.

All fair points. I watched Karlsson a lot last year and I think he’s a late bloomer who finally got a chance in Vegas. We’ve seen this before with players like Tim Thomas and others. Is he a 43 goal scorer this year? Almost certainly not. But I’d be shocked if he didn’t score 30-35. He’s just a very good player.

 

[ER89]

43 goals and 78 points are rare feats.
61 points and 20 goals, not so much.
In fact, Karlsson had more than 30% more points and over twice as many goals.
Yay indeed!

Uh yeah but william did it twice hence he proved it and karlsson hasn’t. Don’t mind if you don't agree with his premise but at least don't let it fly waay over your head.

 

[IceNeophyte]

Career to date.

Karlsson - 265 games, 128 points

Nylander - 185 games, 135 points

In how many of those games was Nylander lost on a checking line?

 

[VoluntaryDom]

In how many of those games was Nylander lost on a checking line?

That answer is more than zero because Babs. But yeah, WilliK needed a big role to shine. I honestly see his offense regressing a lot to like 25-30 goals and 50 points but with elite defensive play.

 

[IceNeophyte]

That answer is more than zero because Babs. But yeah, WilliK needed a big role to shine. I honestly see his offense regressing a lot to like 25-30 goals and 50 points but with elite defensive play.

If his goals decline, his assists should increase (though non 1 for 1). He's got some good rebounders on his line.

 

[VoluntaryDom]

If his goals decline, his assists should increase (though non 1 for 1). He's got some good rebounders on his line.

He didn’t have that many primary assists last year which is a warning sign imo

 

[IceNeophyte]

He didn’t have that many primary assists last year which is a warning sign imo

He didn't have primary assists because goals don't lead to rebounds

 

[WetcoastOrca]

Uh yeah but william did it twice hence he proved it and karlsson hasn’t. Don’t mind if you don't agree with his premise but at least don't let it fly waay over your head.

Did what twice? Scored 20 goals and around 60 points. While Karlsson was about a point per game and scored 43 goals. Nylander has never been close to doing what Karlsson did last year.
So he really hasn’t done ‘it’ even once.

If you’re saying that Nylander having two 60 point seasons means he’s likely to get more points than Karlsson then no I don’t accept that premise.
I do accept the premise that a player who was 24 years old to start last year became a star when he was given a leading role by his new team. It’s happened before. It’s not like he was 30 years old and just had an outlier season.
Karlsson was a team leader on a very good team. He’s a very good player. People need to just accept it instead of making excuses.

 

[VoluntaryDom]

He didn't have primary assists because goals don't lead to rebounds

Could be. It also depends on how the line’s chemistry carries over. I know from experience with TB that lines chemistry can fade (Triplets).

 

[IceNeophyte]

Could be. It also depends on how the line’s chemistry carries over. I know from experience with TB that lines chemistry can fade (Triplets).

It's true. But it may not be the case this year. IIRC, the first pre-season outing for the line resulted in 9 points between the tree of them, 4 for Smith, 3 for Marche, and 2 for Karlsson. Last game was a disaster for all our veterans, but I've a feeling they were put in "don't get hurt" mode.

 

[VoluntaryDom]

It's true. But it may not be the case this year. IIRC, the first pre-season outing for the line resulted in 9 points between the tree of them, 4 for Smith, 3 for Marche, and 2 for Karlsson. Last game was a disaster for all our veterans, but I've a feeling they were put in "don't get hurt" mode.

we'll see. I do like Willy K and I want him to keep it up. And i did vote him for better player in this poll.

 

[Sasso09]

Nylander, until Karlsson can prove that he can do it more than once.

Karlsson, until Nylander can prove he can even do it once.

Not to mention the vast defensive advantage for Karlsson

 

[Halla]

Nylander better, Karlsson more pts this year (Nylander likely PP2 in TO)

 

[780il]

But he also had a ridiculously high shooting percentage that will be nearly impossible to replicate. I like William Karlsson, but I don't think last years totals will reflect what he can actually do as a player every year going forward.

This, I chose Nylander

 

[The Burdened]

Next year? Karlsson easily.
Don't even know if or when Nylander shows up to work.

 

[1967th Heaven]

As a leafs fan i honestly can say I thought Karlsson was a one hit wonder just by virtue of his ridiculous regular season shooting percentage, but I never really watched him play until the playoffs and MAN he is the real deal, looks dangerous every shift. idk if he will score 43 again but he is definitely not going to regress back to what he was 2 years ago, he is a hell of a player

 

[LaVar]

Give me Nylander until Karlsson shows last year wasn't a fluke.

 

[ER89]

Did what twice? Scored 20 goals and around 60 points. While Karlsson was about a point per game and scored 43 goals. Nylander has never been close to doing what Karlsson did last year.
So he really hasn’t done ‘it’ even once.

If you’re saying that Nylander having two 60 point seasons means he’s likely to get more points than Karlsson then no I don’t accept that premise.
I do accept the premise that a player who was 24 years old to start last year became a star when he was given a leading role by his new team. It’s happened before. It’s not like he was 30 years old and just had an outlier season.
Karlsson was a team leader on a very good team. He’s a very good player. People need to just accept it instead of making excuses.

Im not saying anything. I'm just trying to tell you what that other guy was saying.

 

[The Abusement Park]

43 goals and 78 points are rare feats.
61 points and 20 goals, not so much.
In fact, Karlsson had more than 30% more points and over twice as many goals.
Yay indeed!

Sustaining a 23.4 shooting % is damn near impossible. If he takes the same amount of shots as he did last year and give him league average he only scores 17 goals. Let’s pump the Karlsson brakes a touch.

 

[DRW204]

As a leafs fan i honestly can say I thought Karlsson was a one hit wonder just by virtue of his ridiculous regular season shooting percentage, but I never really watched him play until the playoffs and MAN he is the real deal, looks dangerous every shift. idk if he will score 43 again but he is definitely not going to regress back to what he was 2 years ago, he is a hell of a player

the guy is a puck hound and tenacious 200 foot player. Even if he regresses to a 60-65 pt player, i think he could be a top 5-10 Selke guy (this past year he finished 5th in total top 3 votes, 6th in OA voting)

His goal heat maps are similar to that of Auston Matthews, lot of goals in front of the net and high danger areas in the slot - i can see why his SH% was high

I remember watching his goal highlights and lot of his goals come off turnovers that he or teammates create turned into rush opportunities and lots of clean up goals near the net.

From what i recall, his individual HDCF as a % of individual CF was similar to Matthews too. He doesn't have the high shooting volume as AM, but it looks he scores goals in similar areas.

 

[psycat]

If WK:s name last season was Bergeron he would have won the Selke. Or rather if Bergeron played like WK he would have won it. Convince me I am wrong.

Anyway this WK and quite easily at that. Anybody who saw him play somewhat regulary should be able to see he is the real deal. 40 might have been a fluke but I fully expect 30+ again.

 

[WetcoastOrca]

Sustaining a 23.4 shooting % is damn near impossible. If he takes the same amount of shots as he did last year and give him league average he only scores 17 goals. Let’s pump the Karlsson brakes a touch.

Why would an elite shooter have a league average shooting percentage?
Makes no sense.
I think most of us expect the shooting percentage to decline somewhat in line with other great shooters.

 

[The Abusement Park]

Why would an elite shooter have a league average shooting percentage?
Makes no sense.
I think most of us expect the shooting percentage to decline somewhat in line with other great shooters.

Because he’s done nothing to prove he’s an elite shooter ever before last season. His average shooting percentage before this season was 8%. Which is just under league average. But he’s never done anything to really prove that he’s some elite goal scorer before this season so I need to see another year like this before I even really call him a top line or even top 6 player.