Will Trotz Be Fired? (poll added)

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Sep 19, 2008
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You all just throwing names at the wall and none of them are better than Trotz. Bylsma? He failed with Buffalo. Why would he succeed here?

Trotz may not work out here, I'll give you all that. But there is no need to fire him right now. He hasn't lost the locker room. When you lose the locker room you're done. His players still pay attention to him and he still leads a team that is a few points away from 1st in the Metro. Then they lose 1 game (fine...3 out of 4 if you want to be picky, all blowouts) and suddenly fans have demanded his ouster. Teams go through tough stretches. Firing just because you feel like satisfying your blood thirst is not exactly a smart thing to do, especially when the backup plan is questionable. "Rierden is good." Do we know that? Yes, he was blocked from interviewing with other clubs, but why would anything change if he were coach? Is he going to magically make this team healthy and infuse talent that was not there before to win that STanley Cup title? "Pittsburgh did it with Bylsma / Sullivan." Yeah, Pittsburgh has no problem firing people when they don't achieve standards. But the last time the Caps fired a coach midseason, did they get past the second round?

You know the answer to that. You should also know that any "quick fix" to try to win Ovechkin his first Cup probably isn't going to work.
 

AtNightWeFly

You better run.
Jun 1, 2014
5,860
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Ever since the Blues fired their dinosaur last season they have had the best record in the league.
Time has come for Barry Trotz. Pull the plug!!!
 

Ridley Simon

Registered User
Feb 27, 2002
18,128
9,067
Marin County — SF Bay Area, CA
You all just throwing names at the wall and none of them are better than Trotz. Bylsma? He failed with Buffalo. Why would he succeed here?

Trotz may not work out here, I'll give you all that. But there is no need to fire him right now. He hasn't lost the locker room. When you lose the locker room you're done. His players still pay attention to him and he still leads a team that is a few points away from 1st in the Metro. Then they lose 1 game (fine...3 out of 4 if you want to be picky, all blowouts) and suddenly fans have demanded his ouster. Teams go through tough stretches. Firing just because you feel like satisfying your blood thirst is not exactly a smart thing to do, especially when the backup plan is questionable. "Rierden is good." Do we know that? Yes, he was blocked from interviewing with other clubs, but why would anything change if he were coach? Is he going to magically make this team healthy and infuse talent that was not there before to win that STanley Cup title? "Pittsburgh did it with Bylsma / Sullivan." Yeah, Pittsburgh has no problem firing people when they don't achieve standards. But the last time the Caps fired a coach midseason, did they get past the second round?

You know the answer to that. You should also know that any "quick fix" to try to win Ovechkin his first Cup probably isn't going to work.

2 Questions:

Why did you mention Bylsma, and not Sutter? A lot more people mentioned Sutter as an answer to the situation.....only like one guy mentioned Bylsma. Seems selective reading on your part? Sutter doesn't fit your rant....Bylsma does...so?

How do you know Trotz hasn't lost the room? The Avs and Flames losses sure look like it. Team played as if it didn't care.
 
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Alexander the Gr8

Registered User
May 2, 2013
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Darryl Sutter's system is incredibly boring. I don't want to see the Caps play like the Kings did under Sutter. It won't get us a Stanley Cup, we're missing some ingredients, and it won't be watchable.
 

AtNightWeFly

You better run.
Jun 1, 2014
5,860
2,474
Upstate NY
Darryl Sutter's system is incredibly boring. I don't want to see the Caps play like the Kings did under Sutter. It won't get us a Stanley Cup, we're missing some ingredients, and it won't be watchable.

Sutter's system may be boring but will it have Caps stuck in their own zone for 50 out of 60 minutes each game? If the answer is no then I say let's hire him tomorrow!
:teach:
 

Corby78

65 - 10 - 20
Jan 14, 2014
11,705
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Ramstein Germany
My main problem (and I don't have a coaching solution) is I think he is losing the locker room. I'm starting to see the "give up" attitude with some of the players. Now it just might be that they are struggling to get motivated over regular season games, when then team is being measured in the playoffs only. But there isn't a fire at all right now, and it needs to get lit before its too late. Something needs to get them moving, and if Trotz can't do it, then a new face will be needed.
 

Ovechkins Wodka

Registered User
Dec 1, 2007
17,443
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DC
This team use to fight back when they didn't score 1st. I think he's lost the locker room. One little thing goes wrong and they quit for the night.
 

g00n

Retired Global Mod
Nov 22, 2007
30,433
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Sutter hasn't done anything in two years. I don't understand why you'd want him here.

Two years? That's short in comparison to our decades of futility. How long has this franchise struggled with the big picture?

When have we ever had a Cup winning coach? Trotz has 10 playoff appearances as coach in 18 years. He's never been out of the 2nd round. He's only ever even won his division twice (the last two seasons with the Caps). His playoff winning % is .452 and he missed the playoffs the last 2 years at Nashville.

Sutter has 2 Cups in the last 6 seasons and 3 total division titles. He's made the Conference Finals 5 times and the SC Finals 3 times. He missed the playoffs 2 of the last 3 years but has only one other miss in his 25 year career: a partial season when he was hired to take over the struggling Flames. His playoff winning % is .520.

Not that I'm advocating the hire, but are we really shitting on Sutter because of 2 years when Trotz's record is there for comparison? It's not even close. You can understand Trotz being here, but not why anyone would consider Sutter?
 
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maacoshark

Registered User
Jul 22, 2017
9,629
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Trotz will simply be let go. His contract is expiring, they'll look to hire someone else or promote one of the assistants.
I agree with this. I think they wait until his contract expires. I honestly don't think firing Trotz now will do anything. The problem is more personnel than coaching. We have too many players on this team that are borderline NHL players.
 
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Langway

In den Wolken
Jul 7, 2006
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I don't think they have the personnel nor the organizational attitude for a pairing with Sutter to be realistic anyway. He's too much of a straight-shooter, too much of a grinding type for a team likely to remain fairly soft. I'd guess that the right type of coach, the ideal experienced candidate with a successful NHL track record, would have a number of reservations about them that would need to be answered if they aren't downright disqualifying. There's a decent amount of skill to work with but also a track record of mental weakness and dodgy IQ that's tough for any one person to come in and suddenly transform.

Everything likely points to an off-season hire, which by their nature will probably be too conventional/mediocre. But I can't discount the possibility of a desperation interim move to Reirden mainly for the sake of shaking it up and just wanting to making the playoffs. There's four and a half more months of games scheduled. Going through a fair portion in participation mode collectively is a grind of a precedent of its own.
 
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g00n

Retired Global Mod
Nov 22, 2007
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I don't think they have the personnel nor the organizational attitude for a pairing with Sutter to be realistic anyway. He's too much of a straight-shooter, too much of a grinding type for a team likely to remain fairly soft. I'd guess that the right type of coach, the ideal experienced candidate with a successful NHL track record, would have a number of reservations about them that would need to be answered if they aren't downright disqualifying. There's a decent amount of skill to work with but also a track record of mental weakness and dodgy IQ that's tough for any one person to come in and suddenly transform.

Everything likely points to an off-season hire, which by their nature will probably be too conventional/mediocre. But I can't discount the possibility of a desperation interim move to Reirden mainly for the sake of shaking it up and just wanting to making the playoffs. There's four and a half more months of games scheduled. Going through a fair portion in participation mode collectively is a grind of a precedent of its own.

Yeah I'm not specifically advocating Sutter but he's clearly a "track record upgrade" in the same way Trotz was a bump vs Oates. Sutter would have the same personnel/style mismatch Trotz has, most likely. If you bring in Sutter then guys like Kuz immediately shift to the trade bubble if they can't adapt. Oshie would be fine. Ovie would probably react the way he did with Hunter. Nick would adjust. Bura and Vrana would be in similar boats with Kuz, imo.

It seems the league movement toward speed and skill fits a portion of this roster and not all of it. Still. That identity problem they've had since Trotz's first "heavy game" year persists.
 

twabby

Registered User
Mar 9, 2010
13,625
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There has to be a happy medium in there somewhere. Joel Quennville, Mike Sullivan, Jon Cooper, Peter Laviolette, Mike Babcock, Pete DeBoer, and a few others all seem like guys who hold players accountable yet still are able to cultivate skill and creativity. None of these coaches are likely to be available any time soon but I also fail to believe there isn't someone out there that is able to replicate any of their success. It'll take an honest and thorough search but someone has to be out there.

Even if you don't think things will necessarily improve this regular season if Trotz is canned, what is really the point of keeping him around? No one really cares about regular season success with this team so either you're gunning for a Cup (where Trotz has failed for years), or you're aiming to develop young players and retool for future seasons. Does anyone have a positive opinion on Trotz's player development?
 

Alexander the Gr8

Registered User
May 2, 2013
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Toronto
I agree with this. I think they wait until his contract expires. I honestly don't think firing Trotz now will do anything. The problem is more personnel than coaching. We have too many players on this team that are borderline NHL players.

While that is true, I find the players themselves aren't responding to Trotz anymore. We can finish the season like that and wait for next summer. If we fire Trotz right now, we're pretty much forced to take Reirden as the interim head coach.
 

Langway

In den Wolken
Jul 7, 2006
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Hey, maybe Edmonton and Washington can swap coaches? It could work for both...aside from the MacLellan/McLellan headaches. If Edmonton bags McLellan for Tippett or something I'd make that change pretty quickly.

The big thing is there being an actual vision in place prior to the hiring process and not just locking in on a particular name, fixating on some individual quality or a point made in an interview. They need to be organized from the get-go and set protocols in place to be able to evaluate candidates more objectively within their stated goals and get it right on a level beyond gut feel or some stupid secondary concern like the market's familiarity with them. It's why I don't expect them to get it right because they don't seem to operate on that level and haven't cared to delegate, trust and empower the front office to be truly decisive. Arguably you can draw a direct line from that way of operating to circumstances dictating a weaker roster and their inability to have much of any strategy internally in combating it (along with potentially overruling MacLellan on making a coaching change). It's why ownership mostly needs to get a clue and back off. Meddling is the ultimate franchise killer and they've done plenty of it over the years. It not only makes for amateurish decisions but gives substandard GMs more slack they probably don't deserve because they don't shoulder full responsibility. It's hard to even begin to hold people accountable when ownership doesn't look in the mirror to begin with.
 

Devil Dancer

Registered User
Jan 21, 2006
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I know you're kidding, but doesn't McLellan have a monster contract? I can't see Ted dishing out that kind of money for a coach.

IRT Trotz, the advantage to firing him now is you can slap the interim tag on Rierden and try him out for a few months before making a final decision over the summer. If Rierden doesn't work out the org saves face a little by not firing yet another coach, while still giving him a shot.
 
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brachyrynchos

Registered User
Apr 10, 2017
1,472
997
Any euro coaches a possibility? With a roster depending on them, maybe someone who's coached overseas, would be better suited for who we have, and how they like to play? And if no one is qualified/available, cross it off the list. Then look towards college, then the minors, then assistants around the league who might be a good fit. Process of elimination and simplifies the task at hand.
I always thought Keenan would be good for this team, albeit for a short period.
 

Langway

In den Wolken
Jul 7, 2006
32,267
8,894
I know you're kidding, but doesn't McLellan have a monster contract? I can't see Ted dishing out that kind of money for a coach.
Good question. Apparently CapFriendly has some coach salaries, too. They have McLellan listed at $3M and Trotz at $1.5M. Signing McLellan on the open market these days would require a raise and anyway Chiarelli is probably going to make a trade or two first. After Babcock's mega-deal Trotz is in a great position and, much like other pending UFAs, could just play out the string and see what the market bears. He should be able to get $3-5M per from someone. Maybe Dallas. So he doesn't have much incentive to burn any bridges to make this all work. If it's eroded, so be it. He'll have other opportunities.

If the Caps are stuck in that price range despite the market then they're not going to land any quality experienced option. Their best-case would be betting on finding the next Jon Cooper (Jim Montgomery maybe?). But good luck with that, particularly when they don't seem to have much of a handle on how to screen/evaluate.
 
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Sep 19, 2008
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I just have a moral and ethical issue with people saying Trotz should be fired when the team clearly hasn't quit on him yet. Does a team that quit on Trotz score 2 in the first and go on a 4-0 goal run? He's still there, they're still paying attention to him. If you want him gone, fine, I'm not going to argue that. If you are going to give the excuse of inconsistency or road woes, I'm not going to argue that either. You're entitled to your opinion. But firing him now isn't going to do much. The best time to fire him is after the season ends. I seriously doubt an interim coach can just hop in this situation and win a Cup. Are we that desperate for a championship that we are willing to entertain the thought of Daryl Sutter, a man who players hate, a general jerk in particular, to lead this team? Need I remind you he A) missed the playoffs in his last season and B. Even if that's not good enough for you his last PLAYOFF run was a quick elimination to the Sharks with a loaded Kings team. What makes you think that he would succeed here?

Ever since the Blues fired their dinosaur last season they have had the best record in the league.
Time has come for Barry Trotz. Pull the plug!!!

I agree Hitchcock hasn't been any good but they replaced him with Mike Yeo and Mike Yeo still "couldn't get the Blues past the second round".
 

Alexander the Gr8

Registered User
May 2, 2013
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Toronto
I just have a moral and ethical issue with people saying Trotz should be fired when the team clearly hasn't quit on him yet. Does a team that quit on Trotz score 2 in the first and go on a 4-0 goal run? He's still there, they're still paying attention to him. If you want him gone, fine, I'm not going to argue that. If you are going to give the excuse of inconsistency or road woes, I'm not going to argue that either. You're entitled to your opinion. But firing him now isn't going to do much. The best time to fire him is after the season ends. I seriously doubt an interim coach can just hop in this situation and win a Cup. Are we that desperate for a championship that we are willing to entertain the thought of Daryl Sutter, a man who players hate, a general jerk in particular, to lead this team? Need I remind you he A) missed the playoffs in his last season and B. Even if that's not good enough for you his last PLAYOFF run was a quick elimination to the Sharks with a loaded Kings team. What makes you think that he would succeed here?

I agree Hitchcock hasn't been any good but they replaced him with Mike Yeo and Mike Yeo still "couldn't get the Blues past the second round".

The Kings weren't loaded when they lost against the Sharks. Hitchcock has been past the 2nd round with the Blues and has a Stanley Cup on his resume. I'm not advocating for either, just stating facts.

Trotz most likely won't be back next year as his contract is expiring, so discussing his replacement is legitimate.
 
Sep 19, 2008
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His replacement sure, it'll probably be Rierden. My position is since we all know he's gone at the end of the year why shake things up right now? If he fails just don't extend his contract.
 

g00n

Retired Global Mod
Nov 22, 2007
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So I'm curious...when they play bad it's the players not executing, but when they show up it's proof the coach is doing great job?
 
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RandyHolt

Keep truckin'
Nov 3, 2006
34,639
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If we all know he is gone at the end of the year, why prolong the inevitable? Is anyone afraid of Reirden wrecking the team? By now, Barry has used up his bag of tricks.

About winning.... players can only sand bag so much. Let's call them accidental goals - specifically by players trying to make it in the league and get a pay day high enough they can afford to play like a bag of sand and force the hand of a GM or Owner in denial. The Vrana's, the Willy's, the UFAs.

This looks like a bag of sand when I watch it

tenor.gif
 
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