Will Atlanta Get Another Team?

[Mayor Bee]

Hasn't Montreal lost two NHL teams previously, and almost lost the Canadiens to Cleveland?

 

[Mayor Bee]

Definitely do not agree with the that with regards to Atlanta to Winnipeg. The team in Winnipeg has had a far higher gate then anything in Atlanta. Also, Miami - a city of similar size as Atlanta - has had a team for 25 years, and was recently purchased by what many classified as a "good owner." Yet the team is at the bottom (or second from the bottom) of the league in terms of revenue and value. Why would Atlanta be any different? Given the current arena location in Atlanta, why would things be any different for the team's valuation and revenue today? Very unlikely....

Sounds exactly like all the naysayers who bashed Vegas for being "another Phoenix", which so far has resulted in a spectacular egg-to-the-face.

I'll just start tying Toronto and Montreal to Ottawa. They're all the same, right?

 

[BigBadBruins7708]

Sounds exactly like all the naysayers who bashed Vegas for being "another Phoenix", which so far has resulted in a spectacular egg-to-the-face.

I'll just start tying Toronto and Montreal to Ottawa. They're all the same, right?

well, except for Atlanta already being a 2x failure.

and frankly being a bad pro sports town period. they struggle for support of all pro franchises, not just hockey. Hell, the 90s Braves notoriously failed to sell out NLCS games

 

[AtlantaWhaler]

well, except for Atlanta already being a 2x failure.

and frankly being a bad pro sports town period. they struggle for support of all pro franchises, not just hockey. Hell, the 90s Braves notoriously failed to sell out NLCS games

I love how everyone points to weekday mid-afternoon non sellouts in a 52,000 seat baseball stadium 20 years ago as to why Atlanta is a bad sports town.

How about a recent example like selling out the latest couple postseason games a couple weeks ago (42,000). Lets just ignore the MLS team getting over 50,000 every home match (in many cases over 70,000) and the fact that College Football is so hot here that the NCAA uprooted the Hall of Fame from Notre Dame and moved it downtown a few years ago.

 

[powerstuck]

I love how everyone points to weekday mid-afternoon non sellouts in a 52,000 seat baseball stadium 20 years ago as to why Atlanta is a bad sports town.

How about a recent example like selling out the latest couple postseason games a couple weeks ago (42,000). Lets just ignore the MLS team getting over 50,000 every home match (in many cases over 70,000) and the fact that College Football is so hot here that the NCAA uprooted the Hall of Fame from Notre Dame and moved it downtown a few years ago.

So Atlanta's problem might be sports market saturation ?

 

[AtlantaWhaler]

So Atlanta's problem might be sports market saturation ?

Not sure where you're seeing any problem in my post you quoted.

I assume you're referring to dysfunctional owners who spent their years here suing each other? I don't know what that has to do with too many sports teams in the city.

 

[Archangel]

Not in my life time. There was little or no out cry the last time they left. People can come up with as many reasons as they like and defend them any which way they like and get as pissy with other posters like me who does not see Atlanta getting another team. The problem was and is over saturation when it came to corporate money and that is how a pro team will live or die. That is one reason why the Atlanta Hawks, who drew the lowest total attendance last year are able to survive--they are getting the corporate money. Hockey in Atlanta was a niche market that could stand up to the fact the demand was not there for the team.

 

[Roadrage]

How is Atlanta a bad fit but Raleigh a good one?

A owner willing to absorb losses for at least the next 7 years and an NHL arena the team controls is my guess.

 

[Dirty Old Man]

I've never understood that, especially when factoring in College Football.

A lot of that reputation has to do with some of the pre-Glavine/Smoltz/Avery/Maddux Braves teams in the first 20 or so years after moving from Milwaukee...for example...

1988 Atlanta Braves Schedule | Baseball-Reference.com

...I remember photos in sports pages that today's attendance bashers would be quite proud of, of widely, widely scattered spectators in the premium sections behind the dugouts.

 

[AtlantaWhaler]

A
...I remember photos in sports pages that today's attendance bashers would be quite proud of, of widely, widely scattered spectators in the premium sections behind the dugouts.

If that's your thing, it's pretty easy to find a lot of stadiums with the lower, corporate seats empty.

 

[powerstuck]

Not sure where you're seeing any problem in my post you quoted.

I assume you're referring to dysfunctional owners who spent their years here suing each other? I don't know what that has to do with too many sports teams in the city.

When I say market saturation...

Atlanta has Flacons (NFL), Braves (MLB), Hawks (NBA), United (MLS) plus all other college/NCAA sport teams.

But no matter how many teams you have, you still have the same amount of disposable cash for sport teams. At some point, too many choices to where to spend your ''entertainment cash'' means not everyone gets a viable following.

 

[blueandgoldguy]

Florida (not Miami) has had a team for 25 years and it has made the playoffs 5 times. Their "good owner" completely blew apart their roster and coaching staff after a great season and now they're spinning their wheels on the ice again. I could just as easily point to Dallas, Tampa, Nashville and ask why a properly run franchise in Atlanta would be any different from them.

And yet a few years ago when he purchased the team, Viola was praised as a good owner. The persons he put in charge a couple of years ago made some changes, but it's not like they blew apart the entire roster. I think the mistakes made have been acknowledged with the placement of Dale Tallon back in the Gm's chair. Personally, I think the Panthers will be a good team this season despite the mistakes of the recent past. I fully expect them to make the playoffs.

Is there any reason to believe if the team remained in Atlanta that the team would be any more successful and actually drawing well. I guess it's possible but pretty unlikely. It's probably more unlikely the team would continue to have issues like Carolina and Florida.

 

[blueandgoldguy]

Point of information: Philips Arena opened in 1999, and the Infinite Energy Arena opened in 2003. IEA is perfectly nice for what it is---a 12,000-seat mid-size arena---but it's not comparable in size or amenities to a Class A arena like you'd see in the NHL or NBA. It would be ideal for an AHL team, however.

Right, I am just stating that Infinite Energy Centre is fine for current concerts and all their modern trappings. I used U2 as an example as they have one of the more elaborate stage setups in the marketplace and that arena was seen as a suitable host for 2 concerts.

We know with the renovations to Phillips Arena that is can also host modern concerts and is set to host the NBA for the next couple decades. Given these two arenas, not to mention amphitheatres, I just don't see how there will be a need for another arena for the forseeable future for a sports team or concerts. What currently exists in the market is more than adequate...unless a suburb/county (ideally located in the northern part of the city), decides to heavily subsidize an arena to lure a current or expansion NHL team in the near future. I can't see a private group spending $500 - $650 million on a new arena given the current situation.

 

[blueandgoldguy]

Hasn't Montreal lost two NHL teams previously, and almost lost the Canadiens to Cleveland?

Yes, losing teams nearly a century ago is analogous to the recent relocation of NHL teams.

 

[blueandgoldguy]

Sounds exactly like all the naysayers who bashed Vegas for being "another Phoenix", which so far has resulted in a spectacular egg-to-the-face.

I'll just start tying Toronto and Montreal to Ottawa. They're all the same, right?

that doesn't negate my point in response to the original poster. If the Thrashers had remained in Atlanta there isn't any reason to believe the team would be worth more or have greater revenue then the Jets. It's just as likely if not more so that the team would continue to suffer at that gate as the other teams I had mentioned.

 

[Bucky_Hoyt]

Could they in the future? Yes, anything's possible but probably not for a very, very long time.

Kudos on the United and the gambit of baseball in Cobb county. Looks like both have paid off.

Maybe in some alternate universe the Thrashers are thriving but not here. Could be, like the Braves, that hockey does better outside of the city centre. Who knows.

Something more realistic would be to see the AHL in Gwinnet. Maybe become Tampa's affilliate in the near-term?

 

[BKIslandersFan]

If Atlanta United was ran like Thrashers they woulda been outta Atlanta a lot sooner than when Thrashers did.

Atlanta United is actually ran well, with great PR and they actually care about the product they sell to the fans.

 

[gstommylee]

If Atlanta United was ran like Thrashers they woulda been outta Atlanta a lot sooner than when Thrashers did.

Atlanta United is actually ran well, with great PR and they actually care about the product they sell to the fans.

Umm Atlanta United is owned by the falcom's owner so they wouldn't be out of there like the Thrashers.

 

[BKIslandersFan]

Umm Atlanta United is owned by the falcom's owner so they wouldn't be out of there like the Thrashers.

I reckon attendance would be poor and Falcons would eventually get them out of there.

 

[LeafShark]

Atlanta has a hockey market comparable to florida, phoenix, and carolina, so I mean technically yes, but... Ehhhh. Quebec City has a better case for a city that lost their team twice.

 

[aqib]

Clearly US and Mexico have the same capacity to support sports teams financially. Clearly they are in similar situations and are absolutely comparable.

Also, they have the same preferences as far as what sports they like

Seriously though, you're making my point that population doesn't automatically result in fan support. Its the same reason why we don't have a top flight cricket team in North America. Sure we have hundreds of millions of people here but not enough like cricket to support it.

 

[aqib]

Atlanta has had a "bad sports town" rep for years. It's not a hockey situation, it's a sports one imo. That said if Atlanta gets an NHL team thenI'm all for it, we need the presence.

Why? Other than the few people who live in Atlanta that went to games and you who misses the Thrashers?

 

[Jumptheshark]

sorry

long and short answer is no

 

[aqib]

1) And the Canadian dollar was crappy for more teams than just two.

Ultimately, it was the ownership that never wanted the team that was the reason they moved, but I was also making a point to add the recession as another factor.

2) A non-NHL team metro adding that many jobs along with the corporate money here? Houston only other.

3) The Mexico City comment. I feel like it's 2010 all over again.

With the last two points, I think you're not realizing or considering that Atlanta is the #9 metro (soon to overtake Philly at #8) in terms of population. Couple that with the corporate presence. Sure, Jackson, Mississippi probably added jobs, but half a million? In a city with 6 million people? No.

The strength of Atlanta's economy wasn't the issue in terms of no one wanting to own a team in Atlanta. It was the fact that despite having a lot of people and a strong corporate presense the people and corporations didn't want to support a hockey team. Between SEC Football, ACC Basketball, the NFL, etc hockey will struggle for attention in that city.

 

[BKIslandersFan]

Also, they have the same preferences as far as what sports they like

Seriously though, you're making my point that population doesn't automatically result in fan support. Its the same reason why we don't have a top flight cricket team in North America. Sure we have hundreds of millions of people here but not enough like cricket to support it.

Sure, it’s not population, it’s economy. And Atlanta is good for it.

Comparing cricket to ice hockey in America just shred any credibility in that post. You realize how stupid that comparison is?