Why the Habs need to make a push now

[A55P2]

I think MB did the right moves so far. He potentially upgraded the 4th line while not losing anything of value. That's exactly what he should have done and I'm happy that's what he did. We saw in the past two games that we can play well against good teams, but we're still missing a few players to really make a push. The goal now is to make the playoff and hope that we'll get advantageous matchups so that we could potentially make a "surprise" push, but not an actual planned one if that makes sense, not one like the Jets, Tampa or Toronto.

 

[LaP]

I would go all out this year. Prospects are nice but that's all they are. Some of them never pan out. And remember, it wasn't the top dogs that reached the finals last year so stop saying we are not the Bolts, Jets or Preds.

Come on Washington has been a top dog for a decade now. They have one of the best center line in the whole league. They have the best winger of the whole league. A more than adequate goalie. A very good top 3 at the defense.

[edit] ok i realize 25th you were talking about LV and not Washington. Somehow i read won the finals instead of reached. Sorry about that.

This said a GM making moves trying to replicate the exception instead of the rule would be a bad GM. Personally i think Mcphee is a pretty bad GM and he was seriously luckly with Karlsson and Florida was very generous with him.

 

[25th]

Come on Washington has been a top dog for a decade now. They have one of the best center line in the whole league. They have the best winger of the whole league. A more than adequate goalie. A very good top 3 at the defense.

[edit] ok i realize 25th you were talking about LV and not Washington. Somehow i read won the finals instead of reached. Sorry about that.

This said a GM making moves trying to replicate the exception instead of the rule would be a bad GM. Personally i think Mcphee is a pretty bad GM and he was seriously luckly with Karlsson and Florida was very generous with him.

Holtby wasn't doing to good last year and no one was saying it was finally the Caps year going into the playoff last year if I remember correctly.

As I was saying, it's not always the top dogs that make it to the finals, or even win it all. You want some exceptions?

Stanley cup winners in the last 10 years
Washington was 6th in the league last year
Chicago was 7th in the league in 2015
LA was 10th in the league in 2014
LA was 13th in the league in 2012
Boston was 7th in the league in 2011
Pittsburg was 8th in the league in 2009

The Habs are now 11th after a 3 game losing streak. The need help on the PP and a LD to be a serious contender and I think they have the assets to make it happen without completely emptying the bank.

 

[cphabs]

I know most fans would like Bergevin to do a proper rebuild. Stack on prospects and don't trade future for a marginal Cup push.

The way I see things, we have a lot of older players like; Weber, Price, Petry, Tatar. Also, we have a lot of players that are having a career year and for some of them, it's only going to go downward after that.

I don't see Gallagher, Shaw, Petry, Tatar, Benn, Price and Weber having too many better season then this in the future. That is a fairly big chunk of our team. They are currently performing at the top of their expectations. You have to believe they won't be able to sustain this pace for too long.


Other things to consider;

This Draft is fairly weak; With Kotkaniemi, Domi, Danault, Poehling, Evans, Olofsson. I think the Habs are set in stone at Center. We also have Primeau who in my mind is a blue chip prospect keeper and most Habs fan are underrated him. He could very well be Price's backup in 3 years. That leaves us with Defense; with the emergence of Romanov and Brook this year and you could also add Cale Fleury, who is having a pretty decent first pro season. Habs are not looking too bad but we have to keep in mind that we will need to replace Petry and Weber in the near future so this really make the Defense our biggest needs. The 2019 draft, in my opinion, is pretty average especially for defencemen. I'm very high on Byram but he obviously won't be available. Other then that I'm not a big fan of York, Robertson, Seider, Broberg etc. there is not many D that project to be top 2 D.

Lots of good players available; I can't remember the last year that we had so many big names available at the deadline. That means the price for a rental will be lower than usual. We could be getting a player like Zuccarello for a 2nd rounder + mid prospect. This was the price for Plekanec last year. If him bergevin I would be targeting a player that could help our PP.

I would be willing to move a player like Suzuki or our 1 or 2nd rounder pick depending on the offer.

Lots of good players available; I can't remember the last year that we had so many big names available at the deadline. That mean the price for a rental will be lower then usual. We could be getting a player like Zuccarello for a 2nd rounder + mid prospect. This was the price for Plekanec last year. If him bergevin I would be targeting a player that could help our PP.

I would be willing to move a player like Suzuki or our 1 or 2nd rounder pick depending on the offer.

You were saying?

 

[S Bah]

Habs are playing extremely well game after game. A few breaks going their way and quite easily could be in the playoffs. They are a wild card team now, but they need to build for the future, not trade assets for a quick fix IMHO!!!...

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

If we don't want to improve things for now, then I'm all for unloading vets. Pick a path.

Personally, I would add a LD and a scorer and see what happens. The team has exceeded expectations and there's some decent depth scoring. Carey Price immediately bounced back after Weber's return and his numbers would likely only improve with more help on D.

The odds of winning a cup are small no matter what you do. But they're a lot smaller if you aren't picking one way over another. We don't need to deal away Romanov but we could deal away picks or use cap space to our advantage.

What I hate seeing is us wasting Carey Price. Every year we're mediocre/bad is another we've wasted with that guy. If that's what we're going to do then just trade him and get the picks/prospects in return.

 

[1909]

Now they gave to fight to keep a Playoffs spot vs Buffalo, Carolina, Pittsburg and Columbus.... Even Philly is not that far behind.

 

[Edgy]

Slap shot, defensive awarness and physicality are his only elite attributes, and physicality is the least important skill you can find in an elite player. Elite players have skating, deking, ice vision, elusiveness, wrist shot, slap shot, passing, poking, offensive awarness, etc. In other words, Weber will be an excellent foot soldier, playing sound D; but, he's not a gamebreaker, he won't create a goal when you need to; instead, he's great at protecting the lead. Other Dmen have big canons too, other Dmen can play sound defense too.

I've had that argument with several people before. Saying he's a solid top 2D but not elite is not a popular opinion around here lol.

 

[Omar]

Talk to me when we have our own version of Stamkos and Kucherov (who can easy score 70-80 goals between them), while keeping Price and Weber and all of our young players. We have to keep accumulated young players and filling holes by going all out for guys like Panarin to close that gap. And do it fast before Weber and Price start slowing down. It won’t be easy.

 

[Gaylord Q Tinkledink]

Talk to me when we have our own version of Stamkos and Kucherov (who can easy score 70-80 goals between them), while keeping Price and Weber and all of our young players. We have to keep accumulated young players and filling holes by going all out for guys like Panarin to close that gap. And do it fast before Weber and Price start slowing down. It won’t be easy.

So, you're saying we need primary scores?

We also need at least 1 LHD not a crappy one.

We need someone better than Gallagher to screen goalies. By better I mean taller. Goalies average what 6'3 now ? They can see over Gallagher.

We need a lot and should sell what we can and try hard for the ufas this summer which should be quite a bit of good ones.

Use assets to acquire that LHD and this team could be much better to the current team.

Bergevin sits still. Does nothing, we lose in the first round, then lose Benn for nothing, re-sign Armia to an expensive contract, or 1 year deal and lose him next year for nothing.

Lehkonen's value likely goes down more. Then again, he'll finish with 7, or 8 goals. Should be able to beat that... I hope.

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

Talk to me when we have our own version of Stamkos and Kucherov (who can easy score 70-80 goals between them), while keeping Price and Weber and all of our young players. We have to keep accumulated young players and filling holes by going all out for guys like Panarin to close that gap. And do it fast before Weber and Price start slowing down. It won’t be easy.

Panarin would be a nice start.

 

[Edgy]

You have 3 teams that are above the others, and have a legit shot at the cup than you have than a other 10 teams that are 1 player and a bit of luck away for winning the cup than you have and other 8 teams which include MTL that are 2 players away, the only reason we should be inquiring about rental available is to raise the price for other team.

Realistically, we're missing 4 pieces not just 2.
We need a true #1 center, an elite top line winger and 2 top 4D. Kotka and Mete won't cut it if you want a true chance at the cup, too inexperienced and inconsistent to be relied on in a do or die series. But if we get at least a top scorer and top 4 puck moving d, we might be able to squeak by into the finals if we get a favorable match up or two.

 

[BaseballCoach]

I know most fans would like Bergevin to do a proper rebuild. Stack on prospects and don't trade future for a marginal Cup push.

The way I see things, we have a lot of older players like; Weber, Price, Petry, Tatar. Also, we have a lot of players that are having a career year and for some of them, it's only going to go downward after that.

I don't see Gallagher, Shaw, Petry, Tatar, Benn, Price and Weber having too many better season then this in the future. That is a fairly big chunk of our team. They are currently performing at the top of their expectations. You have to believe they won't be able to sustain this pace for too long.


Other things to consider;

This Draft is fairly weak (EDIT: that's ridiculous); With Kotkaniemi, Domi, Danault, Poehling, Evans, Olofsson. I think the Habs are set in stone at Center. We also have Primeau who in my mind is a blue chip prospect keeper and most Habs fan are underrated him. He could very well be Price's backup in 3 years. That leaves us with Defense; with the emergence of Romanov and Brook this year and you could also add Cale Fleury, who is having a pretty decent first pro season. Habs are not looking too bad but we have to keep in mind that we will need to replace Petry and Weber in the near future so this really make the Defense our biggest needs. The 2019 draft, in my opinion, is pretty average especially for defencemen. I'm very high on Byram but he obviously won't be available. Other then that I'm not a big fan of York, Robertson, Seider, Broberg etc. there is not many D that project to be top 2 D.

Lots of good players available; I can't remember the last year that we had so many big names available at the deadline. That means the price for a rental will be lower than usual. We could be getting a player like Zuccarello for a 2nd rounder + mid prospect. This was the price for Plekanec last year. If him bergevin I would be targeting a player that could help our PP.

I would be willing to move a player like Suzuki or our 1 or 2nd rounder pick depending on the offer.

Lots of good players available; I can't remember the last year that we had so many big names available at the deadline. That mean the price for a rental will be lower then usual. We could be getting a player like Zuccarello for a 2nd rounder + mid prospect. This was the price for Plekanec last year. If him bergevin I would be targeting a player that could help our PP.

I would be willing to move a player like Suzuki or our 1 or 2nd rounder pick depending on the offer.

I like how the team has progressed this year. A lot of it has to do with our two elite players being on the ice and playing like elite players since December 1st. But we aren't close enough to a Cup to "make a push now", meaning going for two month rentals. Zuccarello is not going to make a big difference. I would not move Suzuki for any rental, not even Stone. I would trade a conditional first for one of the top pending UFAs if there was a reasonable chance of signing him. If he doesn't sign, the first is downgraded to a second. I could live with that. We have enough prospects to afford losing one second if the gamble does not pay off. But if the player tells us that there is no chance he wants to play here long term, then don't even spend a second rounder to rent him.

At this time, we need to push for players that will be here for this year and the next two at least. I know this is not an easy task, and the GM may not be up to it, but he must try and if he fails, he can be replaced.

 

[BaseballCoach]

Realistically, we're missing 4 pieces not just 2.
We need a true #1 center, an elite top line winger and 2 top 4D. Kotka and Mete won't cut it if you want a true chance at the cup, too inexperienced and inconsistent to be relied on in a do or die series. But if we get at least a top scorer and top 4 puck moving d, we might be able to squeak by into the finals if we get a favorable match up or two.

Lots of contending teams have some holes. I do agree that if we land an elite scoring winger like Stone, Skinner or Panarin plus Gardiner or some top-3 D with term, we have a reasonable chance to fight it out to make the ECF. Especially if we finish 7th or higher.

For guys like Kotkaniemi and Mete, this year is a great learning experience, but I agree they can't be expected to be the horses that pull the carriage.

 

[BaseballCoach]

Habs won't rebuild while Price and Weber are on the team. There is no player like Pacioretty left to do a re-tool. So either you start looking this year for the missing pieces or you wait for the UFA.

......

this year 1st round pick, our 2nd round picks, Lehkonen or Byron, Juulsen or Fleury, Poehling or Suzuki should all be available to fill the missing 2 pieces.

The first rounder, Poehling and Suzuki should only be available for a long-term asset, not a rental. The rest of the players mentioned, perhaps one can be sacrificed for a TOP UFA on rental with a chance to sign with us. If Panarin, for example, says "NY, LA or Florida only", then no.

 

[BaseballCoach]

You have 3 teams that are above the others, and have a legit shot at the cup than you have than a other 10 teams that are 1 player and a bit of luck away for winning the cup than you have and other 8 teams which include MTL that are 2 players away, the only reason we should be inquiring about rental available is to raise the price for other team.

That puts us behind 13 clubs and fighting with 7 others.

I'd say you're close but I see it like this:

We are 11th in winning percentage and all of those ten teams ahead of us look stronger than Montreal. Also, despite Pittsburgh being behind us, I would rank them ahead of the Habs. So 11 teams clearly better than us.

I see us competing for 12-15 with Carolina, St. Louis and Vegas. It would take a big talent influx to make us contenders. The Zuccarellos, Hayeses or Dzingels won't be enough.

 

[Burke the Legend]

No we didn’t!!!!.....we had no centres back then either, this window has been shut since 93.....having Radulov and Markov would’ve IMO allowed us to enjoy 2 rounds of playoff hockey....

Can you let go of Markov pls? Loved the guy bu:t he's old man. He was dominated by the Rangers and only weber carrying him prevented a total embarrassment.

 

[thewall]

2 weeks ago I thought we were 90% sure of making it.

Now.. with Hurricanes play im not so confident.

Habs have 1 more games vs TB 2 vs Toronto 1 vs Wpg. They still have to go on the California trip and we all know how this usually ends. 2 more games vs NYI. 1 game in Carolina where we never play good. Hopefully im wrong about this.

 

[InTheWrist]

this year 1st round pick, our 2nd round picks, Lehkonen or Byron, Juulsen or Fleury, Poehling or Suzuki should all be available to fill the missing 2 pieces.

No they should not. That is how you ensure you keep on not winning. This team is nowhere near ready to make an actual run.

If anything, finishing outside the wildcard spot will do this team more good than playing a round and losing to Tampa in 5 games.

The minuscule chance of a kaapo or Hughes is far more worthwhile than 5 play off games. It is suicide to consider trading Poehling, Suzuki, Brook and/or 1st and 2nd rounds picks to "make a push"...Suicide.

 

[Mario Lemieux fan 66]

No they should not. That is how you ensure you keep on not winning. This team is nowhere near ready to make an actual run.

If anything, finishing outside the wildcard spot will do this team more good than playing a round and losing to Tampa in 5 games.

The minuscule chance of a kaapo or Hughes is far more worthwhile than 5 play off games. It is suicide to consider trading Poehling, Suzuki, Brook and/or 1st and 2nd rounds picks to "make a push"...Suicide.

It's not suicide trading those assets for a sign Stone or Panarin or for a sign top 2 LHD.

Beaulieu and Tinordi were supposed to be a solid middle pair duo for us they both bust. The Kostitsyn Brothers were once hyped to be Sedin-lite, Fucale was seen as a starting goalie, de la Rose an elite 3rd line shutdown center, Scherbak a middle 6 winger, etc.

I am not saying to do a Mcdonagh-Gomez 2 ( Gomez had a top 2 worse contract in the league at the moment of the trade) but for the right players sign long term some of our youth could and should be sacrifice. Not all our prospects will have the impact we hope for and Price and Weber won't be elite for ever.

 

[Hins77]

Bergevin have to move this year. Big move. Cause we have nothing in ahl ou junior who is ready next year for doing the big step. So, if it continu like this. We will be worst next year, cause bergevin dont bring help

 

[Big Lurk]

Holtby wasn't doing to good last year and no one was saying it was finally the Caps year going into the playoff last year if I remember correctly.

As I was saying, it's not always the top dogs that make it to the finals, or even win it all. You want some exceptions?

Stanley cup winners in the last 10 years
Washington was 6th in the league last year
Chicago was 7th in the league in 2015
LA was 10th in the league in 2014
LA was 13th in the league in 2012
Boston was 7th in the league in 2011
Pittsburg was 8th in the league in 2009

The Habs are now 11th after a 3 game losing streak. The need help on the PP and a LD to be a serious contender and I think they have the assets to make it happen without completely emptying the bank.

Oh lord...

All these teams had at least the following : a legit 1-2 punch at center, top 2 offensive defensemen, and at least 1-2 scoring threats on the wing.

Name those players for us please, pretty please I'll wait.

We're not there yet. Lets not f*** it up yet again.

 

[Runner77]

Bergevin have to move this year. Big move. Cause we have nothing in ahl ou junior who is ready next year for doing the big step. So, if it continu like this. We will be worst next year, cause bergevin dont bring help

Sold. Dangle Drouin plus to CBJ for a signed Panarin. Boom.

 

[HOPE]

Bergevin have to move this year. Big move. Cause we have nothing in ahl ou junior who is ready next year for doing the big step. So, if it continu like this. We will be worst next year, cause bergevin dont bring help

Please. We aren’t contender right now! Get over it i can’t see 1 possible player you can bring with substrating another decent player that would make us contender. What happened to all the fan who we’re ready to be patient and was satisfied with not being a playoffs team if we build a solid prospect pool? Only a took half a season of overachieving to sell the farm and push for a stanley cup??

I’ve said this even when montreal was playing great, we won’t make the playoffs this year, i hate bergevin but if he doesn’t trade futures to bring help for a playoff push, i will very well respect that and it’s the right thing to do! Can’t wait for the delusional fan who will be mad that bergevin didn’t trade our 1st and suzuki to bring a decent 29 year old to make the playoffs! You guys will be the same crying at him in a few years when the team didn’t do any damage and the assets we traded are actually good and made sense for a retool for years to come.

 

[Hfbsux]

Making a push this year is non sense, plain and simple. You can't aim for the 1st overall pick at the beginning of the season and aim at the cup midway through.