Why is London always good?

[fanofdo]

If you were a parent of child selected in the first few rounds of the most recent 2016 midget priority selection, what questions would you have of the OHL organization that made the pick? Remember, your kid isn't even finished grade 10 yet and you're concerned.

Question: Where will my kid go to school? London's answer: the Blyth Academy, which we co-own and operate. Private school, small classes. Athletes only. Next question?

Question: If my kid eventually wants to attend college or university while still a player on the team, what community options are available? London's answer: University of Western Ontario and Fanshawe College. The Knights will even bring in people from those institutions to speak with prospective players and their families.

Question: With whom will my kid billet? London's answer: Nearly the perfect family for your kid. We learn about your kid and then carefully match him with a family. We invite you down to be part of the process of selecting a billet family and even foot the bill for you all to go out to dinner together. No billet family assigned without your approval. We have a waiting list of interested billet families -- these are top notch families.

Question: is the city safe? London's answer: try finding a safer city in the CHL. Beautiful city, low crime. Come and see for yourself.

Question: As a midget AAA player last season, the travel time was really onerous on our son. Sometimes, it seemed like we lived in the car! Will the boy endure this again? London's answer: we are perfectly situated along the major highway in Ontario, and most of our out-of-town trips are less than 2 hours by first-class coach.

Question: if we want to come and watch our boy play, is London easy to get to? London's answer: if you are driving, we are along the 401 highway and easy to get to. if you are flying in, Pearson airport in Toronto is less than 2 hours away.

Question: for the last 8 years, my son has had different coaches and different "hockey philosophies" every year. Will that happen to him over the next 4-5 years here? London's answer: there is not a more stable organization in the CHL. In some organizations, the owners constantly meddle and players suffer. Here, the owners are former NHL players and executives who meddle every single day to provide a thoroughly professional experience for the players.

In short, there are lots of reasons for the Knights' success, but understanding exactly how parents see things and what they want is a huge strength

Great post!

 

[aresknights]

Great points RCS and Tigers.

 

[Voight]

If you were a parent of child selected in the first few rounds of the most recent 2016 midget priority selection, what questions would you have of the OHL organization that made the pick? Remember, your kid isn't even finished grade 10 yet and you're concerned.

Question: Where will my kid go to school? London's answer: the Blyth Academy, which we co-own and operate. Private school, small classes. Athletes only. Next question?

Question: If my kid eventually wants to attend college or university while still a player on the team, what community options are available? London's answer: University of Western Ontario and Fanshawe College. The Knights will even bring in people from those institutions to speak with prospective players and their families.

Question: With whom will my kid billet? London's answer: Nearly the perfect family for your kid. We learn about your kid and then carefully match him with a family. We invite you down to be part of the process of selecting a billet family and even foot the bill for you all to go out to dinner together. No billet family assigned without your approval. We have a waiting list of interested billet families -- these are top notch families.

Question: is the city safe? London's answer: try finding a safer city in the CHL. Beautiful city, low crime. Come and see for yourself.

Question: As a midget AAA player last season, the travel time was really onerous on our son. Sometimes, it seemed like we lived in the car! Will the boy endure this again? London's answer: we are perfectly situated along the major highway in Ontario, and most of our out-of-town trips are less than 2 hours by first-class coach.

Question: if we want to come and watch our boy play, is London easy to get to? London's answer: if you are driving, we are along the 401 highway and easy to get to. if you are flying in, Pearson airport in Toronto is less than 2 hours away.

Question: for the last 8 years, my son has had different coaches and different "hockey philosophies" every year. Will that happen to him over the next 4-5 years here? London's answer: there is not a more stable organization in the CHL. In some organizations, the owners constantly meddle and players suffer. Here, the owners are former NHL players and executives who meddle every single day to provide a thoroughly professional experience for the players.

In short, there are lots of reasons for the Knights' success, but understanding exactly how parents see things and what they want is a huge strength

Amazing post. I can verify a lot of this.

 

[Voight]

and then the questions once the kid is a bit older

So Boston College, BU, Michigan, ND and every other school wants me to go down on a full ride scholarship and have first class everything.. Why should I forget about that and go to this CHL team?

also,

OK I am currently playing at "NCAA school", why should I leave here and play major junior?

-I can only speak for a certain team in WHL that finally got caught, but the answer to both of those questions was $$$$$$$$$$

it happens everywhere.. heck I know of many guys that got paid under the table to play Junior A haha

CHL better prepares you for the NHL, more exposure etc.

 

[Otto]

and then the questions once the kid is a bit older

So Boston College, BU, Michigan, ND and every other school wants me to go down on a full ride scholarship and have first class everything.. Why should I forget about that and go to this CHL team?

also,

OK I am currently playing at "NCAA school", why should I leave here and play major junior?

-I can only speak for a certain team in WHL that finally got caught, but the answer to both of those questions was $$$$$$$$$$

it happens everywhere.. heck I know of many guys that got paid under the table to play Junior A haha

As previously posted...

Aside from that, there have been enough disgruntled players that have come through London over the years (Akim Aliu & Dane Fox come to mind) don't you think that if there were any shenanigans going on someone would have spilled the beans?

 

[superdee]

I can tell you that Mark Hunter put a 150 Kms on his truck every year because he bought them from my buddy and Basil and Rob Simpson work just as hard. All you need to look at if you are a kid who's ultimate goal is to play in the NHL is how many ex-Knights are there. Stability in ownership and management help as well. Ever sit near the Knight's bench? Dale never yells and berates the players like most of the coaches in the OHL. It is just like Rouyn-Noranda's coach said he had to change. The London Knights treat their kids like they would like to be treated themselves and it grows from that. Examples are Mitch Marner giving the kid in Kitchener his stick or handing the Ross Robertson trophy to Jacob Bush a Knight's draftee who had cancer and back surgery. The Knight's aren't afraid to make deals to better there team with players who don't want to report to their drafted teams. They gave Belleville 3 second round picks for Michael McCarron, 3 seconds to Kingston and some other picks for Max Domi and 6 seconds for Victor Mete. Tyler Parsons, Chris Martanent, Brandon Crawley and CJ Yakomovich all part of the Memorial Cup Champs were free agent signings that anybody could have had. They don't cheat they just work harder and longer at it and have great talent evaluators.

 

[Skinnyjimmy08]

As previously posted...

Oh I saw that post... but I know for a fact kids get paid haha... and some kids get a TON.. I'm not saying London does forsure cause I'm not from that area but I do know of many junior teams that do in different leagues .

 

[cnauta]

Why wouldn't you want your boy to play in the best run organization in the non professional world? Best coaching staff, best arena in the CHL, best city in the CHL, best educational options, low crime , clean city etc. Etc. Etc. To top it off the NHL already knows that London is the place to be for developing players for their league. Forget the NCAA, play in the CHL as it better prepares you for the big leagues. Ask Corey Perry or Nazem Kadri or Rick Nash or even Patrick Kane where the best place to be is in the non professional hockey world. I guarantee their answer is London!

 

[93LEAFS]

Having gone to Blyth toronto (Its sort of a credit mill but its small classes and very focuesed compared to your average ontatio highschool, but its no UCC or St Georges in Van, but it caters to you I'm sure the Athlete branches of it are the same) and UWO, its pretty easy to see why London would be the preferred destination for any player. There may be payouts (all big teams this is true for, but I can't confirm anything), but London is a first class organization with almost no one matching it. Its combo of stability, location, and set-up is unmatched as far as I know. I know Windsor has done their best to replicate this also. The Hunter's have created a culture, that people want to be a part of. Knights are the closest thing to a professional operation and are deeply ingrained in the London community. UWO co-ed's don't hurt the recurment either when compared to being in Sudbury...

As for kids leaving BC or turning down full rides, if you think you are 100% going to the NHL like some of these kids (the Kane's, Carlson's, McCarron's etc) why go to class. You can return to school post NHL if you want. Plus, if you've seen the booster associations for some of these big name college programs, they aren't all that clean either.

 

[DudeWhereIsMakar]

Many reasons. They draft players who commit to NCAA late hoping they change their minds or they take the right player in the first round.

They treat their players and staff well which will make them want to stay, like their scouts, development staff, equipment managers, etc. Look at all the people who go to the NHL from the London Knights.

 

[Sec108]

Hats off to all the posters on this thread, its been really great reading and has just reinforced what alot of fan's around the CHL have always thought was happening.

The CHL is all politics and money and the hockey is way down the list.Who really loses is the paying fan.

But you can't blame London, if someone is going to give you a million dollars with a wink and a smile who wouldnt take it.The blame goes to the top brass of the OHL/CHL, not the Hunter's.

Here in Windsor where we were sanctioned by the OHL, fans seem to have seen the light of it all and between a bad economy and souring on league politics have stayed away in droves from the WFCU Centre.Most games were lucky to have 2500 fan's in a 6600 seat building and we had a pretty good team compared to the past 4 yrs.

As the host city the cup this season we will see how fan's will react this time with sanctions still upon the Spitfires.

 

[Mitts Marner*]

$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$

 

[Otto]

Hats off to all the posters on this thread, its been really great reading and has just reinforced what alot of fan's around the CHL have always thought was happening.

The CHL is all politics and money and the hockey is way down the list.Who really loses is the paying fan.

But you can't blame London, if someone is going to give you a million dollars with a wink and a smile who wouldnt take it.The blame goes to the top brass of the OHL/CHL, not the Hunter's.

Here in Windsor where we were sanctioned by the OHL, fans seem to have seen the light of it all and between a bad economy and souring on league politics have stayed away in droves from the WFCU Centre.Most games were lucky to have 2500 fan's in a 6600 seat building and we had a pretty good team compared to the past 4 yrs.

As the host city the cup this season we will see how fan's will react this time with sanctions still upon the Spitfires.

Again, it's been reported that a disgruntled player blew the whistle on Windsor.. there have been many reported disgruntled players go through London.. why has no one blown the whistle?

For Skinnyjimmy08 & 93Leafs, who say the "know" it happens with other teams, start naming names then, otherwise, you're part of the problem.

 

[Sec108]

Again, it's been reported that a disgruntled player blew the whistle on Windsor.. there have been many reported disgruntled players go through London.. why has no one blown the whistle?

For Skinnyjimmy08 & 93Leafs, who say the "know" it happens with other teams, start naming names then, otherwise, you're part of the problem.

The mistake the Spitfire org. made was not making the league name who the accusers really were.

No one should be allowed to remain anonymous and hide.Put up or shut up.

 

[Skinnyjimmy08]

Again, it's been reported that a disgruntled player blew the whistle on Windsor.. there have been many reported disgruntled players go through London.. why has no one blown the whistle?

For Skinnyjimmy08 & 93Leafs, who say the "know" it happens with other teams, start naming names then, otherwise, you're part of the problem.

well Portland finally got caught due to a player that was traded asking his new team how he goes about getting a cell phone, airplane tickets and cash. He thought that was just what happens with every team and didn't realize it was against the rules. So then the league was finally forced into looking into it(after years of turning a blind eye) cause other owners demanded it cause Portland was caught red handed, and the league found a complete mess of rules being broken on that team for many years

Its shocking that you honestly don't think it happens. I know that in junior A about 15 years ago, there were 3 teams that were accused and caught of paying their players and absolutely nothing was done cause those teams were the cream of the crop and generated a ton of money for the league and the league was just happy cause a lot of WHL players were leaving the WHL or deciding against the WHL and joined those teams and that was HUGE back then to have sure fire WHL kids decide to play Junior A. I can assure you that I know of 2 people that joined a particular team and received 1500 just to show up and then another 1000 a month for the season. They showed up mid season ish at Xmas and finished the season with 6-7000 dollars each. Other players were happy those kids decided to come play and didn't care at all that those particular kids were getting paid and they weren't, cause the team was better and they were all exposed to a lot more opportunity for scholorships and all that. Its a win win for everyone. Kids got paid, teams won championships, league made money and other kids on the team got noticed.

Again though, Im not speaking for London situation cause I am not familiar with it, but I am extremely familiar with certain WHL teams and BCHL teams so I can only comment on those situations.

 

[Skinnyjimmy08]

well Portland finally got caught due to a player that was traded asking his new team how he goes about getting a cell phone, airplane tickets and cash. He thought that was just what happens with every team and didn't realize it was against the rules. So then the league was finally forced into looking into it(after years of turning a blind eye) cause other owners demanded it cause Portland was caught red handed, and the league found a complete mess of rules being broken on that team for many years

Its shocking that you honestly don't think it happens. I know that in junior A about 15 years ago, there were 3 teams that were accused and caught of paying their players and absolutely nothing was done cause those teams were the cream of the crop and generated a ton of money for the league and the league was just happy cause a lot of WHL players were leaving the WHL or deciding against the WHL and joined those teams and that was HUGE back then to have sure fire WHL kids decide to play Junior A. I can assure you that I know of 2 people that joined a particular team and received 1500 just to show up and then another 1000 a month for the season. They showed up mid season ish at Xmas and finished the season with 6-7000 dollars each. Other players were happy those kids decided to come play and didn't care at all that those particular kids were getting paid and they weren't, cause the team was better and they were all exposed to a lot more opportunity for scholorships and all that. Its a win win for everyone. Kids got paid, teams won championships, league made money and other kids on the team got noticed.

Again though, Im not speaking for London situation cause I am not familiar with it, but I am extremely familiar with certain WHL teams and BCHL teams so I can only comment on those situations.

also Ill even throw in, that back years ago when I played junior A, I played for a team that was considered a team that was more rich than others and I cant even tell you the amount of extra money was given out by the owner to the players. COUNTLESS times before games he would pin up a 100$ bill and say things like "whoever gets the first goal gets this" or before OT started he would come in and pin up money and say "whoever gets the OT goal gets this" and so on and so on. Owners don't just strictly take care of those star players, they make it worth while for everyone

 

[BadgerBruce]

I don't want to beat a dead horse here, but the Knights' ongoing success really is about stability.

Many fans tend to view an OHL club's stability (or lack thereof) solely through the lens of wins and losses. Thus, if a club experiences a 5-10 year stretch of on-ice success, it is "stable."

But educated parents and their family advisors look much deeper than that. A first or second round midget priority selection pick has four, at most 5 seasons in the league (overage year included). Doesn't it make sense for a family to look closely at the most recent 5-10 year stretch of the team in terms of ownership, management and coaching? Seriously, if a team can't keep its front office ***** together for five consecutive years, isn't that a potential red flag for families with kids being asked to commit for 4-5 years?

Keep in mind that there are often A LOT of "unwritten promises" made when a kid signs a standard player agreement. A coach might say, "I see you as a legitimate 4th line winger to open year one, with a good chance of 3rd line minutes by Christmas. In year 2, I see you leading the offence from the second line . . . with some PK time and a shot at top line minutes." That sort of talk is pretty common. A stable group of hockey people lay out a development path for the next 4-5 years, one designed to help a player reach his full potential.

Parents, of course, so badly want to believe what they are being told about their offspring, but they need solid historical reasons to make the leap of faith and sign of behalf of their children. Verbal promises made from a coach or GM unlikely to be around in 4 years are worthless.

So let's look at six iconic OHL franchises -- Kitchener and London from the west, Ottawa and Peterborough from the east, and Sudbury and the Soo from the north. Nice cross-section of teams with LONG histories in the league, not a newbie in the bunch. These teams have all been around for so long that their very names scream "stability."

And let's take the upcoming 2016-17 season as a starting point and then move back exactly 5 seasons, to 2012-13. In other words, this upcoming season's overage players were rookies in 2012-13, so what we're looking for is coaching stability within organizations for the duration of an OHLers career. Too much to ask?

Kitchener: 4 coaches in 5 years (Spott, Smith, Van Ryn, and Mckee).

Sault St. Marie: 3 coaches in 5 years (Stapleton, Keefe, Bannister).

Sudbury: 3 coaches in 5 years (Cull, Fixter, Matsos)

Peterborough: 2 coaches in 5 years (Pelino, Hull)

Ottawa: 2 coaches in 5 years (Byrne, Brown)

London: 1 coach in 5 years (Dale Hunter).

Before anyone starts to accuse me of cherry picking OHL teams, let me just add that Oshawa has had 4 coaches in 5 years, Kingston has had 2 in 5, Saginaw 3 in 5 (with a 4th on the way), and Sarnia 3 in 5. Damn hard to find stability behind the bench in the OHL!

What's it all mean? The two OHL teams with the most coaching stability, that have not relocated, are London and Barrie. And guess what those two (along with Ottawa) have in common? Private, athletes only high schools for their high school age players. What else? Well-known former NHL players (Hunters, Hawerchuk, Jeff Brown) behind the bench.

So, one reason why "London is so good" is that they have put into place REAL stability, the kind parents can rely on. Wins and losses be damned. Attendance be damned. That's not the first kind of "stability" players, families and their advisors look for. God help the kid who got a promise from Steve Spott in Kitchener and now needs Jay Mckee to honour it (with 2 other coaches in between). Make a deal with the Hunters and you can be pretty sure they'll be around by the time you turn pro. Same with Hawerchuk.

Every time I hear about a disgruntled owner or GM about to make a change behind the bench, I shiver. No, No, No! Even if the team turns things around in the short term, you've poisoned the well for the future.

 

[Mitts Marner*]

Is it really the team's fault when NHL and AHL teams come knocking for head coaches? No. Of the list of teams with multiple coaches, how many of them left for pro jobs?

This may have a little bit to do with the overall popularity of the Knights, but I seriously have a hard time believing that a team with a good coaching staff in place is going to be turned down because they have been in place less time than the Hunters.

Honestly, the size of the arena, and the amount of money that the team brings in for OHL revenues based on that is the reason why they're so good. So yeah, the Knights do get away with more than other teams, and have the resources to make these things happen.

With the amount of rules in place to make sure that players don't have a competitive advantage over others (mainly PEDs) I don't really understand why the league allows an uneven playing field among ownership.

 

[Otto]

So yeah, the Knights do get away with more than other teams, and have the resources to make these things happen.

With the amount of rules in place to make sure that players don't have a competitive advantage over others (mainly PEDs) I don't really understand why the league allows an uneven playing field among ownership.

Such as?