Why is Connor Brown penciled into the top 9?

LeafsBoyo

Registered User
Oct 18, 2010
124
140
Toronto, Canada
He had 28 points last year with 15mins ATOI.

He doesn't drive play. He doesn't generate offense. His corsi numbers aren't good. He was one of the worst primary assist guys in the league. Even Matthews and Marner struggled offensively when given shifts with him. The eye test would indicate he frequently would kill offensive opportunities. He's a textbook 3rd line winger and that's just not good enough for our roster.

His preseason has been uneventful. The Kadri line hasn't looked good. He doesn't have a unique gamebreaking skill like someone like Kapenen does with his speed (not that he's been great himself)

He's just... there. Rarely impactful. You don't notice him. On some teams that might be passable but IMO we are too stacked offensively for him to be gifted minutes with Kadri.

Its too bad Johansson and Kapanen have both been disappointing because I would rather have either in Brown's spot. Hell I would have liked to see Grundstrom or Engvall get a shot with Kadri.

Thoughts?
 

Fogelhund

Registered User
Sep 15, 2007
21,054
23,159
He had 28 points last year with 15mins ATOI.

He doesn't drive play. He doesn't generate offense. His corsi numbers aren't good. He was one of the worst primary assist guys in the league. Even Matthews and Marner struggled offensively when given shifts with him. The eye test would indicate he frequently would kill offensive opportunities. He's a textbook 3rd line winger and that's just not good enough for our roster.

His preseason has been uneventful. The Kadri line hasn't looked good. He doesn't have a unique gamebreaking skill like someone like Kapenen does with his speed (not that he's been great himself)

He's just... there. Rarely impactful. You don't notice him. On some teams that might be passable but IMO we are too stacked offensively for him to be gifted minutes with Kadri.

Its too bad Johansson and Kapanen have both been disappointing because I would rather have either in Brown's spot. Hell I would have liked to see Grundstrom or Engvall get a shot with Kadri.

Thoughts?

So, two game hot takes then?

Brown had the second most PK minutes of any returning forward last year. He's a hard worker, and has earned his time. Yes, he will need to produce and have a decent level of play, to keep his spot, but two games of preseason and we are jumping to conclusions?
 

zeke

The Dube Abides
Mar 14, 2005
66,937
36,957
he had a legit good first year, but wasn't good at all last year.

but you're right, he shouldn't be pencilled in anywhere. he should be earning every minute he gets. but much like Hyman, babs fell in love with him early.
 

hector morrison

Registered User
Apr 1, 2018
4,792
1,998
He had 28 points last year with 15mins ATOI.

He doesn't drive play. He doesn't generate offense. His corsi numbers aren't good. He was one of the worst primary assist guys in the league. Even Matthews and Marner struggled offensively when given shifts with him. The eye test would indicate he frequently would kill offensive opportunities. He's a textbook 3rd line winger and that's just not good enough for our roster.

His preseason has been uneventful. The Kadri line hasn't looked good. He doesn't have a unique gamebreaking skill like someone like Kapenen does with his speed (not that he's been great himself)

He's just... there. Rarely impactful. You don't notice him. On some teams that might be passable but IMO we are too stacked offensively for him to be gifted minutes with Kadri.

Its too bad Johansson and Kapanen have both been disappointing because I would rather have either in Brown's spot. Hell I would have liked to see Grundstrom or Engvall get a shot with Kadri.

Thoughts?
Ask Babs... likely same reasoning as Hyman playing with all-stars....one of the great mysteries!
 

Randy Randerson

Registered User
Jul 28, 2016
10,637
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Hamilton
the bottom 6 wingers should be musical chairs until the best combinations are found - Brown/Kapanen/Johnsson/Leivo/Ennis and in an ideal world Hyman all get rotated until jobs get solidified by merit
 

Randy Randerson

Registered User
Jul 28, 2016
10,637
3,445
Hamilton
the bottom 6 wingers should be musical chairs until the best combinations are found - Brown/Kapanen/Johnsson/Leivo/Ennis and in an ideal world Hyman all get rotated until jobs get solidified by merit
 

Ratboy

I made a funny!
Jul 15, 2009
16,855
3,343
the bottom 6 wingers should be musical chairs until the best combinations are found - Brown/Kapanen/Johnsson/Leivo/Ennis and in an ideal world Hyman all get rotated until jobs get solidified by merit
Yeah get hyman in the bottom 6 already. Ennis will be getting 1st line minutes until willy signs ,whenever that is.
 
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moon111

Registered User
Oct 18, 2014
2,890
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There are certain 'negative' stats that are meaningless depending on how you want the players to play. If Babcock wants the 3rd line to get the puck to Kadri (4th line to Kapanen) and have him take off in a mostly solo rush... ...while the other players play very conservative, that's going to influence stats. Kadri might end up with a ton of turnovers, but it keeps the opposition, which was often the other team's best line, on their toes. And if the team is prepared for it, is it really a problem? Kadri could turn the puck over and there would be Komarov, C.Brown, and two defensemen in wait. If Bozak turned the puck over, you'd have JVR sucking wind just trying to get to the bench, Marner skating like hell, but if he was in deep, it's a little too late. And Bozak trailing the play on anyone who was an above average skater. A Bozak turnover was 10x worst then a Kadri turnover. Connor Brown didn't go to the net, he stayed safe. Kadri didn't assist on a single Connor Brown goal. (And likewise, Kaps has 2 assists in his career...nobody else jumps into his plays either.) And although I don't think Kadri's the 'best' play-maker, under 'normal' play-style, Connor Brown easily breaks 20 goals working with Kadri.

It may seem weird, but good forward defense often comes at the price of offensive numbers.
 

Blanche Blanche

Torontoooooo
Dec 2, 2017
3,449
3,455
Toronto
Yeah get hyman in the bottom 6 already. Ennis will be getting 1st line minutes until willy signs ,whenever that is.

Hyman is a 3rd liner and should be shifted up whenever a top line needs a workhorse. Playoffs hes a bit more useful due to grit. We all know this.

Ennis could be a wildcard player this season. That turnover Snipe / Hustle and feed to Matthews was something Hyman has rarely done in 2 seasons nvm just 2 preseason outtings.
 

Ratboy

I made a funny!
Jul 15, 2009
16,855
3,343
Hyman is a 3rd liner and should be shifted up whenever a top line needs a workhorse. Playoffs hes a bit more useful due to grit. We all know this.

Ennis could be a wildcard player this season. That turnover Snipe / Hustle and feed to Matthews was something Hyman has rarely done in 2 seasons nvm just 2 preseason outtings.
Ennis seems to be a makeshift replacement for Nylander. He's fast and has puck skills plus vision. I think he may have trouble staying healthy due to his lack of Size but he's surprised me thus far. If he can pull these types of plays off in the regular season and stay healthy what a steal that signing will be.
 
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MR4

Registered User
Oct 20, 2014
6,270
2,253
This this this thiiiiis so much this

He's the basic meh 3rd liner while we have guys like Johnsson & Kappy that show much more potential
Would definitely need a bit more PP time to score 20
He's pure trash on the PP. why would we give him more time? Just to make him feel better and inflate his stats?
 
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MagicalRazor

Registered User
Oct 25, 2016
1,518
591
Hes a work horse he gives it 110% every shift . He is defensibly reasonable , can PK and play on the PP . Hes a solid player, hes going to put up 40 points this year i'd put money on that . his puck retrieval is awesome. he averaged 15 mins a game and probably close to 4 of them were on PK'S 30 point PK players are good
 

LeafsOHLRangers98

Registered User
Jun 13, 2017
6,572
6,718
I wouldn't say he should be in the top 9, but he should be where he is in the lineup. Kadri's line 5 on 5 needs to be able to shut down the best lines in the league, and for that you want a kid like those above described. Works hard, never takes a shift off. I can live with 28 points if he keeps the McDavids and Crosbys of the world off the scoreboard 5 on 5.

Ideally Hyman-Kadri-Brown becomes the combo one day but for now its good enough with Leivo/Johnsson/Ennis on the other wing.

Our top 2 lines should dominate the weaker competition 5 on 5 at home and our 4th line should easily beat up on other teams 4th lines.
 
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SprDaVE

Moderator
Sep 20, 2008
51,546
32,305
He's got a lot more "offensive points" to give. He's a smart player who is great along the boards and kills penalties really well. The guy will go through a wall for the team. He's your prototypical "glue" guy who had a bit of a down year.

I don't know why some Leaf fans hate Brown and can't wait to trade him.

I also don't understand the obsession with Grundstrom or even Engvall around here either. They are good young prospects but they haven't exactly set the world on fire by any stretch of the imagination. Brown was so much better at the same age.
 

Walshy7

Registered User
Sep 18, 2016
25,326
9,343
Toronto
Because the team needs PKers and defensive zone starts and better he gets them than Nylander or Marner.

weird Pkers cant play 4th line? Brown is a 4th liner the only problem is we don't know if Kapanen isn't a 4th liner, I personally think he is better but he needs to show it. Id start the season with Kapanen with kadri give it x number of games if he blows by Kapanen great if not then we have 2 4th line RWs
 
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lifelonghockeyfan

Registered User
Dec 18, 2015
6,283
1,356
Lake Huron
Assuming Marner and Nylander (or Ennis) play the top two lines, is there much KNOWN difference between Brown and Kapanen? Brown, Kapanen and Hyman seems like the three "wingers" on PK, so there opportunities for Brown and Kapanen to get enough minutes to contribute.
Agree with Walshy7 above. Give Kapanen some better offensive minutes with Kadri to start the season and see if can get his NHL offence confidence/production established.
 

LeafGrief

Shambles in my brain
Apr 10, 2015
7,616
9,532
Ottawa
He's our best swiss-army knife. He's playing on the Kadri line because Babcock trusts Brown's defensive abilities and that line is going to be getting tough matchups. Brown doesn't create a whole lot of offense, but we really don't need every single player in the top9 to be a 30g threat. With so much firepower I think many people lose sight of the fact that 20g production is a 2nd liner on a lot of teams. Brown is an excellent bottom sixer and having to play him on the fourth line some nights is probably the best indicator there is of this team's elite forward depth.
 

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