Why did Quebec not get a team?

Discussion in 'National Hockey League Talk' started by nilan30, Dec 4, 2018.

  1. aufheben

    aufheben as if

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    Are you going to elaborate on why they aren't? Particularly Dallas. Also that doesn't automatically make QC a good market.
     
  2. Rowlet

    Rowlet Registered User

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    QC is the perfect emergency option, you never want to expand there because in case of an emergency you can put a team there like the NHL did with the Thrashers to WPG
     
  3. Oddbob

    Oddbob Registered User

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    Preseason games are not exciting or worth the over inflated prices to see less than quality NHL action. These are not a fair estimate for any city wanting a team. I for one wouldn't pay money to go watch exhibition games, they aren't that great, and most of the time, it is AHL rosters with a few good NHLers anyhow.
     
  4. aufheben

    aufheben as if

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    If the Coyotes end up moving and just go to Houston the reactions on this site are going to be pretty funny.

    Would having the Nordiques back be cool? Yes. Is that a good reason to put them there? No.
     
  5. Rowlet

    Rowlet Registered User

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    Coyotes would likely stay west as it would jumble up the divisions too much
     
  6. Oddbob

    Oddbob Registered User

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    [​IMG]
     
  7. Voight

    Voight #winning

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    Lol.... no they didn't.

    Not sure what time your referring to but when Vegas was given a team Seattle didnt have their **** figured out yet. They also have had no viable arena until this huge renovation plan was announced. Quebec City is the one thats been screwed over and backstabbed.

    "Quebec had its chance" is the dumbest thing ever. So did Atlanta, Denver, Twin Cities and Winnipeg...... all got second chances with 3/4 working out to this day.
     
    Last edited by moderator garnetpalmetto: Dec 6, 2018
  8. Voight

    Voight #winning

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    People keep saying that but Uncle Gary seems to be content with various Sunbelt teams bleeding money.

    I dont think they had a chance too this time... NHL had its blinders on and only cared for Seattle. It would have been a losing battle for them anyway, Bettman could care less about Canada.
     
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  9. MSSLYNX

    MSSLYNX Registered User

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    Awful comment my friend. Buffalo and Winnipeg say hi. NHL players are rock stars in QC and unknown Joes in Columbus and Arizona.

    And to the poster saying there are not enough big companies, how many suites are there in an arena? You dont need 500 companies. We already know there are more than enough fans. New arena is there.
     
  10. MSSLYNX

    MSSLYNX Registered User

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    Cmon now. 10 000 is more than half the actual teams have for preseason games with their team on the ice.

    And half the city despise their former rivals. I am not paying to see Boston B team vs Mtl B team.

    Add 5000 more fans and still they would not have a team today. Crap.
     
  11. Oddbob

    Oddbob Registered User

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    What are you getting at? I was on the defending side, that preseason games don't determine whether a city would or could support a team. I also stated I wouldn't pay to see exhibition games and that includes the Wings in exhibition. Confused by your point!
     
  12. MSSLYNX

    MSSLYNX Registered User

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    Yeah i am going in same direction you are.
     
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  13. Grudy0

    Grudy0 Registered User

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    Seattle has almost as rich of a hockey history. After the Metropolitans won the Cup in 1917, the league folded in the mid 1920's. Upon rebirth of the PCHL during WWII, Seattle has had hockey ever since, with a brief interruption of a couple of seasons in the mid 1970's, due to the shuffling deck chairs of the WHA.
     
  14. Grudy0

    Grudy0 Registered User

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    Let me see if I have this right:

    "Hockey" needs to place franchises where there is a grassroots "love of the game".

    And then the comparison is to UFC, where anyone would be lucky that two percent of the filled arena have ever participated in UFC.

    The idea to go where the demand is for UFC can be applied to the same ticket drive that Seattle held. Outside of Winnipeg, the ticket drive for Seattle is also an anomaly of big demand for the product. I just don't understand the hate.
     
  15. USAUSA1

    USAUSA1 Registered User

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    Quebec has Montreal, be happy with that.
     
  16. Mike Jones

    Mike Jones Registered User

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    QC has all of this history and more plus they have a new arena that's already good to go.
     
  17. MSSLYNX

    MSSLYNX Registered User

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    Quebec Remparts vs Seattle Thunderbird battle of junior hockey attendance?

    Not even close. Seattle under 5000 (capacity of 6500) while Quebec draws over 9000 average every year, 13000 + average 15-16.

    Hockeydb figures.

    I know fans support seem less important than tv revenues, median income or growing possibilities. If someone could give me tv revenues numbers, i would like that.
     
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  18. Silencio

    Silencio Registered User

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    It's a fair point, but Montreal has been selling out their MLB exhibition games for years and now the commisioner is openly talking about how they're top of the list for the next expansion. These things do matter.
     
  19. Grudy0

    Grudy0 Registered User

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    Seattle did get screwed over during expansions:

    The criteria for the 1967 expansion was that a market had to have pro sports teams - that left out Seattle, even though the Totems of the WHL were fairly successful.

    In 1974, the NHL granted Seattle a conditional expansion franchise (along with Denver). Later in 1975, the Penguins and the Scouts were in financial trouble and almost moved. Vince Abbey was to be owner of the Seattle franchise, but it was revoked because of financial concerns. However, there was a lawsuit against the NHL that lasted for nine years if I recall right, which finally confirmed the NHL has the right to pick who is and is not in its ownership club.

    Then that 1990 expansion push that ended up with Ottawa and Tampa Bay - the then-owner of the NBA Sonics Barry Ackerley simply screwed over his partners, torpedoing the expansion bid by walking into the Board of Governors meeting and withdrawing the bid, immediately before the ownership group was scheduled to present their case in front of the Board of Governors.

    So it isn't like there haven't been problems - Seattle has likely been the most snakebitten market with respect to the NHL in modern times, surpassing Cleveland during the "Original Six" era.

    It isn't like there's much "Uncle Gary" can do. He cannot relocate teams - that's the responsibility of the teams' ownership.

    Then again, when both the Thrashers and the Coyotes were problems, "Uncle Gary" was able to direct the Thrashers to Winnipeg. Seems like True North had been a good partner to the League and were rewarded with a relocated team.
     
    Last edited by moderator garnetpalmetto: Dec 6, 2018
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  20. Djp

    Djp Registered User

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    try back in the 70s expansion period and in the early 90s.
    Given checkered NHL expansion history, league treading carefully with Seattle on franchise launch year

    above is just one article--but its been talked about in various stories over the years. One story was from the 90s when San Jose was awarded a franchise they were going to get one then some back deal was done pulling it away. A big part of it was the NBA blocking NHL from coming in.

    Key Arena was viable one designed for both sports. part of the deal that was done had the Sonics redesigning the arena for basketball only so trying to play a hockey game was like how the Islanders were in Barkleys


    Seattle Thunderbird are located in Kent a southeast suburb. Everett is located north of Seattle. There is no team in Seattle. instead look at combine crowd size. Everett arena is a larger facility of around 9,000
     
    Last edited by moderator garnetpalmetto: Dec 6, 2018
  21. jfhabs

    jfhabs Registered User

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    Exactly. But, it should take 6-7 years minimum unless it's Ottawa in the next few. Floride has an agreement with the City for 7-8years. Arizona will most likely move to Houston, big market and central division still mais sense there.
     
  22. Viqsi

    Viqsi where we're going we don't need draft picks

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    That would be because I thought they'd sent in an application alongside Vegas and that that application was still 'active'.
     
  23. Mortimer Snerd

    Mortimer Snerd You kids get off my lawn! Sponsor

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    AFAIK, that bid was put on hold by the bidder. The $C had just dropped quite sharply changing the financial picture quite a bit. Now the $C has recovered a little but the price of an expansion franchise has escalated by 30%. Don't know if anyone is willing to pay 875-900mil $C to put a team in QC.

    The Panthers are currently valued at $295m by Forbes. Add a bit of a premium (seems like they always offer a little above market), pay 320. The NHL would demand a transfer fee but those are a lot less than entry fees. Say 100m. With those numbers QC could get a team for ~550-575m $C. Wait until the 2023 out clause in the Panthers lease deal or pay a lump sum to get out of it, if that buyout is not prohibitive, say another 50m.

    The whole league gets healthier. Total revenue grows. Revenue sharing costs for all other teams go down. Every owner gets 2-3 mil in their pockets from the transfer fee (depending on how much the league keeps). The league no longer has the embarrassment of one its teams not being able to give away tickets. That last should be huge. For some reason the NHL doesn't seem to care.

    The downside is the loss of a regional rivalry with TBL. Don't know how much that is worth when the 2 teams are always far apart in on ice quality. I don't think that rivalry has ever really developed.
     
  24. MSSLYNX

    MSSLYNX Registered User

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    Thanks for that info. Didnt know that.

    Everett draws less than 5000 right? Thats pretty much my point.

    Seattle metro is 3.7 millions. Quebec metro is 800. Quebec draws as much as 2 teams. And there are 2 other teams within 90 minutes drive from Quebec.

    Quebec league has teams really close to each other (Victoriaville and Drummondville). 40 minutes drive. Never any traffic. Why combine crowds?
     
  25. NinjaKick

    NinjaKick Go Devils! Go Canada!

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    Does Quebec deserve a team? Absolutely... maybe more than anyone

    but the NHL is more of a business than a sport, simple as that.
     
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