Who Would You Rather The Leafs Pay: Raymond vs. Kulemin

[samyy]

Kulemin all day everyday. Love Raymonds speed and offense but this team needs Kulemin's defensive presence. Easily the best defensive forward we have, right up there with McClement.

 

[Puckstuff]

Kulemin all day everyday. Love Raymonds speed and offense but this team needs Kulemin's defensive presence. Easily the best defensive forward we have, right up there with McClement.

this

mcclement + kulemin + Bolland are what makes our bottom 9 elite and what will cary us in the playoffs.

 

[My Sweet Shadow]

It's a tough call, especially with the small sample size for Raymond and the even smaller sample size for Kulemin. Raymond's shown a lot more offensive flair and he has the footspeed advantage (he's looked great on both the PK and PP), but Kulemin has more of a physical edge and is definitely the better all around player.

In the end, it depends what they each ask for. I wouldn't want to invest much more than $2M in that 3rd line wing position, as I'd rather leave money for Phaneuf, Bolland, McClement, Franson, Fraser, Gardiner, and Reimer.

 

[Leafs at Knight]

Yup, nailed it.

 

[leafstilldeath*]

Its as important to keep the puck out of our net as it is to put the puck in the opposition's net.

Kuli plays his role effectively in keeping the puck out of our net and is very dependable even strength and PK. Also, Kuli takes the body and hits as well also built like a tank. He is a role player. Assuming Kuli wants to stay would pick Kuli.

Its still early to comment on Raymond though. Its his contract year so expect him to play better than what he has previously. Didn't watch much of the Canucks so do not know what he is all about. May be someone would wanna chime in on that

 

[Lauro]

Kulemin NC

 

[zeke]

Broll and leivo.

Don't waste capspace on third line wingers.

 

[The_Chosen_One]

Broll and leivo.

Don't waste capspace on third line wingers.

We'll probably see that happening. Neither are part of our core. Seeing that we've been drafting quite regularly, it makes no sense to re-sign older depth players.

Chicago is the model to follow IMO.

 

[FifthLine]

I think you sign one or the other at the end of the year. Take the cheaper option on a two year deal max.

 

[The Hockey Life]

Ideally, I would like both. But if I had to choose one it would be Raymond. His work ethic and speed are second to none on the team. Not too mention he plays valuable 2nd PK minutes. I thought he was going to be a good pickup, but not this good.

 

[ULF_55]

I doubt we have the space to sign either at 3.5

Apply the Phaneuf argument!!!

The cap will rise, 3.5 will be like minimum in a few years.



Career PPG

.50 - Kulemin - 27, 6'1", 225 lbs.
.49 - Raymond - 28, 6', 185 lbs.

2012-2013

Player|Games |Hits| BkS| MsS| GvA| TkA
Raymond|46|18| 8| 23| 18| 17
Kulemin|48| 122| 47| 33| 13| 30

Does it look like these 2 should even be compared?

 

[The Winter Soldier]

I posted this summer that I couldn't believe Raymond was still unsigned as a UFA when he was out there. He's just 27 too which made it very surprising.

Kule would be easier to replace with Ashton most likely. Leivo down the line.

 

[JackJ]

If Kuli is willing to accept 2m (or less) on a long term then sign him otherwise let him walk next summer. Same for Raymond. Replace one or both from within and/or another bargain or two.

 

[ALine]

Ideally, I would like both. But if I had to choose one it would be Raymond. His work ethic and speed are second to none on the team. Not too mention he plays valuable 2nd PK minutes. I thought he was going to be a good pickup, but not this good.

Kulemin is one of the most important PKing forwards we have. Still one of our fastest skaters. Can also provide some offense. But can use use his body quite a bit more effectively.

I like Raymond as much of the next guy. Awesome speed, decent puck instincts, and defense that ranges from average to good. But I dont think he is as vital as Kulemin.

But either could be moved.

 

[Renegade]

If either of them are going to leave, I'd hope it's in a deadline trade.

Raymond has proved himself so he definitely deserves more $$$ but Kulemin has been flying under the radar the past couple years. Still a strong defensive player but lost his scoring touch.

I wouldn't see any reason why he wouldn't sign for around 2M again next year.

 

[ULF_55]

If either of them are going to leave, I'd hope it's in a deadline trade.

Raymond has proved himself so he definitely deserves more $$$ but Kulemin has been flying under the radar the past couple years. Still a strong defensive player but lost his scoring touch.

I wouldn't see any reason why he wouldn't sign for around 2M again next year.

2012-2013
Raymond 46 games 16 ESP, 6 PPP (98:05 on PP)
Kulemin 48 games 23 ESP, 0 PPP (20:04 on PP)

ESP = Even Strength Points
PPP = Power Player Points

 

[Fogelhund]

Raymond has been a wonderful surprise so far. Having read what Vancouver fans said in the past, he often disappears for long stretches, particularly in the playoffs.

He is playing for his career right now, so it isn't a shock that he is performing well. Let's see how he does long-term though... we are dealing with a very small sample set.

 

[bankerwannabe*]

both.

 

[TMLeafer]

Kulemin, way better along the boards. Kessel and Raymond on the same line yesterday made it clear that strength along the boards in your own zone to get pucks out is crucial.

Hopefully they can keep both since Bolland with Kulemin and Raymond would be a treat to watch.

 

[ACC1224]

Raymond will be much cheaper and I expect he will be brought back. I don't see Kulemin finishing the season here.

 

[Future]

Why do we have to choose all the time between our own players?

 

[EscapeGoat]

Kulemin, if I had to choose one.

 

[Chandrashekhar Limit]

Our biggest weakness is puck possession. The two aforementioned players do it in different ways - Raymond has great skill with the puck on his stick, while Kulemin is great at cycling the puck.

I think in the playoffs, where we get tighter checking hockey, Kulemin will be more effective for us. We already have enough scoring options. In contrast, MayRay might be a great option for a team like Minny, who need some good finishers.

I would keep Kulemin for the long run between the two. However, I think both will be let go, and the kids will end up taking their spots.

 

[Chandrashekhar Limit]

I love the make up of our team as it stands. We have a PWF, a playmaker and a sniper on every line. JVR/Clarkson/Kulemin is an excellent 1-2-3 for size.

 

[BonMorrison]

Kulemin and it's not very close to me. We're one of the highest scoring teams in the league - our team's concern is preventing goals.

I've seen Raymond play a lot on the Canucks and know what he brings when he's not on a hot streak like he is now - the answer is very little. Kulemin, on the other hand, brings his strengths (defenseive game) each and every night.