Who would you pick after Dahlin/Svechnikov/Zadina are gone?

Who would you pick after the TOP3 ?

  • LW Brady Tkachuk, 6'3 left

    Votes: 13 10.9%
  • RD Adam Boqvist, 5'11 Right

    Votes: 52 43.7%
  • LD Quinton Hughes, 5'10 Left

    Votes: 16 13.4%
  • RW Oliver Wahlstrom, 6'1 Right

    Votes: 5 4.2%
  • LD Ty Smith, 5'10 Left

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • RD Noah Dobson, 6'3 Right

    Votes: 9 7.6%
  • C Joe Veleno, 6'1 Left

    Votes: 0 0.0%
  • RD Evan Bouchard, 6'2 Right

    Votes: 21 17.6%
  • some other prospect, who ?

    Votes: 3 2.5%

  • Total voters
    119
  • Poll closed .

Henkka

Registered User
Jan 31, 2004
31,078
12,078
Tampere, Finland
Just added another thread. That "who would take at 2nd" looked pretty obvious. I think we get a better discussion and poll after the obvious TOP3.

Most probable case is that we don't pick at TOP3. It's also unprobable that we draft at 4th.

So we most probably draft somewhere at 5-6-7-8. The draft after those 3 best players will go pretty even, everybody has their own favourite. But it's impossible to predict, who is picking at 4th and who would go as 4th pick. I'll leave all options open.

Who would you pick?
 

Redder Winger

Registered User
May 4, 2017
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Is anyone at all worried about Boqvist's production?
1 point in 15 games. -7.
Dahlin has 20 points in 41 games, for example.
Heiskanen, last year, had 10 points in 37 games in Finland

How far away is Boqvist from being an NHLer? 2 years?
Not that I'd turn down a great defenseman because he needed 2 years to develop. I'm just curious.
 

Frk It

Mo Seider Less Problems
Jul 27, 2010
36,201
14,683
Is anyone at all worried about Boqvist's production?
1 point in 15 games. -7.
Dahlin has 20 points in 41 games, for example.
Heiskanen, last year, had 10 points in 37 games in Finland

How far away is Boqvist from being an NHLer? 2 years?
Not that I'd turn down a great defenseman because he needed 2 years to develop. I'm just curious.

He’s playing 7 minutes a night in the SHL, for whatever that’s worth. Not going to put up stats playing that little.

Pretty common thing that happens with draft eligible kids overseas.
 

Redder Winger

Registered User
May 4, 2017
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He’s playing 7 minutes a night in the SHL, for whatever that’s worth. Not going to put up stats playing that little.

Pretty common thing that happens with draft eligible kids overseas.

How long do you think before he's NHL material?
Who does he compare to, when he hits his peak?
 

Marky9er

Registered User
Jan 30, 2008
7,476
729
Boqvist and Hughes have high potential it seems but Bouchard impressed me quite a bit and seems like a safe pick. Very hard choice, but it's encouraging that someone in the thick of this discussion will be there at 7 right? Include Dobson in that.
 

ChadS

Registered User
Jun 30, 2009
4,865
1,476
Have watched quite a bit of Boqvist at different levels and while I absolutely love his upside the risk still scares me (I tend to prefer high ceiling players too). Still not sure where I would feel comfortable picking him, so I went with Bouchard. Everything I've read of him sounds great but haven't seen a full game. When comparing for example Boqvist vs Bouchard the age difference should really be considered. How good was Bouchard 10 months ago? Boqvist's numbers this season don't concern me much.
 

Henkka

Registered User
Jan 31, 2004
31,078
12,078
Tampere, Finland
Is anyone at all worried about Boqvist's production?
1 point in 15 games. -7.

Heiskanen, last year, had 10 points in 37 games in Finland

How far away is Boqvist from being an NHLer? 2 years?

Tough to say. Should have seen him on ice. For example Heiskanen, I abolutely loved his decision-making when seeing him to play. But haven't seen Boqvist at all.

Guys in Sweden, please inform us.
 

HisNoodliness

The Karate Kid and ASP Kai
Jun 29, 2014
3,652
2,022
Toronto
Is anyone at all worried about Boqvist's production?
1 point in 15 games. -7.
Dahlin has 20 points in 41 games, for example.
Heiskanen, last year, had 10 points in 37 games in Finland

How far away is Boqvist from being an NHLer? 2 years?
Not that I'd turn down a great defenseman because he needed 2 years to develop. I'm just curious.
I'm not too worried about it. He gets essentially no ice time and no opportunity in the SHL. He produces well enough against his age group. Certainly if you take him you're projecting based on his skills and not his current play though. Personally it's a projection I'm comfortable making because I think the sky is the limit for him. I'd say 1-3 seasons is the timeline for him to make the NHL.
 
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Frk It

Mo Seider Less Problems
Jul 27, 2010
36,201
14,683
How long do you think before he's NHL material?
Who does he compare to, when he hits his peak?

Hard to say, I think he will take a bit longer than either Dobson or Bouchard though.

He gets compared to Karlsson often, but that kind of gets overused. Maybe Kris Letang is a good comp if everything goes perfect for him.

I like Boqvist, but I do think he’s one of the riskier guys in the top 10.
 

NickH8

Registered User
Jul 3, 2015
3,647
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Just added another thread. That "who would take at 2nd" looked pretty obvious. I think we get a better discussion and poll after the obvious TOP3.

Most probable case is that we don't pick at TOP3. It's also unprobable that we draft at 4th.

So we most probably draft somewhere at 5-6-7-8. The draft after those 3 best players will go pretty even, everybody has their own favourite. But it's impossible to predict, who is picking at 4th and who would go as 4th pick. I'll leave all options open.

Who would you pick?
Boqvist if he's still available, if not then Hughes. Bouchard is also someone I'd strongly consider.

Tkachuk is overrated. Hughes has a higher ppg than him in the NCAA and he's a defenseman.
 

NickH8

Registered User
Jul 3, 2015
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Boqvist and Hughes have high potential it seems but Bouchard impressed me quite a bit and seems like a safe pick. Very hard choice, but it's encouraging that someone in the thick of this discussion will be there at 7 right? Include Dobson in that.
I'd rather draft the player with the chance of becoming an elite talent than the guy who can safely be top 4, but isn't as likely to be elite. We have plenty of support guys and guys who project to be support guys, we need the stars.
 

Frk It

Mo Seider Less Problems
Jul 27, 2010
36,201
14,683
I'd rather draft the player with the chance of becoming an elite talent than the guy who can safely be top 4, but isn't as likely to be elite. We have plenty of support guys and guys who project to be support guys, we need the stars.

Most of these defenseman lack something that could prevent them from becoming top pairing guys. Hughes and Boqvist lack size. Bouchard lacks high end skating.

The guy who checks most boxes for me is Dobson.
 

NickH8

Registered User
Jul 3, 2015
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Most of these defenseman lack something that could prevent them from becoming top pairing guys. Hughes and Boqvist lack size. Bouchard lacks high end skating.

The guy who checks most boxes for me is Dobson.
Who says Hughes and Boqvist need size? If they have the skill they can be top pair guys. Karlsson is 6'0, Kronwall is also 6'0. Do you think that extra inch on Boqvist or 3 on Hughes will prevent them from becoming elite players? I don't think so. Weight can be added with hard work in the offseason.
 

Frk It

Mo Seider Less Problems
Jul 27, 2010
36,201
14,683
Who says Hughes and Boqvist need size? If they have the skill they can be top pair guys. Karlsson is 6'0, Kronwall is also 6'0. Do you think that extra inch on Boqvist or 3 on Hughes will prevent them from becoming elite players? I don't think so. Weight can be added with hard work in the offseason.

Boqvist may be OK. Believe his brother is something like 6’0” and 200 lbs.

Hughes is tougher. Guys that are the same size as Hughes are usually offensive specialists and have to play sheltered minutes. Ghost is actually disproving that this year to a degree, but it has largely been true in the past.

I like both, but that inherent risk is going to be there.
 

NickH8

Registered User
Jul 3, 2015
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Boqvist may be OK. Believe his brother is something like 6’0” and 200 lbs.

Hughes is tougher. Guys that are the same size as Hughes are usually offensive specialists and have to play sheltered minutes. Ghost is actually disproving that this year to a degree, but it has largely been true in the past.

I like both, but that inherent risk is going to be there.
I understand where your coming from, but we need to be willing to take risks. I would still be more than happy with Bouchard though. The only player I wouldn't be happy with Detroit picking is Tkachuk, unless we trade down which I wouldn't do.
 
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Frk It

Mo Seider Less Problems
Jul 27, 2010
36,201
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I understand where your coming from, but we need to be willing to take risks. I would still be more than happy with Bouchard though. The only player I wouldn't be happy with Detroit picking is Tkachuk, unless we trade down which I wouldn't do.

Yeah, there are exceptions to every rule.

Hughes is just so skilled and skates so well that I am totally cool with taking him.
 

Henkka

Registered User
Jan 31, 2004
31,078
12,078
Tampere, Finland
Who says Hughes and Boqvist need size? If they have the skill they can be top pair guys. Karlsson is 6'0, Kronwall is also 6'0. Do you think that extra inch on Boqvist or 3 on Hughes will prevent them from becoming elite players? I don't think so. Weight can be added with hard work in the offseason.

It's not about weight. It's about REACH and more interesting number would be Wingspan than height. If the Wingspan is more than height, then there's some potential to be better smaller-sized player. It gives you a bigger puck-control area when you can use longer stick. Bigger puck-control area affects straight on puck control. Longer stick with height/wingspan also enables larger area for stick defence.

Also, size is a problem with flying elbows. Shit just happen in hockey, and there is a bigger probability to get a concussion with a smaller star player. Every time 6'5 Chris Pronger did hit a 5'10 player, his elbow was already on the height of the objective's head. Big-sized guys haven't disappeared from hockey, even though hitting element has been reduced. Some small guy, who will get Elite good, will start getting those hits, when stakes go higher. Especially at Division format playoff series. You knock the guy out, concussion history will start and you face possibly that same guy at every spring.

Size will matter, after a certain point. You don't build around a small defenceman. They are secondary guys.

But, yeah Doughty is 6'0, Letang is 6'0, Subban is 6'0 and Karlsson is 6'0. But there no under 6'0 Elite Norris D in NHL. That's a minimum.
 

NickH8

Registered User
Jul 3, 2015
3,647
3,773
It's not about weight. It's about REACH and more interesting number would be Wingspan than height. If the Wingspan is more than height, then there's some potential to be better smaller-sized player. It gives you a bigger puck-control area when you can use longer stick. Bigger puck-control area affects straight on puck control. Longer stick with height/wingspan also enables larger area for stick defence.

Also, size is a problem with flying elbows. **** just happen in hockey, and there is a bigger probability to get a concussion with a smaller star player. Every time 6'5 Chris Pronger did hit a 5'10 player, his elbow was already on the height of the objective's head. Big-sized guys haven't disappeared from hockey, even though hitting element has been reduced. Some small guy, who will get Elite good, will start getting those hits, when stakes go higher. Especially at Division format playoff series. You knock the guy out, concussion history will start and you face possibly that same guy at every spring.

Size will matter, after a certain point. You don't build around a small defenceman. They are secondary guys.

But, yeah Doughty is 6'0, Letang is 6'0, Subban is 6'0 and Karlsson is 6'0. But there no under 6'0 Elite Norris D in NHL. That's a minimum.
There's also this thing called being a first. If Boqvist has the skills and IQ to make up for his lack of reach compared to everyone else, I don't see how he can't be elite because he's one inch shorter than 4 of the best defensemen in the league.
 

Redder Winger

Registered User
May 4, 2017
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I'd rather draft the player with the chance of becoming an elite talent than the guy who can safely be top 4, but isn't as likely to be elite. We have plenty of support guys and guys who project to be support guys, we need the stars.

How many 5'9, 5'10 defenseman in the NHL are elitte?
Here are the leading scorers of the 5'10 and under defensemen.
Krug - 57 points
Barrie - 55 points
Butcher - 40 points
Spurgeon - 37 points
Vatanan - 31 points
Ellis - 19 points
Girard - 22 points
Russell - 21 points
Other guys include Hunt, Grzelcyk, Carrick, Stecher, Wideman, Biega, Mete, Enstrom, Aho, Warsofsky, Hicketts, Murphy and Ness.



How many of those guys would you draft at 3rd overall or in the top 5, even?
 

NickH8

Registered User
Jul 3, 2015
3,647
3,773
How many 5'9, 5'10 defenseman in the NHL are elitte?
Here are the leading scorers of the 5'10 and under defensemen.
Krug - 57 points
Barrie - 55 points
Butcher - 40 points
Spurgeon - 37 points
Vatanan - 31 points
Ellis - 19 points
Girard - 22 points
Russell - 21 points
Other guys include Hunt, Grzelcyk, Carrick, Stecher, Wideman, Biega, Mete, Enstrom, Aho, Warsofsky, Hicketts, Murphy and Ness.

How many of those guys would you draft at 3rd overall or in the top 5, even?
Boqvist is 5'11. Subban, Doughty, Karlsson, and Letand are 6'0. I have a hard time believing that one inch would make a massive difference.

I can see the concern with Hughes though, and you guys have kind of swayed me towards picking Bouchard over him, but I still think Boqvist would be my first choice.
 

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