Who wins the Rocket this year? Ovechkin or the field

wetcoast

Registered User
Nov 20, 2018
22,247
10,127
ovechkin does not need to be in his prime to score the most goals or play mvp caliber in a series.

No you are right he doesn't.

I was just making the point of what he is, which is the best goal scorer in hockey history and still the best goal scorer in the NHL.

But the more I think about it father time catches up with everyone and even with 2 elite centers to feed him the puck I think that time might come this year in someone else getting the Richard.
 
  • Like
Reactions: DanM

wetcoast

Registered User
Nov 20, 2018
22,247
10,127
2018 playoffs were 6 years ago?

Are you having problems reading?

I spent specifically referenced those 7 games were not like the past 6 seasons.

Even the claim that he was the best player in the league based on those 7 games....Really?
 

KoozNetsOff 92

Hala Madrid
Apr 6, 2016
8,567
8,229
Are you having problems reading?

I spent specifically referenced those 7 games were not like the past 6 seasons.

Even the claim that he was the best player in the league based on those 7 games....Really?

The poster you replied to said OV can be the best player in the game and quoted that 7 game series for proof. You implied the last 6 seasons have more weight than that 7 game series. So I asked if the 2018 playoffs, in which OV was the best player, happened 6 years ago?

And I don't know what 6 years ago has to do with today, but if you want to use 6 seasons, in that time OV has a smythe, 5 rockets, hart runner up, 3 other top 10 finishes, 2x 1st AST, 2x 2nd AST, 2x 3rd AST. Let me know how many players have a better resume in that time frame and ask anyone if that "isn't a force".
 

wetcoast

Registered User
Nov 20, 2018
22,247
10,127
The poster you replied to said OV can be the best player in the game and quoted that 7 game series for proof. You implied the last 6 seasons have more weight than that 7 game series. So I asked if the 2018 playoffs, in which OV was the best player, happened 6 years ago?

And I don't know what 6 years ago has to do with today, but if you want to use 6 seasons, in that time OV has a smythe, 5 rockets, hart runner up, 3 other top 10 finishes, 2x 1st AST, 2x 2nd AST, 2x 3rd AST. Let me know how many players have a better resume in that time frame and ask anyone if that "isn't a force".

Okay my bad I mistakenly was thinking of last springs playoffs against Carolina.

But let's be clear about 2 things here.

1) His Conn Smythe was a "narrative" award much like Crosby's Conn Smythe as both are the face of their franchises.

Other Washingron players played as important or more important roles in the 2018 playoffs.

2) Ovechkin just isnt the driving force player like he was up until 2010.

There is no shame in that reality as he has still been the dominant goal scoring threat in the league since then.

But stop trying to pretend that Ovechkin is something that he hasn't been for the last 6 seasons.
 

JasonRoseEh

Registered User
Oct 23, 2018
2,933
2,346
Yes we should look at a single 7 game sample and if more the last 6 years?

Ovechkin isn't a force like he was in his peak and it's not even close even if he remains the best goalscorer in the NHL right now.

I'm actually going to revise my OP and say that Ovy doesn't win the rocket next year.
No one said he was, why even bring that up? The point was stated for people saying he's going to regress when he's an offseason removed from still being the best goal scorer in the league rather easily coasting into the postseason where he was STILL the best player through the first round against a team that went to the ECF. He also did this with almost no help this postseason, his team was trash.

Kuznetsov learning his lesson and getting his head on straight only bodes well for Ovechkin. He's going to walk away with the Rocket again.
 

wetcoast

Registered User
Nov 20, 2018
22,247
10,127
No one said he was, why even bring that up? The point was stated for people saying he's going to regress when he's an offseason removed from still being the best goal scorer in the league rather easily coasting into the postseason where he was STILL the best player through the first round against a team that went to the ECF. He also did this with almost no help this postseason, his team was trash.

Kuznetsov learning his lesson and getting his head on straight only bodes well for Ovechkin. He's going to walk away with the Rocket again.

Funny that you respond saying that no one said that Ovechkin was still a force then you procede to say and exaggerate that for the 7 game sample against the Canes.

Maybe I'm missing the satirical nature of this post?:sarcasm:
 

JasonRoseEh

Registered User
Oct 23, 2018
2,933
2,346
Funny that you respond saying that no one said that Ovechkin was still a force then you procede to say and exaggerate that for the 7 game sample against the Canes.

Maybe I'm missing the satirical nature of this post?:sarcasm:
What is exaggerated about his play in the first round? Other than Nathan MacKinnon he was easily the best player which shows he's not slowing down at all. Nothing points to him regressing at this stage yet you keep stating that's going to happen.

Not sure how you don't comprehend the difference between "still a force" and "as good as he was in his prime force" Reading is fun.
 
  • Like
Reactions: Sam Spade

wetcoast

Registered User
Nov 20, 2018
22,247
10,127
What is exaggerated about his play in the first round? Other than Nathan MacKinnon he was easily the best player which shows he's not slowing down at all. Nothing points to him regressing at this stage yet you keep stating that's going to happen.

Not sure how you don't comprehend the difference between "still a force" and "as good as he was in his prime force" Reading is fun.

and yet the false narrative that he had no help from his team mates garbage still?

If only Backstrom could pass the puck or Carlson could be a PP QB right?

Ovechkin had a good 7 game stretch but was it really any better than Mark Stone in the first round?

Or Brad Marchand?

Anyways I'm done with this thread and back to the OP I think that Ovechkin has won his last Richard and will still be an elite goal scorer for a while but father time is catching up.
 

wetcoast

Registered User
Nov 20, 2018
22,247
10,127
What is exaggerated about his play in the first round? Other than Nathan MacKinnon he was easily the best player which shows he's not slowing down at all. Nothing points to him regressing at this stage yet you keep stating that's going to happen.

Not sure how you don't comprehend the difference between "still a force" and "as good as he was in his prime force" Reading is fun.

The exaggeration is that somehow you are overlooking Stone and his 12 points?

Marchand and his 9?

Lack of team support in that Backstrom, Carlson, Holtby and Kuznetsov didn't exactly crap the bed in the first round even if Ovechkin was the best player on the capitals he was a minus 4 in the last 2 elimination games against the Canes.

Also the point is that we should never read a ton into any 7 game stretch, even less so when we are talking about his chances of winning the Richard again, the playoff argument isn't a strong one given that Backstrom had 5 goals to Ovechkins 4.

Heck four other players in another series had 5 goals or more in the first round...see how the playoff sample isn't a good thing to use to translate into next seasons Richard?
 

GlitchMarner

Typical malevolent, devious & vile Maple Leafs fan
Jul 21, 2017
9,712
6,432
Brampton, ON
I guessed Matthews would win it last year, but he got hurt again. I like his chances this season if he plays every game or almost all of them.

I can see Laine bouncing back... but I have to wonder about his focus and commitment to hockey right now as well as his health. I also think his current style at ES will make it difficult for him to win the RR, but he certainly may be in the running this year.

I wouldn't bet on Tavares to net 47 goals again, but he's going to get his goals playing on this team. Maybe he ends up with 42 or so.

I can see a ~40 goal season from Stamkos.

I won't be surprised if McDavid puts up 45 or more.

I think I would take the field over Ovechkin at this point, but he's a good bet if you have to choose one player. I'm going to guess Matthews takes it, though... :oops:
 

GlitchMarner

Typical malevolent, devious & vile Maple Leafs fan
Jul 21, 2017
9,712
6,432
Brampton, ON
How come?

Just because of the talk about the Fortnight/video game addiction and the fact that he was so streaky last season. Obviously I don't know how much validity there is to the speculation that concerned him during the season, but his performance is an indicator that he had an issue or issues.
 

mad4comp

Registered User
Jan 21, 2010
6,249
2,852
Okay my bad I mistakenly was thinking of last springs playoffs against Carolina.

But let's be clear about 2 things here.

1) His Conn Smythe was a "narrative" award much like Crosby's Conn Smythe as both are the face of their franchises.

Other Washingron players played as important or more important roles in the 2018 playoffs.

Ovechkin led the playoffs in goals that year.... so no.
 

crazy8888

Registered User
Sep 8, 2010
1,221
1,151
Brooklyn NY
Ovechkin led the playoffs in goals that year.... so no.
He was also second those playoffs in points. Top 5 in hits. Blocked shots. Played very solid defense. Provided leadership and fueled the team with his raw emotion. Also was involved in some very big game deciding goals. Yes he finished 4 points behind Kuznetsov in scoring but overall his contribution to the team was unmatched. The Smythe was very well deserved.
 

wetcoast

Registered User
Nov 20, 2018
22,247
10,127
Ovechkin led the playoffs in goals that year.... so no.

Sorry my bad as I was unaware that the Conn Smythe was the playoff version of the Richard trophy.

I watched that playoff year and early in the second round the media narrative was already starting around the playoff albatross being lifted off the captain's back.

Everyone knew that if the Caps won the SC Ovechkin was getting the Conn Smythe.
 

bobholly39

Registered User
Mar 10, 2013
22,078
14,589
There are definitely some very strong parallels between Crosby and Ovechkin's smythes in 2016 and 2018.

Both had a teammate outscore them who some felt should have won the smythe instead. Instead, the bigger 'name' won it.

For what it's worth - I agree with the 2 winners and think they both deserved it above Kessel and Kuznetsov.

Also - this doesn't mean that Crosby's smythe in 2016 was as strong as Ovechkin's in 2018 - Ovechkin was better. Still - similar story.
 
  • Like
Reactions: JasonRoseEh

wetcoast

Registered User
Nov 20, 2018
22,247
10,127
Of course they did, he deserved it.

There are definitely some very strong parallels between Crosby and Ovechkin's smythes in 2016 and 2018.

Both had a teammate outscore them who some felt should have won the smythe instead. Instead, the bigger 'name' won it.

For what it's worth - I agree with the 2 winners and think they both deserved it above Kessel and Kuznetsov.

Also - this doesn't mean that Crosby's smythe in 2016 was as strong as Ovechkin's in 2018 - Ovechkin was better. Still - similar story.

I'm not all that caught up in trophy counting or even SC counting.

Both performances were Conn Smythe worthy and really that's all that matters.

Guys like Potvin and Fedorov had incredible consecutive 4 year playoff runs and zero Conn Conn Smytheteophies between them but that doesn't diminish how great they were.

Back to the OP it doesn't matter if Ovechkin never wins another Richard his legacy as the greatest goal scorer ever is pretty firmly entrenched.
 

JasonRoseEh

Registered User
Oct 23, 2018
2,933
2,346
and yet the false narrative that he had no help from his team mates garbage still?

If only Backstrom could pass the puck or Carlson could be a PP QB right?

Ovechkin had a good 7 game stretch but was it really any better than Mark Stone in the first round?

Or Brad Marchand?

Anyways I'm done with this thread and back to the OP I think that Ovechkin has won his last Richard and will still be an elite goal scorer for a while but father time is catching up.
Unequivocally yes to both and other than Ovechkin's line in that Canes series, the other 3 couldn't even get their puck out of their own end. So ya, he didn't get any help bud, did you watch the series?
 

JasonRoseEh

Registered User
Oct 23, 2018
2,933
2,346
The exaggeration is that somehow you are overlooking Stone and his 12 points?

Marchand and his 9?

Lack of team support in that Backstrom, Carlson, Holtby and Kuznetsov didn't exactly crap the bed in the first round even if Ovechkin was the best player on the capitals he was a minus 4 in the last 2 elimination games against the Canes.

Also the point is that we should never read a ton into any 7 game stretch, even less so when we are talking about his chances of winning the Richard again, the playoff argument isn't a strong one given that Backstrom had 5 goals to Ovechkins 4.

Heck four other players in another series had 5 goals or more in the first round...see how the playoff sample isn't a good thing to use to translate into next seasons Richard?
This is how I know you didn't watch, Kuznetsov was absolute garbage and so was Holtby. Carlson was fine? Backstrom played well but again, their line is the only line that showed up.
 

Ad

Upcoming events

Ad

Ad

-->