I don't know if any of those players dominated games like Lindros. If numbers were real factors players like Bernie Nichols and Mike Brown would be a house hold name
Nobody I mean nobody will ever come close to dominating games like Lindros did. He was a beast of the highest order
Nobody I mean nobody will ever come close to dominating games like Lindros did. He was a beast of the highest order
Im not the greatest Lindros fan but yes Erik was special and will be in Hall in not to distant future.As an 18 yrs old he played for Team Canada a great achievement.He played on one the most physical and dominating lines for a period of time.And like I said Im not a fan of his.He was a tremendous bone crunching player in his prime and people should not forget how good he was.
Ohashi_Jouzu*
Registered User
Even just by the numbers, between the time Eric joined the league and the early end of his '99/00 season, his PPG was 3rd to only Lemieux and Jagr, and even ahead of Selanne (that includes his 70 goal rookie year, obviously, since he and Lindros were in the same rookie class - 3 years age difference, of course). The number of games he missed still only drops him to 6th in raw scoring over that period, tied with Yzerman.
Ohashi_Jouzu*
Registered User
It is often said that the second half of Gretzky's career, taken just by itself, would be a HoF career. Thing is, everyone else on these lists is a HoF'er, too, so there's lots of room for discussion.
I think people are forgetting what he actually did as an 18 year old as well here, when it's pretty clear he could ahve dominated at the NHL level here is his breakdown again for his 1st year after getting drafted.
7-2-8-10 WJC
13-9-22-31 OHL
24-19-16-35 National Team
8-5-6-11 Olympics
8-3-2-5 Canada Cup
so to recap his totals against men were
40-27-24-51
Like it has been stated Eric was a beast in the decade, and like so many others in that decade (is there any decade with more injuries to it's top 20 players? and is it even really close?) his overall impact was only really slowed by injuries in the regular season.
Master_Of_Districts
Registered User
MOD
But you're right - the guy merits more recognition than what he's received to date.
He was a difference maker of the highest order.
Killion
Registered User
- Feb 19, 2010
- 36,763
- 3,215
We have a great many Members who's first language is not English. Remember that when you read posts and your "spell" here will be far more enjoyable yes?
Master_Of_Districts
Registered User
We have a great many Members who's first language is not English. Remember that when you read posts and your "spell" here will be far more enjoyable yes?
I apologize - the poster appeared to be an Anglophone. MOD
Last edited by a moderator:
sr edler
gold is not reality
- Mar 20, 2010
- 11,895
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I think two reasons people sell him short is the 1996 World Cup and the 1998 Olympics. He wasn't terrible in any of those tournaments and had 11 points in 14 games, but he was supposed to be the man on the Canadian teams and he kind of wasn't. He was outplayed in those tournaments by guys like Hasek, Leetch, Forsberg, Bure, Selänne, LeClair. He also only had two seasons in the 90s where he played more than 70 games [73 and 71 respectively] and if you exclude the lockout season he didn't play one full season.
I read Hullsy → Housley
Big Phil
Registered User
- Nov 2, 2003
- 31,703
- 4,146
Dominant 2 way player to describe Mario?
Offensively yes he was dominant but he only played in the best case scenario 90-99 in 377 games compared to Wayne's 713 or Steve's 743.
Mario simply can't be said to have the best decade in the 90's playing in
59
26
64
60
22
0
70
76
0
0 games in the decade.
Even as great as he was offensively he still was only 14th in scoring points for the decade and he isn't a dominant 2 way player like Feds was for the decade.
Heck Mario's 2 way game isn't even nearly as good as Sid's and we see how some people treated him in the "first 8 seasons thread."
But if you really think that a player who played in only 377 games in the decade and had 13 more players score more points than him is really the best player of the 90's feel free to make an argument.
There simply isn't one that stands up very well IMO.
Well, as I said before, it is what he did in those seasons that make the difference. 4 Art Ross Wins, Two harts, 4 first team all-stars, a 46 game point streak, 2 Cups, 2 utterly dominant Conn Smythe wins.
Who else has this kind of decade? Hasek is his closest competitor in my opinion, but didn't do anything noteworthy until the 1993-'94 season. Basically we are talking about 6 seasons for him. Jagr took a few years to develop. Gretzky didn't win a Cup despite three Art Ross wins, but never won a Hart and was a 1st team all-star just once. A good playoff run in 1993 though. Gretzky is probably #3 on my list.
Yzerman? Good offensively in the early part of the decade, although Mario when healthy obliterated him. Lost his offense most notably after 1994 for a better two way game. Won the Cups, but by the late 1990s wasn't as good as he used to be either.
Bourque isn't a bad choice either, but can he compete with what Mario did?
I can't see anyone but Mario #1 for the 1990s.
Rhiessan71
Just a Fool
The same could be said for Sid in ‘10 though as well.
Sure he scored the Golden goal (with a lot of help from Iggy I might add) but he wasn‘t “The Man“ for Canada. He wasn‘t Canada‘s best player or even in the running for it.
The upcoming Olympics and the next few seasons will go a long to determine whether Sid is the player some make him out to be or Lindros II.
TheDevilMadeMe
Registered User
What does this have to do with who was considered the best player of the 1990s?
Rhiessan71
Just a Fool
Well...it was stated that Lindros was hurt by not being “The Man“ for Canada which doesn‘t seem to be held against Sid to the same degree.
Lindros was top 5 in the 90‘s IMO. Mario #1 with a bullet.
Sens Rule
Registered User
- Sep 22, 2005
- 21,251
- 74
For 1993 playoff he was at his very best. A glimpse if the 1980's Gretzky. Perhaps the only time he was vintage Gretzky in the 1990's save the first year or so.
Still the lesser 1990's version of Gretzky was pretty great. Especially come playoffs. 99 had really stopped scoring goals in the regular season yet potted 10 in his only Rangers playoff.
If I had all my money on a single game, series or playoff and I could pick player's of the 1990's Gretzky would still be probably second after Mario or third after Hasek. Gretzky is the best big game player ever. And yes I would have used him in the 1998 shootout in the Olympics. Without hesitation.
Ohashi_Jouzu*
Registered User
Agree with most of that. Crazy to think that Gretzky still managed to rack up that many playoff points in the '90s. Pretty much tied with Yzerman in the back half of his prime on those Red Wings teams (look at Fedorov at #2, btw). Mario cementing his cause, of course. (The List)
Sid was hardly the disappointment that Eric was in the discussed games and his playoff resume is already well ahead of Eric and so is his legacy.
Eric was 23 and 24 in the tournaments mentioned and wasn't really a poor player, just maybe below expectations.
Sid was 22 and still had a very good 7-3-4-7 line in that tourney, he has nothing to prove except good health but judging how little Mario played in the 90's and how some have him as the obvious best guy of the decade why the double standard for Sid?
BubbaBoot
Registered User
From 1994-95 through 1999-2000, Ray Bourque, aged 34 to 39, was 2nd for goals scored by a defenseman with 93 total, (just 1 behind Lidstrom) and 3rd in points by a defenseman, (7 behind Lidstrom, 3 behind Leetch)....yet he's completely dropped off your list.
He also scored 93 goals from 1990-91 through 1994-95.
Sorry didn't see your post but both players are getting left out a bit in their respective mixs.
Steve Yzerman is sadly absent form most lists though and he should be in the mix for the best player of the 90's IMO, he actually played alot and was excellent in both the playoffs, regular season and 2 way aspect.
Rhiessan71
Just a Fool
I don‘t care what the line was for Sid in ‘10, he was mostly invisible except vs in the USA games.
There is no double standard for Sid unless of course you‘re honestly trying to imply that Sid has been at Mario‘s level.
Putting Sid up against Lindros or Jagr is one thing. Putting him up vs Mario is an extremely different situation.
TheDevilMadeMe
Registered User
MOD: Perhaps I wasn't clear before - anyone who continues uses this thread to argue about Sidney Crosby will get an infraction and a thread ban. Thank you.
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