Who has gone from composite back to wood?

mattkaminski15

Registered User
Feb 25, 2014
284
0
Chicago
I disagree with so much written here.

How come?

Surely you can't be disagreeing with what i said about pro stock sticks being built more durably than shelf sticks.

Or maybe you disagree with me saying usability is 1-60 days. Think about it this way. You buy a stick for the level you play at. The higher up you get the more performance you get but the durability lacks. A kid i played against last year had sticks custom tailoredto him and he went through 21 in 62 games. The reason is because sticks are supposed to bend. A lot. When you buy a stick the 'flex test' is to lightly imitate the motion of a wrist shot to see if you can bend it 5-10cm. Which means when you actually take the shot it should be flexing anywhere from 20-40cm..which is a lot. When a stick is bent the way it should be it cracks, its unfortunate but it does.

After taking shots all game plus getting stick checked, checked, anything, decreases the durability.

Im not saying you should fly tthrough sticks cause you use a 60 flex. Im saying that competitive players need not worry if they break sticks quickly..

Unless its an obvious form issue(IE;heel splitting, punching through the stick, etc.)
 

MattGTI

Registered User
Dec 4, 2010
288
0
Milford
How come?

Surely you can't be disagreeing with what i said about pro stock sticks being built more durably than shelf sticks.

Or maybe you disagree with me saying usability is 1-60 days. Think about it this way. You buy a stick for the level you play at. The higher up you get the more performance you get but the durability lacks. A kid i played against last year had sticks custom tailoredto him and he went through 21 in 62 games. The reason is because sticks are supposed to bend. A lot. When you buy a stick the 'flex test' is to lightly imitate the motion of a wrist shot to see if you can bend it 5-10cm. Which means when you actually take the shot it should be flexing anywhere from 20-40cm..which is a lot. When a stick is bent the way it should be it cracks, its unfortunate but it does.

After taking shots all game plus getting stick checked, checked, anything, decreases the durability.

Im not saying you should fly tthrough sticks cause you use a 60 flex. Im saying that competitive players need not worry if they break sticks quickly..

Unless its an obvious form issue(IE;heel splitting, punching through the stick, etc.)

I 100% disagree with your assesment of pro-stock sticks. Pro stock models are usually built with the lightest materials available. While nothing is absolute, these materials come at a cost of more often than not losing some of the retail models durability.

Once again, on your assesment of 1-60 days, nothing is absolute. I see guys still rocking the same high end stick thay have had for a year+ in a hack and slash league. I personally have used the same EK15(one of the lightest retail sticks available) for over 7 months, playing 2-3 times a week, playing defense. The thing still has a solid amount of pop, shows no signs of wear other than a couple toe chips, and battle scars. I only switched up because I wanted something new. I am 6'1" and 210 pounds, and use a 95 Flex.

You entirely contradict yourself with your statement "The higher up you get the more performance you get but the durability lacks". While I do agree with that in general. You clearly stated in your prior paragraph that pro stock models are more durable than retail. Well if they are pretty much the pinnacle of performance? How can they be more durable as well?

Basically your making a bunch of generalizations and blanket statements, with zero factual evidence behind them.
 

mattkaminski15

Registered User
Feb 25, 2014
284
0
Chicago
http://www.hockeystickman.com/stick-info-blog/the-difference-between-pro-stock-and-retail

You want factual evidence. Pick up a pro stock stick. The blade is heavier because they use solid composite instead of foam filled blades. Look at the shaft dimensions. Pro stock sticks are thicker. The link above has pictures to prove it.

I currently use a base custom fitted stick rated at 92 flex. Im 6'1" and 185 pounds. With the amount of shots I've taken in the last 4 games and 5 practices, the sticks on the verge of breaking.

My point is that beer league players can get sticks that last year's because they are not using them like the high end players their sticks are designed for.

A highly competitive player will not need to worry about breaking multiple sticks.
 

AIREAYE

Registered User
Jun 7, 2009
4,885
70
http://www.hockeystickman.com/stick-info-blog/the-difference-between-pro-stock-and-retail

You want factual evidence. Pick up a pro stock stick. The blade is heavier because they use solid composite instead of foam filled blades. Look at the shaft dimensions. Pro stock sticks are thicker. The link above has pictures to prove it.

I currently use a base custom fitted stick rated at 92 flex. Im 6'1" and 185 pounds. With the amount of shots I've taken in the last 4 games and 5 practices, the sticks on the verge of breaking.

My point is that beer league players can get sticks that last year's because they are not using them like the high end players their sticks are designed for.

A highly competitive player will not need to worry about breaking multiple sticks.

Where do you see this?
 

MattGTI

Registered User
Dec 4, 2010
288
0
Milford
http://www.hockeystickman.com/stick-info-blog/the-difference-between-pro-stock-and-retail

You want factual evidence. Pick up a pro stock stick. The blade is heavier because they use solid composite instead of foam filled blades. Look at the shaft dimensions. Pro stock sticks are thicker. The link above has pictures to prove it.

I currently use a base custom fitted stick rated at 92 flex. Im 6'1" and 185 pounds. With the amount of shots I've taken in the last 4 games and 5 practices, the sticks on the verge of breaking.

My point is that beer league players can get sticks that last year's because they are not using them like the high end players their sticks are designed for.

A highly competitive player will not need to worry about breaking multiple sticks.

Thanks, but I have owned my share of pro stocks. Thicker =/= more durable. It all depends what % of what was used to fabricate the stick. This has been talked about ad nauseum on just baout every hockey forum(including here). Your point about beer leaguers is also just specualtion and has no factual evidence in it whatsoever. I am not trying ot argue with you. My only point is the fact that you are trying to pass off certain thoughts and ideas as finite truths. And they just aren't
 

mattkaminski15

Registered User
Feb 25, 2014
284
0
Chicago
Where do you see this?

This part i learned from my chat with all the pros that skate with us at practices, and mostly the equipment manager from the Chicago steel. A huge majority of pro stock sticks are solid composite. From his knowledge, sidney crosby is the only player to not use a straight composite blade. But back to the point, I was just throwing that in to help understand why pro stock sticks are heavier.
 

AIREAYE

Registered User
Jun 7, 2009
4,885
70
Thanks, but I have owned my share of pro stocks. Thicker =/= more durable. It all depends what % of what was used to fabricate the stick. This has been talked about ad nauseum on just baout every hockey forum(including here). Your point about beer leaguers is also just specualtion and has no factual evidence in it whatsoever. I am not trying ot argue with you. My only point is the fact that you are trying to pass off certain thoughts and ideas as finite truths. And they just aren't
Well, the fact is that manufacturers offer sticks with thicker shafts and 'heftier' alternatives to teams so that they can be more durable...
This part i learned from my chat with all the pros that skate with us at practices, and mostly the equipment manager from the Chicago steel. A huge majority of pro stock sticks are solid composite. From his knowledge, sidney crosby is the only player to not use a straight composite blade. But back to the point, I was just throwing that in to help understand why pro stock sticks are heavier.

This I highly doubt. Solid composite blades would feel drastically different from retail foam-filled, and they simply don't. Most of the Bauer sticks are fused two pieces with regular blade constructions (One90, One95 etc.) and other brands have their own constructions. I've never heard of solid composite.

However, I've also never cut open enough PS blades to gather any impression. I would very much like to see/read some concrete evidence of this though, if you have it!
 

mattkaminski15

Registered User
Feb 25, 2014
284
0
Chicago
Well, the fact is that manufacturers offer sticks with thicker shafts and 'heftier' alternatives to teams so that they can be more durable...


This I highly doubt. Solid composite blades would feel drastically different from retail foam -6 illed, and they simply don't. Most of the Bauer sticks are fused two pieces with regular blade constructions (One90, One95 etc.) and other brands have their own constructions. I've never heard of solid composite.

However, I've also never cut open enough PS blades to gather any impression. I would very much like to see/read some concrete evidence of this though, if you have it!

Well best i can do atm is explain it more i guess.

When you buy a pro stock stick you have 2 options. Team stock, or a specific player.

Team stock sticks are for the guys that aren't super studs and just review the curve and flex of their choosing. The blade on most team stock sticks (excluding only the ccm rbz and bauer nexus 1000/8000 to the best of my knowledge) are solid composite to increase durability. They're not hollow with foam because those blades would be like playing with a blade made out of little twigs.

Players who are better and /or more picky choose what go into their blade. Prime examples of the top of my head are patrick kane, sidney crosby, and evgeni malkin. Kane uses a really stiff solid composite blade. Crosby last i remember uses a blade that's not composite.. I wanna say it was bamboo or something.. On the inside, too replicate the feel of a wood stick. When crosby broke into the league he was using fully wooden blades on composite shafts.

Majority of pro stock blades aren't filled with foam to increase durability. If you're usinga custom player stick there's actually a really good chance they might have foam but most pro stock sticks you find are actually just team stock.

Hope this helps a little?
 

AIREAYE

Registered User
Jun 7, 2009
4,885
70
Thanks for trying, it's appreciated, but I know all this already.

I was hoping for something more than 'he said, she said' on the solid composite blade stuff.
 

TieClark

Registered User
Jun 14, 2011
4,112
0
If a stick is being used to its proper meaning its bound to last maybe 6 months at most.

High end sticks are made for people who are high end players. Not to bash beer leaguers but the 260$ composites aren't made for them. They're made for players that play at a competitive level. Bantam AA-AAA, midget aa-aaa, junior, college, minor & professional..

My coach retired this year from playing professionally. He used wood sticks in juniors, he was one of the last to use them in the ushl. When he started he could use a wood stick for 2-3 games and after his 2nd season He went through 3 a game. Maybe they didn't break but the performance lacked. Wood sticks just aren't made to be used as brutally as they are now a days.

If you use a stick properly your estimated time of 'usefulness' is 1-60 days. Which is why warranties on sticks are so little.

Of course pro stock sticks are built even tougher and pros go through as many as 3 a period..
I'm not talking about losing quality, I'm talking about flat out snapping sticks left right and center.

I see guys all the time insisting they need 100+ flex because they snap all their sticks in a couple months (while playing beer league), yet not being very big guys.
 

AIREAYE

Registered User
Jun 7, 2009
4,885
70
I'm not talking about losing quality, I'm talking about flat out snapping sticks left right and center.

I see guys all the time insisting they need 100+ flex because they snap all their sticks in a couple months (while playing beer league), yet not being very big guys.

Haha same. Those people are what I like to call "wrong".
 

mattkaminski15

Registered User
Feb 25, 2014
284
0
Chicago
I'm not talking about losing quality, I'm talking about flat out snapping sticks left right and center.

I see guys all the time insisting they need 100+ flex because they snap all their sticks in a couple months (while playing beer league), yet not being very big guys.

Thats most likely them punching through their sticks.. Meaning they're using sticks too stiff combined with shooting incorrectly
 

TieClark

Registered User
Jun 14, 2011
4,112
0
Thats most likely them punching through their sticks.. Meaning they're using sticks too stiff combined with shooting incorrectly

Oh I know it's their form when they're shooting... but try telling that to an adult that has "played their entire life"
 

nystromshairstylist

Registered User
Dec 13, 2009
2,107
677
Like most beginners a few years back, i started with woodies to get a feel for the curve that i'd feel most comfortable with.

Even though i've stayed at forward and never developed a slapper - my wrister/snapshot is quite sufficient for my style of play - woodies never lasted more than just a few games/opens.

The problem is that when they get wet the blade gets soft like a noodle, losing all of its integrity, even if i used wax and plenty of tape. I then moved to cheapie, lower-end composites, and while they lasted longer they were generally heavy and did not have good balance.

I finally tried a few top-end composites (yes I spent $230-$250) but found that while they were filthy and light, for wristers/snapshots I did not need such high end sticks. Plus having some a$$hole slash you and break your super expensive stick in the middle of a game was just too frustrating.

I've settled on a very good stick that still has great feel, is very lightweight (just a tiny bit more than the top-end sticks), and doesn't cost an arm and a leg; the Bauer One.9. Got four of them for a bit over $100 each, and should last years. Highly recommended.
 

ArcataShark

in dubious battle
Jul 3, 2010
946
0
Eugene
My warrior sticks last for years and I'm pretty rough on them for beer league. Only about the price of 2 or 3 woods sticks. Wood blades just fall apart so quick it seems and composites are sooo much lighter.
 

doobie604

Registered User
Jan 19, 2007
726
2
why would anybody go back to wood!?! Sure the shaft might be less prone to breakage, but blade goes soft way too quickly. Finding the right comp with good durability and performance is key, cause they're not all the same. Like the older Easton SE is great, but their blade isn't very durable, ST is very durable, but doesn't perform as well. At this stage, I've moved away from Easton all together and stick to Warriors and Bauers. Did get a Nexon N12 on sale for $80 though, been good to me so far. You don't need to spend $200 for a good stick, plenty of older models under $100 and it's way better than any wood sticks out there. Oh and give the stick some time so you can get use to flex, curve, lie, puck feel, etc, they're not all the same, your muscles needs a bit of adjustment time.
 

VaughanBender72

The Pain Is Coming
Aug 4, 2014
607
0
Toronto
My father who was born in 59' and grew up with wood sticks says he prefers wood. Prefers the feel and likes the heaviness, doesn't like the lightness of composites. I guess when you've been using something for so long you just don't want to change.
 

MattGTI

Registered User
Dec 4, 2010
288
0
Milford
My father who was born in 59' and grew up with wood sticks says he prefers wood. Prefers the feel and likes the heaviness, doesn't like the lightness of composites. I guess when you've been using something for so long you just don't want to change.

I hear you. My dad is 63, and still plays. While I don't think he really cares about his stick at this point. I did notice that last year was the first year he only had composites. I asked him why, and he said- "well you and your sisters have bought me so many sticks each year for Christmas that I had a surplus and had to start using them.". Translated- he'd still be using wood if he didn't have to go out and spend money on one, and considering he has a solid half dozen fresh composites that he had never used, he went that route.
 

Bedards Dad

I was in the pool!!
Nov 3, 2011
13,716
8,271
Toronto
If a stick is being used to its proper meaning its bound to last maybe 6 months at most.

High end sticks are made for people who are high end players. Not to bash beer leaguers but the 260$ composites aren't made for them. They're made for players that play at a competitive level. Bantam AA-AAA, midget aa-aaa, junior, college, minor & professional..

My coach retired this year from playing professionally. He used wood sticks in juniors, he was one of the last to use them in the ushl. When he started he could use a wood stick for 2-3 games and after his 2nd season He went through 3 a game. Maybe they didn't break but the performance lacked. Wood sticks just aren't made to be used as brutally as they are now a days.

If you use a stick properly your estimated time of 'usefulness' is 1-60 days. Which is why warranties on sticks are so little.

Of course pro stock sticks are built even tougher and pros go through as many as 3 a period..

It's incredible that there could be so much wrong with 1 post. Well done.
 

Trevor3

Registered User
Nov 16, 2010
219
0
Stephenville - YJT
I used composite all through minor hockey and junior, but when I was in midget I started keeping a wood stick on the bench for when games got chippy. Nothing like hacking a guy down with fresh Ukrainian lumber when he runs your goalie.

I play semi-competitive rec hockey now and I've since switched to wood entirely. I always had issues with the composite blades chipping away on the end as a defenceman. I go to Canadian Tire and pick up a solid wooden stick every now and again, never pay more than $20 for it (last one cost $14). I'm low maitenance when it comes to gear anyway, I've had most of my gear for 10 years or so. Probably since my last growth spurt in Bantam :laugh: so a good wooden stick will last me a full season, no problem.

I'll never buy a composite again.
 

JR97

Registered User
May 16, 2012
131
0
Those that use wood sticks.... Do you still mow your lawn with a push reel lawn mower?

According to a landscape and sod laying buddy of mine, push reel lawn mower are actually better for the grass because it cuts vs chops the grass blade. :sarcasm: ymmv.

But yeah, now that I've finally found a blade pattern, kick point, and flex I like, I won't be going back too wood anytime soon. But I'd go back to wood before I'd ever go back to aluminum.
 

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