Who did Vegas fleece worse at the Expansion Draft?

[Halla]

Pittsburgh:
M.A. Fleury: 17-6-3, 2.03GAA/.933SV%
2020 2nd rd pick

* The pens gave vegas a 2nd to take a goalie that has been one of the best in the league this year

Columbus:
William Karlsson: 30g/50pts, +32 in 57 games
David Clarkson
2017 1st rd pick (used to move up and take Suzuki)
2019 2nd rd pick

* Columbus gave vegas a haul to take Clarksons cap hit, and not take Korpisalo, Anderson, Johnson.
Columbus took the pair of picks and took a kid who is is a likely 40g scorer this year

Florida:
Jonathan Marchessault: 21g/55pts, +25 in 54 games
Rielly Smith: 17g/48pts, +28 in 57 games

* Florida agreed to leave 30g scorer Marchessault unprotected as part of the deal that sent Rielly Smith to vegas for a 4th. Florida viewed him as a cap dump and Vegas jumped at the opportunity to land two top 6 forwards and only give up a 4th



So who made out worst?

Click to read more...

 

[M C D A V I D]

Jesus. Didn't realize how much of a genius McPhee actually was. They all got taken to the shed, but Columbus more than the others only because Karlsson is better than anyone Cbus tried to protect lol.

 

[Kcb12345]

Florida was just plain stupid.

 

[CraigsList]

No doubt it was Florida.

They weren't really fleeced though, they were just dumb enough to get rid of those two.

 

[HanSolo]

Marchesseault is Vegas' best player followed by Karlsson followed extremely closely by Smith followed by Fleury.

Marchesseault

Karlsson
Smith

Fleury

It's Florida and not particularly close. Though Columbus paying a first rounder for taking on Clarkson's contract (which was a win win for cap floor purposes) on condition that Vegas take a future 30 goal scorer is pretty awful. I don't really view Fleury as any sort of fleecing. They had to choose between two good goalies and they went with youth, which was the right call. It's not like Murray is playing poorly either. A better choice would be Haula and Tuch to Vegas to not take Dumba. Tuch looks like a real good option in the top 6 in the future and Haula has been really good as the 2c between Perron and Neal. Would still go with Florida in that case but it's a better choice than Pittsburgh.

 

[ijuka]

Florida was easily the worst. Pens were pretty much a victim of circumstances, I can hardly blame them for that.

Columbus wasn't great but that's leaning on hindsight quite a bit.

Marchessault I thought was one of Panthers' best players last season and he had the stats to boot. I honestly didn't understand this at the time and still don't. It's incredible how the incompetent management managed to almost completely ruin what they had going during the course of a single year. On Marchessault, last season his eye test was quite a bit better than his production in my opinion.

 

[VoluntaryDom]

Don't give away marshmallows

 

[pheasant]

Florida situation is worse because they should have known it was this stupid at the time.

MAF or Murray had to be exposed. So PIT was stuck. Their options were limited. What happened was bad for them, but not stupid.

No one knew William Karlsson was going to break out like this, and they did get to protect what seemed like better players plus dump an anchor contract with Clarkson. They got something out of the transaction. Beyond bad in heindseight, but not bad at the time when Karlsson looked like an 8 goal scorer, not a 40 goal scorer.

But Florida!? They paid a good player to make sure that Vegas would also take a different good player. What? Ya, it was clearly stupid from the start. Vegas would have been happy with one of the two guys they got. Giving up a measly 4th in order to get them both was robbery.

 

[Juicy Pop]

It's a wonder how just 2/3rds of a season can so markedly change the perception of those deals.

 

[Plural]

It's a wonder how just 2/3rds of a season can so markedly change the perception of those deals.

I think everyone was calling Florida management idiots even before the season started.

 

[Sam Spade]

Jesus. Didn't realize how much of a genius McPhee actually was.

McPhee traded Forsberg for a bag of pucks he is not a genius.

Half the people on this website could have done what he did. Please remember the rules that he got to use, that Vegas (and Seattle) paid 500 million for:

"New protected list rules were engineered to allow existing teams to protect only seven forwards, three defensemen and a goalie or eight defensemen/forwards, plus a goalie."

"McPhee used the new rules to his advantage by extracting draft picks, prospects and other NHL players from teams looking to protect players on their roster."

The Kraken will do the same exact thing in a couple of years.

 

[hotpaws]

Florida f***ed up but you can blame there cheap ass owners who ordered their GM to dump salary.

 

[hotpaws]

Florida ****ed up but you can blame there cheap ass owners who ordered their GM to dump salary.

 

[DrJustice]

McPhee traded Forsberg for a bag of pucks he is not a genius.

Half the people on this website could have done what he did. Please remember the rules that he got to use, that Vegas (and Seattle) paid 500 million for:

"New protected list rules were engineered to allow existing teams to protect only seven forwards, three defensemen and a goalie or eight defensemen/forwards, plus a goalie."

"McPhee used the new rules to his advantage by extracting draft picks, prospects and other NHL players from teams looking to protect players on their roster."

The Kraken will do the same exact thing in a couple of years.

Considering no expansion team in the history of the league has even come close to doing what Vegas is doing, I doubt it was as easy as you claim.

Establishing a winning culture is far more difficult than playing fantasy GM in NHL 18.

I'd bet you real money Seattle doesn't get half as many wins in their first year.

Also, the majority of posters on this board were very critical of McPhee on the night of the expansion draft for making deals with these teams and their player choices so it shows you how much we know.

 

[Habs10025]

Pittsburgh Penguins Ownership/management ,coaching staff believe that Murray gives them the best chance to win and the players especially Crosby , Malkin , Letang , Kessel agree . If they didn't Fleury would still be in Pittsburgh.

 

[Sam Spade]

Considering no expansion team in the history of the league has even come close to doing what Vegas is doing, I doubt it was as easy as you claim.

Establishing a winning culture is far more difficult than playing fantasy GM in NHL 18.

I'd bet you real money Seattle doesn't get half as many wins in their first year.

Also, the majority of posters on this board were very critical of McPhee on the night of the expansion draft for making deals with these teams and their player choices so it shows you how much we know.

I'm not saying it was easy, but getting Gallant was the smartest thing McPhee did and he probably had a committee that helped him with that.

But I will not acknowledge it was some super feat of genius either, the rules were set up for them to succeed and they are. Obviously winning the Pres trophy type success was not foreseen but I read a lot of analysis that predicted they would be a good team, including Severelli and McGuire who said they would make the playoffs.

 

[DrJustice]

I'm not saying it was easy, but getting Gallant was the smartest thing McPhee did and he probably had a committee that helped him with that.

But I will not acknowledge it was some super feat of genius either, the rules were set up for them to succeed and they are. Obviously winning the Pres trophy type success was not foreseen but I read a lot of analysis that predicted they would be a good team, including Severelli and McGuire who said they would make the playoffs.

That's fair. Personally I didn't think a team full of players who had never played together before was going to be cohesive enough to establish such early success. Clearly due to a number of reasons they have come together to be a tight, motivated group of skilled players who are currently greater than the sum of their parts. Does that success carry over to next season? It's tough to say but I wouldn't be surprised if this was a one year thing and that magical chemistry is gone if guys like Neal go in the off-season.

I do agree with you that Gallant is a bigger part of their winning culture and success than McPhee.

 

[Halla]

Florida situation is worse because they should have known it was this stupid at the time.

MAF or Murray had to be exposed. So PIT was stuck. Their options were limited. What happened was bad for them, but not stupid.

No one knew William Karlsson was going to break out like this, and they did get to protect what seemed like better players plus dump an anchor contract with Clarkson. They got something out of the transaction. Beyond bad in heindseight, but not bad at the time when Karlsson looked like an 8 goal scorer, not a 40 goal scorer.

But Florida!? They paid a good player to make sure that Vegas would also take a different good player. What? Ya, it was clearly stupid from the start. Vegas would have been happy with one of the two guys they got. Giving up a measly 4th in order to get them both was robbery.

I actually chose Columbus because they thought so little of Karlsson they didnt even ask to include him with that protection group. would have it been so hard to force vegas to take calvert instead (7 years, career high 24 pts)
nobody expected Karlsson to break out, but at least he has only had 2 seasons and still has upside.

but yeah florida giving up a 1st liner just to dump a contract that wasnt even that bad is brutal

 

[Hostile Offer]

Florida ****ed up but you can blame there cheap ass owners who ordered their GM to dump salary.

The management gave Tallon a sucky hand but he didn't exactly play it out well either. Some might think a cheap 30 goal scorer is a keeper, some decide to protect Bjugstad instead.

 

[bobholly39]

Pitt doesn't belong here. They had to chose between Fleury and Murray and they made the right choice.

Florida

 

[hotpaws]

The management gave Tallon a sucky hand but he didn't exactly play it out well either. Some might think a cheap 30 goal scorer is a keeper, some decide to protect Bjugstad instead.

correct me if i'm wrong but wasn't Marchessault the price for Vegas to take Smith?

 

[Hostile Offer]

correct me if i'm wrong but wasn't Marchessault the price for Vegas to take Smith ?

You are not wrong but had they exposed both Smith and Bjugstad, chances are Vegas would've picked one. Obviously the price Tallon paid just to dump Smith was way too big as well.

 

[BB88]

This is Florida by a mile. They got 2 longterm top6 options for free.

 

[hotpaws]

You are not wrong but had they exposed both Smith and Bjugstad, chances are Vegas would've picked one. Obviously the price Tallon paid just to dump Smith was way too big as well.

I don't think they would have , both of those players had down years and big cap hits with term . Also while March had a good year it was also the first good year he had and he was 26 when he broke through , he also has gone to another level this year which makes the trade look even worse .

The sad part is if the Panthers owner wasn't counting nickles chances are they'd have made the playoffs this year had they not had to dump salary , they still might but add March and Smith and they'd probably be in a wildcard spot at this time or at least much closer to it .

 

[Hostile Offer]

I don't think they would have , both of those players had down years and big cap hits with term . Also while March had a good year it was also the first good year he had and he was 26 when he broke through , he also has gone to another level this year which makes the trade look even worse .

The sad part is if the Panthers owner wasn't counting nickles chances are they'd have made the playoffs this year had they not had to dump salary , they still might but add March and Smith and they'd probably be in a wildcard spot at this time or at least much closer to it .

Smith and Bjugstad don't have that bad contracts and Florida shouldn't have considered them that bad in the draft either. Smith was still a useful middle six player on his down year, Bjugstad was terrible but that was by far his worst season and was destined to bounce back at least to some extent which he has done. Had the Panthers protected March instead of Bjugstad, who else would've been on the table for Vegas? Colton Sceviour? Bleh. I'd say both Tallon and the owners screwed it up.