Who’s the goalie guru on HF Habs?

[Shawnathon]

Who has an incredible understanding of.goaltending you always find interesting on the Habs forum! Who gives really good anylsis among simple statistics.

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[Frank Drebin]

dis gun be good

 

[Runner77]

W3K.

 

[Frank Drebin]

What I've taken from tonight is that we all identify with different styles of goaltending, just like our GM identifies with character, because thats essentially all that he brought.

A lot of die hard fans love Price (as we all should) because he is the definition of what a textbook NHL goalie should be. Big, strong, excellent with rebounds, angles, puck handling, the whole package.

I do think the aspect of his game that has been supremely overrated is his mental fortitude. How many times have we heard "cool under pressure". I don't think that could be farther from the truth. He doesn't excel under pressure. In fact I think he folds under pressure.

We saw a similar phenomenon with MAF. The kid at 18 years old was absolutely worthy of a 1OA pick.

Yet you look at guys like Jon Quick and Tim Thomas who have a more non traditional way of playing goal but have had greater success, I think it boils down more often than not to a winners attitude which is extremely hard to quantify.

TL;DR - its almost impossible to be an expert at NHL goaltending by watching games on the Telly, although @nhlfan9191 and @WeThreeKings are pretty much authorities as far as this board goes

 

[thewall]

I play goalie myself. I feel i can give a different angle on certain plays or goals or saves that might be different then someone else who never played the position. Yes I defend Price often. I feel people fet on him for no reason except of his 10.5 m per year. I get it but goals against are not all on the goalie.

 

[HabsTown]

I play goalie myself. I feel i can give a different angle on certain plays or goals or saves that might be different then someone else who never played the position. Yes I defend Price often. I feel people fet on him for no reason except of his 10.5 m per year. I get it but goals against are not all on the goalie.

I second this. I've played in net for 20 years at high level (AA-AAA) and humbly think I'm way better to analyse a goalie's work (being scored on, saves and so on) than someone who never played that position.

 

[admiralcadillac]

No one

I don't think playing goal at a high level really makes you any less of an armchair analyst here

(myself included)

I play goalie myself. I feel i can give a different angle on certain plays or goals or saves that might be different then someone else who never played the position. Yes I defend Price often. I feel people fet on him for no reason except of his 10.5 m per year. I get it but goals against are not all on the goalie.

I think Price is pretty well shielded here

 

[Frank Drebin]

No one

I don't think playing goal at a high level really makes you any less of an armchair analyst here

(myself included)

Yep. I think goalies are relatively easy to judge, it's the mental/intangible part of the game where we all like to speculate.

Is he getting beat blocker side because his baby kept him awake last night or is it simply a coincidence that a few good shots beat him blocker side over the past few games.

None of us are around the team on a day to day basis, we don't know what the players personalities really are like.

I mean playing at a really high level might allow one to give some insight on what it's like to deal with crowds/media and the pressure that goes along with it but it certainly doesn't give one the final say on what it's considered good or poor positioning or the like.

 

[Fixxer]

I'm no goalie expert and the only thing I did witness was a few slight changes in his style over the years. None that I can really explain/describe.

I play goalie myself. I feel i can give a different angle on certain plays or goals or saves that might be different then someone else who never played the position. Yes I defend Price often. I feel people fet on him for no reason except of his 10.5 m per year. I get it but goals against are not all on the goalie.

Lately, like the last 3 games or 3 out of 4 games, players having been blocking passes or shots, giving the puck on a goal in the game. It happened again last game, 5th goal the Rangers scored. Petry blocked a pass, but the puck went back to the same player. The other night, don't remember who was in net... but a shot hit Jordie Benn's skate (or legs), can't blame either guys but .. that's bad occurrence or bad defensive plays.
There is also the psychological thing of reaching a milestone with a shutout on Boston. That may create a "I did it" feeling, which means he got there... then it's possible someone's motivation takes a bit of a step back. Since then...

Anyway, Still lots of hockey to be played.

 

[Draft]

.... I can tell you many who aren't if that helps?

 

[llamateizer]

I'm no goalie expert, but I did witness slight goalie style change.



Lately, like the last 3 games or 3 out of 4 games, players having been blocking passes or shots, giving the puck on a goal in the game. It happened again last game, 5th goal the Rangers scored. Petry blocked a pass, but the puck went back to the same player. The other night, don't remember who was in net... but a shot hit Jordie Benn's skate (or legs), can't blame either guys but .. that's bad occurrence or bad defensive plays.
There is also the psychological thing of reaching a milestone with a shutout on Boston. That may create a "I did it" feeling, which means he got there... then it's possible someone's motivation takes a bit of a step back. Since then...
View attachment 152651 Anyway, Still lots of hockey to be played.

3,4,4,5 goals allowed. I see a tendancy. 5,6,6,7,7,0(shutout) rinse and repeat

 

[thewall]

Like i posted before. Save% can be deceiving or means shit. Its like a +/- in some way.

Sometime you can get scored 3 times on 7 shots but the 3 goals were tic tac toes or impossible shots to stop and sometimes you can stop 20 shots and none of them are scoring chances or shots from the outside.

A plus minus is the same thing. If one of your teamate gives it away and they score you get a minus but you are not even implicated in the play. Or a goalie gives up a softie like Condon did vs Arizona. All 5 skaters ends up with a minus but were they to blame on the goal?

 

[teamfirst]

Like i posted before. Save% can be deceiving or means ****. Its like a +/- in some way.

Sometime you can get scored 3 times on 7 shots but the 3 goals were tic tac toes or impossible shots to stop and sometimes you can stop 20 shots and none of them are scoring chances or shots from the outside.

A plus minus is the same thing. If one of your teamate gives it away and they score you get a minus but you are not even implicated in the play. Or a goalie gives up a softie like Condon did vs Arizona. All 5 skaters ends up with a minus but were they to blame on the goal?

True on a small sample like 10 to 15 games but save % must mean something on a 80 games sample size dont you think

 

[the]

Who is that goalie guru? I want to have a talk with him and know if Pricer is a good goalie or not.

 

[dinodebino]

wtk is an experienced netminder.

 

[CHwest]

Weird that when the defense is decent Prices stats go up, when the defense sucks his stats go down. Weird, just weird. And I'm no expert.

 

[Milhouse40]

True on a small sample like 10 to 15 games but save % must mean something on a 80 games sample size dont you think

He's right and even on a 80 games sample mainly cause it doesn't take into account the quality, distance and any variations in the shot. The 30 feet from Plekanec has the same value as the slot shot from Ovechkin.

But this thing is true for about every stats. The empty netter or skate deflected shot has the same value (Goal) than an elite shot in the top corner.

One stats or two can't tell everything there is to know about a player and how good or bad he is....that's good for forward, D and Goalie.

 

[Genesis76]

Who is that goalie guru? I want to have a talk with him and know if Pricer is a good goalie or not.

I will go ahead and save you guys some time.

No he’s not.


Why you may ask?
2 simple answers that explain everything:

La toughness du MENTAL
Le toughnesss du MENTAL

He’s got none of that

 

[Genesis76]

Me. Just joking. @WeThreeKings

How dare you, after all the arguments we had together you still can’t find it in your self to admit i was right.

Jokes

 

[WeThreeKings]

I can try my best to start a thread that is focused on goals against, both what we score and what is scored against us and pull some analysis in.

I can't promise to be punctual as Im busy but I can try my best.

 

[Fixxer]

La toughness du MENTAL
Le toughnesss du MENTAL

I sure didn't expect to hear this one. lol (Les Boys)

 

[nhlfan9191]

How dare you, after all the arguments we had together you still can’t find in you to admit i was right.

Jokes

There’ll come a day Genesis where there’s a starting goalie for this team that we mutually respect. Although I will miss the civil war once it’s over.

 

[ahmedou]

Wat a diss

 

[Chili]

Like i posted before. Save% can be deceiving or means ****. Its like a +/- in some way.

Sometime you can get scored 3 times on 7 shots but the 3 goals were tic tac toes or impossible shots to stop and sometimes you can stop 20 shots and none of them are scoring chances or shots from the outside.

A plus minus is the same thing. If one of your teamate gives it away and they score you get a minus but you are not even implicated in the play. Or a goalie gives up a softie like Condon did vs Arizona. All 5 skaters ends up with a minus but were they to blame on the goal?

Anderssen of the Leafs had a shutout against the Pens the other day. I couldn't recall a tough save after the game. He's probably had better games where he gave up several goals.

Large variance in the quality of shots/scoring chances but the save pct considers them all equal.

I played goal a bit and the biggest thing I learned that a lot of the battle is between the ears. Giving up a tough goal and shaking it off quickly and being prepared for the next shot is a challenge.

 

[Cole Caulifield]

Even NHL experts have tough time evaluating goalies. Goalies are consistently overpaid/underpaid and drafted out of rank compared to other positions. So .. to ask who is a goaltending expert on these boards is kind of a non-starter. No one knows shit here.