Recalled/Assigned: Whitecloud recalled; Zach and Nik Roy to AHL

Vegan Knight

Registered User
Feb 16, 2018
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Interesting! I don't think I hate it.

Get him some NHL time.

EDIT: My guess at the pairings.

McNabb-Schmidt
Theodore-Whitecloud
Holden Engelland
Merrill
 

GKG18

Expansion Fan
Jun 25, 2016
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Hendertucky
It's either to showcase him because he is on the trading block or he needs to fill Hague's spot because Hague is being traded.
 

Vegan Knight

Registered User
Feb 16, 2018
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I think if he's up it's to replace Engo who was awful last game.

Engelland wasn't as bad as Merrill.

Engelland had his player covered on both goals that went in, if anyone was to blame it was Merrill.
 

CupInSIX

My cap runneth over
Jul 1, 2012
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Alphaville
Whitecloud is a RD and Hague a LD, not to mention they're completely different Dmen prospects.

Engelland wasn't as bad as Merrill.

Engelland had his player covered on both goals that went in, if anyone was to blame it was Merrill.

He also fell without his walker and passed the puck into Merrill's feet from 6ft away resulting in a good scoring chance for the Hurricanes.
 
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willy702

Registered User
Jul 3, 2016
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Engo definitely needs a game or two off each week. Zach's a good replacement, you don't expect much from him other than don't f it up. But this is still a veteran loving coach, Merrill ain't dropping and Holden is a lock to stay in the lineup with Theo until it doesn't work. If he gets in its because of an Engo night off.
 

willy702

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Jul 3, 2016
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It's either to showcase him because he is on the trading block or he needs to fill Hague's spot because Hague is being traded.

Doubt that, probably they want to get Hague's confidence and game back in Chicago. Said it before, no point in keeping a rookie in the NHL and having him sit games out unless its a short stint for the coaches to see him and work with him. Keeping him as the 6.5 D-man makes no sense, better to be #1 in Chicago.
 

Vegan Knight

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Feb 16, 2018
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Doubt that, probably they want to get Hague's confidence and game back in Chicago. Said it before, no point in keeping a rookie in the NHL and having him sit games out unless its a short stint for the coaches to see him and work with him. Keeping him as the 6.5 D-man makes no sense, better to be #1 in Chicago.

He has been playing every game almost. And he just scored his first goal right before the break.

I think Whitecloud being there to give Engo a rest is a good call though. He is a lot better after getting a rest every three or four games. It can also give Whitecloud a good opportunity in the NHL.
 

IceNeophyte

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Nov 14, 2017
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It's so fun to watch a dman that doesn't have to reposition himself every time he gets a pass on the right side of the o zone.
 

Brazen331

Registered User
Jul 18, 2018
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Trying to save cap $$


Would anyone be so kind to explain to me how this Cap/ AHL send down thing works? Like how much more Cap do we get when we send say Hague down and how much Cap are we expected to have by deadline?
 

willy702

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Jul 3, 2016
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Would anyone be so kind to explain to me how this Cap/ AHL send down thing works? Like how much more Cap do we get when we send say Hague down and how much Cap are we expected to have by deadline?

Pretty simple, every player salary is calculated to a daily amount and those amounts don't count tomorrow. These two aren't making much, but you can only send down a handful of players so they do what they can. They only have "saved" a little over $100k of cap and probably wont get to much over $150k come deadline time. Since there is only about a quarter of the season left then that equates to having about $600k in extra space to use. It's not really much, requires almost any trade to have some salary go back the other way, so can't pick up an NHL player for just picks or a prospect and that's why you hear about some higher priced players being mentioned as part of a potential deal
 

Brazen331

Registered User
Jul 18, 2018
691
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Pretty simple, every player salary is calculated to a daily amount and those amounts don't count tomorrow. These two aren't making much, but you can only send down a handful of players so they do what they can. They only have "saved" a little over $100k of cap and probably wont get to much over $150k come deadline time. Since there is only about a quarter of the season left then that equates to having about $600k in extra space to use. It's not really much, requires almost any trade to have some salary go back the other way, so can't pick up an NHL player for just picks or a prospect and that's why you hear about some higher priced players being mentioned as part of a potential deal

Thanks. This makes me think Whitecloud was being showcased even more now.
 

Vegan Knight

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Feb 16, 2018
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Thanks. This makes me think Whitecloud was being showcased even more now.

I don't know if that's totally correct because Granger on the Athletic listed Vegas as having the equivalent of over 2M right now and about 4M at the deadline.
 

Brazen331

Registered User
Jul 18, 2018
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G
I don't know if that's totally correct because Granger on the Athletic listed Vegas as having the equivalent of over 2M right now and about 4M at the deadline.

Then if that’s the case ZW might not have been showcased. I think he might have been though: if they are going to do a deal for a RHD, the other team might want a RHD prospect coming back.

Edit: I just remembered Zach was born in Brandon Manitoba. He is staying here.
 
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CupInSIX

My cap runneth over
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I'm glad they finally gave him a shot. They should have done this last year with him & Coghlan, maybe they would have been less stressed in camp.

As far as trades go, he played well, and this decreases the desperation for a RD that can kill penalties. At least a little bit.


Plus if anything, Merrill is playing his way off the team and into his new coach's doghouse. Whitecloud is playing his way on and he would have to go through waivers to be sent back down next season. NCAA experience, 1 1/2 AHL regular seasons plus a deep run to the finals. There's not much more for him to learn down there.
 
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Lehtonen

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Jan 7, 2016
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I'm glad they finally gave him a shot. They should have done this last year with him & Coghlan, maybe they would have been less stressed in camp.

As far as trades go, he played well, and this decreases the desperation for a RD that can kill penalties. At least a little bit.
I am happy too that Whitecloud finally got his chance in the big club. I felt in love to his play in Calder Cup playoffs and he definitely did not disappointed me against Nashville. When it comes to penalty killing it was in fact his only weak part yesterday. He got a little bit PK time when Merrill was in the penalty box in the second period but in the short time he was not able to block shots and one-timers from his side so he needs to develop his positioning in the next games if he wants to get more PK time.

Here he you can you see two clips where lets three shots in a row through to Fleury because his positioning is bad. Engelland and Merrill are still ahead of of him when it comes blocking the shots in the penalty killing but I am sure Whitecloud improves in the future those little things which separate winners and losers.
giphy.gif

giphy.gif


Otherwise I really enjoyed to watch Whitecloud. This was probably one of his best shifts. First, he is able to shoot the puck past the opponent who is pretty close to him on the blue line.
giphy.gif


And when Nashville gets the puck to the neutral zone Whitecloud is able to quickly find his teammates twice and so Vegas is able to continue controlling the play and Carrier creates a great scoring chance to Tuch.
giphy.gif
 

HanSolo

DJ Crazy Times
Apr 7, 2008
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I thought save for a couple rookie mistakes he played a very good game. And he certainly showed more positional soundness than we get out of Engo, Holden and Merrill on a nightly basis. Then again rookies often get hyped when they get their shot and play above what they bring on a more consistent basis.

Either way I think he deserves a longer look because if his responsible play translates to the NHL that will be exactly what this team needs.
 

willy702

Registered User
Jul 3, 2016
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You really don't need to showcase players for trades. Every team has a relative value on every player signed by every team. Just as easy to go see a player in the AHL, hard to think a prospect needs to be proven by NHL time. This is why players get held out of games, only thing they ever needs to be proven is a player is healthy.
 

Vegas07

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Dec 6, 2018
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There is more value in seeing how he looks with the team than there is in showcasing him.

If he looks good enough that his value increases when showcasing him, then why not keep him?

Some of the trade ideas I’ve seen could turn out really badly and will cost us. At least with Whitecloud we can try him out, see how he looks and we don’t need to ship out any drafts picks or players.
 

Vegan Knight

Registered User
Feb 16, 2018
5,147
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There is more value in seeing how he looks with the team than there is in showcasing him.

If he looks good enough that his value increases when showcasing him, then why not keep him?

Some of the trade ideas I’ve seen could turn out really badly and will cost us. At least with Whitecloud we can try him out, see how he looks and we don’t need to ship out any drafts picks or players.

I think I'm all for staying put with the team and seeing if Whitecloud and Dugan (with Fleury playing better) could lead us to some postseason success.
 

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