Which Teams & Players Pass/Fail Eye Test For You Despite Reputation

Discussion in 'National Hockey League Talk' started by EdJovanovski, Oct 2, 2018.

View Users: View Users
  1. EdJovanovski

    EdJovanovski Registered User

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2016
    Messages:
    2,565
    Likes Received:
    2,168
    Trophy Points:
    121
    Occupation:
    Financial Advisor
    Location:
    Los Angeles, CA
    Which teams and players that are considered good, fail the eye test for you and you don’t understand the appeal of when you see them play? And which that are considered bad, impress you when you see them play?

    Fail

    Teams:
    Carolina Hurricanes every year people say this is the year they make the playoffs and how good their defense is, blah blah blah. They look absolutely god awful every time I’ve seen them play. They have no offense to speak of, and have so many defensive lapses and are the easiest team I’ve ever seen to score on. I don’t know if Rangers (who I’m a fan of) have just dominated them as of late but they have looked awful for years whenever I’ve seen them

    Players:
    Chris Tanev maybe he gets overrated because he’s on such a bad team but every time I watch him he seems like a bottom pairing defenseman on a decent team. He’s painfully average in every category and I don’t understand why he’s so highly regarded
    JT Miller he puts up 2nd line winger numbers so many think he’s a decent player but whenever I’ve seen him he looks like one of the dumbest players in the league. He causes turnovers every shift, he takes bozo penalties, stops skating and stares off into space, and is all in all a horrible hockey player
    John Tavares I read people considering him a top 10 center in the league, but whenever I see him play he looks like a slug.
    Jacob Slavin seems invisible, but he’s talked about on here as if he’s a superstar. Does he have elite advanced stats or something?


    I’ll add more and the ones that pass
     
  2. dim jim

    dim jim Passing the Torch

    Joined:
    Jun 2, 2009
    Messages:
    53,900
    Likes Received:
    4,080
    Trophy Points:
    156
    Location:
    Vancouver
    Looks like your eyes suck.
     
    InAbsensia, Regal, Master P and 10 others like this.
  3. EdJovanovski

    EdJovanovski Registered User

    Joined:
    Apr 26, 2016
    Messages:
    2,565
    Likes Received:
    2,168
    Trophy Points:
    121
    Occupation:
    Financial Advisor
    Location:
    Los Angeles, CA
    In regard to which?
     
  4. dim jim

    dim jim Passing the Torch

    Joined:
    Jun 2, 2009
    Messages:
    53,900
    Likes Received:
    4,080
    Trophy Points:
    156
    Location:
    Vancouver
    Chris Tanev was the best defender on a 100 point team, healthy Tanev is one of the best shot suppressing defenders in the NHL, from a stretch between 2014/2016 Tanev had the best CA/60 Rel of any defender in the league by a wide margin.

    Tanev is a quietly effective player who has exceptional hockey IQ, IQ is something you can't quantify. People get lost in the noise, Tanev is not a high event player, he's a guy that quietly goes by shift by shift spiting up and chewing some of the hardest deployment in the league and year in and year out when healthy churns out fantastic results. The Canucks have been the worst team in the entire NHL the past 3 years but despite that have a positive GF% when Christopher Tanev is on the ice.

    John Tavares is unquestionably a top 10 centre in the league..
     
    OmniCube, Duffman955, Pure and 3 others like this.
  5. God Bless Mr Coffee

    God Bless Mr Coffee Mine eyes have seen the glory...

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2006
    Messages:
    7,675
    Likes Received:
    1,776
    Trophy Points:
    156
    Occupation:
    @thxPierre
    I agree completely on the Hurricanes (and, to a lesser extent, Slavin). I have no faith in them being a playoff team anytime soon. People forget how painfully mediocre the Nashville Predators used to be with a defense and coach far better than Carolina's. That 2013-14 team coached by Trotz had Ellis/Ekholm/Weber/Josi/Jones/Klein and couldn't crack the top half of their conference.

    If your forwards are trash, it's pretty difficult to compete in the NHL. The Canes have some alright pieces but their center depth, coaching, and goaltending situation all leave them in the lower half of a pretty decent Metropolitan division. Outside of Teraveinen and Aho, they don't have really anyone who is a top 6 forward on a playoff team, and they were in the bottom third for goals scored last season. And for all of their great up-and-coming defensemen, they were also in the bottom third for goals against. Mrazek/Darling won't bail that out.
     
    Last edited: Oct 2, 2018
    Mach8 and Duffman955 like this.
  6. dim jim

    dim jim Passing the Torch

    Joined:
    Jun 2, 2009
    Messages:
    53,900
    Likes Received:
    4,080
    Trophy Points:
    156
    Location:
    Vancouver
    Carolina is a good team that pushes the play, really similar to the Jets prior to this year in the sense where they're usually outplaying their opponents and with league average goaltending would be a consistent playoff team.

    Their defensive core is incredibly good and among the most effective in the NHL in terms of results. (shot suppression)
     
  7. God Bless Mr Coffee

    God Bless Mr Coffee Mine eyes have seen the glory...

    Joined:
    Jul 11, 2006
    Messages:
    7,675
    Likes Received:
    1,776
    Trophy Points:
    156
    Occupation:
    @thxPierre
    They're not a good team. They suck. The fact that they managed a mind-blowing +400 shot differential and were still a bottom-10 offensive team that allowed more goals than they scored is not a credit to them, it's evidence of how much they suck. Their feckless forwards pile up shots chasing games their goalies give away in the first 30 minutes. They're bad. They're not good. And they're not going to be good until they fix the fact that they can't build a top 6 forward line.

    The Flyers and Leafs have bad defenses. One has pretty good goalies, the other has pretty bad goalies. Both have really good forwards. Both were ~100 point teams last season: Carolina had 83. Defense might win championships, but you need to score enough goals to survive 82 games and make the playoffs. Carolina is bad.

    Comparing them to earlier versions of the Jets is silly. The Jets had NHL goalies and a number of effective forwards. The Resurgent Hurricanes is an HF pipedream held by advanced stats nerds and defensive prospect fetishists.
     
    Last edited: Oct 2, 2018
  8. ottawa

    ottawa Avatar of the Year*

    Joined:
    Nov 7, 2012
    Messages:
    27,024
    Likes Received:
    2,011
    Trophy Points:
    172
    Gender:
    Male
    Location:
    Orleans/Toronto
    Malkin
    Crosby
    McDavid
    Matthews
    Backstrom
    Stamkos
    Kopitar

    Those are 7 centers (in no order) I'd take over Tavares easily.

    He falls into the group with Giroux, Seguin, Scheifele, Bergeron and Barkov (HM: Kuznetsov)

    It definitely is questionable/debatable unless you're a leafs fan
     
  9. boredmale

    boredmale Registered User Sponsor

    Joined:
    Jul 13, 2005
    Messages:
    36,529
    Likes Received:
    1,991
    Trophy Points:
    186
    I would probably throw Backstrom, Matthews(for now) and Stamkos into the 2nd group. All that being said I could see arguments for Tavares being 5th or 14th with all the guys you mentioned(it also depends on a year by year basis, I would argue 4 years ago and last year he is probably top 10, the 2 years in between not so much)
     
  10. HavocWreaker

    HavocWreaker Registered User

    Joined:
    Mar 28, 2015
    Messages:
    6,342
    Likes Received:
    776
    Trophy Points:
    94
    Giroux isnt a center anymore, scheifele has more to prove, his best is barley ppg, Stamkos is neck and neck with JT scoring lately but JT brings more to the game and doesn't have nearly as good linemates. Backstrom same thing, not the defense part though. All else i agree with. imo

    Crosby
    McDavid
    Matthews
    Kopitar

    and the rest fight it out.
     
  11. Surrounded By Ahos

    Surrounded By Ahos Bojangles Boy

    Joined:
    May 24, 2008
    Messages:
    11,174
    Likes Received:
    19,868
    Trophy Points:
    186
    Location:
    Raleigh
    Jesus ****ing Christ ask mcdavid how invisible Slavin is.

     
    InAbsensia, Puck Dogg, Ares and 12 others like this.
  12. JoVel

    JoVel Registered User

    Joined:
    Jan 23, 2017
    Messages:
    4,623
    Likes Received:
    2,401
    Trophy Points:
    111
    Location:
    Finland
    I remember Slavin absolutely shutting down Kucherov early last season when Kuch was on that insane hot streak. Definitely got my respect.
     
    FreshSeabass, olli, Fixxer and 2 others like this.
  13. Jot

    Jot Registered User

    Joined:
    Mar 10, 2013
    Messages:
    4,879
    Likes Received:
    65
    Trophy Points:
    71
    Occupation:
    Student
    Location:
    Brampton, Ontario
    Erik Karlsson Defensively before 2016.

    I always heard he was good. But when ever we played Ottawa. I just wasnt impressed from his defensive game.
     
  14. boredmale

    boredmale Registered User Sponsor

    Joined:
    Jul 13, 2005
    Messages:
    36,529
    Likes Received:
    1,991
    Trophy Points:
    186
    Not saying he was/is good defensively but I do think he is great at getting the puck out of his own dzone, so the less time you spend in your own zone the less chance the other team has to score
     
    Catch22 and Pure like this.
  15. LEAFANFORLIFE23

    LEAFANFORLIFE23 Registered User

    Joined:
    Jun 17, 2010
    Messages:
    23,372
    Likes Received:
    1,683
    Trophy Points:
    139
    Gender:
    Male
    John Tavares for surge you called him a "slug" but he has multpule 80+ points season so I don't know what you think you see but "slugs" aren't capable of 80+ points
     
  16. maacoshark

    maacoshark Registered User

    Joined:
    Jul 22, 2017
    Messages:
    5,061
    Likes Received:
    1,485
    Trophy Points:
    94
    I've never been overly impressed watching Karlsson in the defensive zone either. Especially in a physical game.
     
  17. ccman68

    ccman68 Registered User

    Joined:
    Dec 9, 2017
    Messages:
    135
    Likes Received:
    146
    Trophy Points:
    33
    Steven Stamkos is the answer. Completely carried by Kucherov. Most of our fanbase thinks that he is our 2C which says a lot. (He was a beast in the past though but just not the same after the injuries.)
     
    Portable Mink likes this.
  18. WJCJ

    WJCJ Registered User

    Joined:
    Sep 27, 2017
    Messages:
    1,156
    Likes Received:
    420
    Trophy Points:
    69
    I feel the same but I'll take it a step further, I feel like he was just bad defensively every time I watched him. Great offensively, bad defensively. I swear that he had a hard time turning in one direction and everyone was taking advantage of him and he would bail on a lot of plays. That is how bad defensively he seemed to me.
     
  19. Kismet

    Kismet Registered User

    Joined:
    Apr 29, 2010
    Messages:
    344
    Likes Received:
    97
    Trophy Points:
    55
    Location:
    Winnipeg
    Scheifele has more to prove, but Matthews doesn't?
     
  20. iSophagus

    iSophagus Registered User

    Joined:
    Nov 2, 2010
    Messages:
    4,168
    Likes Received:
    1,272
    Trophy Points:
    109
    Toews always passes the eye test. He gets so much hate on here because his points don't match his cap-hit. And he is overpaid, you can't argue it. But if you watch Blackhawks games, especially when they matter, he is one of the most noticeable and impactful players for them.

    Arizona passes the eye test. Everyone wrote them off because of the disaster-beyond-all-reason start last season. Like 1 win in 15 games or something. But that was mostly due to cardboard-cut-out quality goaltending. And the team played really well in the last 40 games, and looked like a smart group that played the right way. They passed the eye test with flying colors.

    Curtis McElhinney always passed the eye test since he arrived in Toronto. Calm and steady. The definition of what you want a backup goalie to look like.
     
  21. easton117

    easton117 Registered User

    Joined:
    Nov 11, 2017
    Messages:
    1,755
    Likes Received:
    1,256
    Trophy Points:
    84
    Gender:
    Male
    Who is talking about me again?

    Regards,

    Jason Allison
     
    Holtbyisms, Portable Mink and Breaux like this.
  22. izzy

    izzy go

    Joined:
    Apr 29, 2012
    Messages:
    77,327
    Likes Received:
    4,861
    Trophy Points:
    157
    Location:
    Nova Scotia
    tarasenko
     
  23. nbwingsfan

    nbwingsfan Registered User

    Joined:
    Dec 13, 2009
    Messages:
    7,056
    Likes Received:
    1,198
    Trophy Points:
    109
    I'm convinced Stamkos would be like a 50-60pt player without Kucherov now.

    Just doesn't look very good since the injury.

    Hamilton is another one who looks like nothing more than a PPQB who's a disaster defensively.
     
  24. Channelcat

    Channelcat Registered User

    Joined:
    Feb 8, 2013
    Messages:
    8,717
    Likes Received:
    1,540
    Trophy Points:
    110
    Occupation:
    no
    Location:
    Winnipeg
    Jets will need Helly to stand on his head again. Tons of talent, but the braintrust behind the bench is woefully under par.
     
    Ares likes this.
  25. LetsGoBLUES91

    LetsGoBLUES91 Registered User

    Joined:
    Jan 8, 2013
    Messages:
    6,047
    Likes Received:
    393
    Trophy Points:
    94
    Stamkos is a good one.
     
    Rasmi and ConnorMcMullet like this.

Share This Page

monitoring_string = "358c248ada348a047a4b9bb27a146148"