Where would you rather finish at the end of the regular season?

[Andrei79]

I don't see how any of you guys think we are actually tanking/rebuilding.

Were we rebuilding, Price, Patches and Weber would have been gone already. You can't tank with these guys around. And even if you do, you're stuck with large contracts to declining players when your team is getting better.

Look at what Toronto and Edmonton did: go in for a few years with zero defense, mediocre goaltending, and a bunch of young guns at forward.

The 'process' worked, in the sense that they got to draft some serious talent. But even then, we're still waiting for the actual results. Same with Buffalo.

Maybe we're gonna luck out somehow, but we're clearly not in the tanking process right now, IMO. But I'm really open-minded about all of this. Maybe the next few weeks/months will clarify our situation. I just don't see the process yet. Heck, I don't even see how MB can pretend he has an actual plan.

I agree.

I think MB is trying to do a sort of Vegas/Boston hybrid.

That means, stocking up on bargain bin players who push the pace and hoping he makes the POs, while trying to retool in 2-3 years if he misses them. It's the no mans land of being just being good enough to miss the better draftees that's prevented this team from getting significant players until Timmins stole the 2007 draft.

And MB half-assed his first 6 years of building a "contender", so I don't see why he wouldn't half ass his next 6 trying to "reset".

 

[Omar]

I don't see how any of you guys think we are actually tanking/rebuilding.

Were we rebuilding, Price, Patches and Weber would have been gone already. You can't tank with these guys around. And even if you do, you're stuck with large contracts to declining players when your team is getting better.

Look at what Toronto and Edmonton did: go in for a few years with zero defense, mediocre goaltending, and a bunch of young guns at forward.

The 'process' worked, in the sense that they got to draft some serious talent. But even then, we're still waiting for the actual results. Same with Buffalo.

Maybe we're gonna luck out somehow, but we're clearly not in the tanking process right now, IMO. But I'm really open-minded about all of this. Maybe the next few weeks/months will clarify our situation. I just don't see the process yet. Heck, I don't even see how MB can pretend he has an actual plan.

NJ rebuilt with Schneider.
TOR rebuilt with JVR, Gardiner, Bozak and Kadri.

You can tank with good players if they don’t move the needle. Weber won’t do much. He’s a defensive defenseman with a big shot on the PP. Price can’t do everything himself. The defense is really bad in front of him.

If we had a Crosby or Ovechkin I’d agree but you can’t win with only a goalie anymore.

 

[Grate n Colorful Oz]

Price yes. Weber... we'd have to wait until he's healthy. Nobody is going to give us anything for him unless they know his knee's okay. Max we should've traded long ago. We shot ourselves in the foot by not trading him by the deadline last year.

I'd wait next July 1st for Price. By then he'll have 56 mil left to pay over 7 years and that will make him much more valuable for an internal cap team trying to rise up. His cap will still be 10.5, but only 8 per to pay on average for those 7 years.

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

NJ rebuilt with Schneider.
TOR rebuilt with JVR, Gardiner, Bozak and Kadri.

You can tank with good players if they don’t move the needle. Weber won’t do much. He’s a defensive defenseman with a big shot on the PP. Price can’t do everything himself. The defense is really bad in front of him.

If we had a Crosby or Ovechkin I’d agree but you can’t win with only a goalie anymore.

You can't win with only one player period. McDavid finished out of the playoffs.

 

[BeliveauFan4ever]

I don't see how any of you guys think we are actually tanking/rebuilding.

Were we rebuilding, Price, Patches and Weber would have been gone already. You can't tank with these guys around. And even if you do, you're stuck with large contracts to declining players when your team is getting better.

Look at what Toronto and Edmonton did: go in for a few years with zero defense, mediocre goaltending, and a bunch of young guns at forward.

The 'process' worked, in the sense that they got to draft some serious talent. But even then, we're still waiting for the actual results. Same with Buffalo.

Maybe we're gonna luck out somehow, but we're clearly not in the tanking process right now, IMO. But I'm really open-minded about all of this. Maybe the next few weeks/months will clarify our situation. I just don't see the process yet. Heck, I don't even see how MB can pretend he has an actual plan.

If I'm a GM interested in Price, I'm tapping the brakes. Last I saw of him he did not play like a goalie worth an arm and leg.

Fools rush in...

Weber? Injured. Heavy tag. That would be Bergy looking for a Bergy to sucker into a deal for a hobbling - and expensive -Weber.

I seriously wonder where the logic is in expecting either of those guys to be 'gone by now.'

 

[HuGo Sham]

it's a strange situation. we weren't winning with this core - not without bergevin finding 2 quality C's ...which he didn't do, then he made a series of dumb decisions.. especially not keeping the great d corps we had..so at the very least habs could've been price, subban, sergachev, markov etc..a very solid back end that could've driven offence... he never understood teams are built with D and C..he's always maintained a goalie and wingers attitude and has shown 0 understanding of how to build a team--so now we're asking him to rebuild something he never built properly?

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

If I'm a GM interested in Price, I'm tapping the brakes. Last I saw of him he did not play like a goalie worth an arm and leg.

Fools rush in...

Weber? Injured. Heavy tag. That would be Bergy looking for a Bergy to sucker into a deal for a hobbling - and expensive -Weber.

I seriously wonder where the logic is in expecting either of those guys to be 'gone by now.'

The only thing with waiting on a guy like Price is that he might not be available to you later on. If I need a goalie and I've got a chance to get Carey Price... right now I'd trade for him and ask the Habs to eat a bunch of his salary. The Habs have a crap ton of cap space to use for this anyway.

 

[BeliveauFan4ever]

The only thing with waiting on a guy like Price is that he might not be available to you later on. If I need a goalie and I've got a chance to get Carey Price... right now I'd trade for him and ask the Habs to eat a bunch of his salary. The Habs have a crap ton of cap space to use for this anyway.

How many teams are in serious need right now - real contenders - to make the leap?

St. Louis. Maybe Anaheim...

 

[scrubadam]

I don't see how any of you guys think we are actually tanking/rebuilding.

Were we rebuilding, Price, Patches and Weber would have been gone already. You can't tank with these guys around. And even if you do, you're stuck with large contracts to declining players when your team is getting better.

Max-was pretty much traded, isn't being resigned so he will go when the price is right.
Weber - injured so you can't trade him anyways
Price - wait till his next bonus is paid and then his salary is more moveable.

Look at what Toronto and Edmonton did: go in for a few years with zero defense, mediocre goaltending, and a bunch of young guns at forward.

In Toronto Shanny was hired in April 2014, and they didn't move Phaneuf or Kessel till 2015 and 2016. The vets will get moved out.

You don't want to be like Edmonton who still tanked last year. Thats not a franchise to model yourself on.

The 'process' worked, in the sense that they got to draft some serious talent. But even then, we're still waiting for the actual results. Same with Buffalo.

We aren't Buffalo level. 2 years ago we had 100 pts and won the division. The team sucks now and they are going to lose this season so hopefully the future is bright. Probably not MB who will be fixing this team.

Maybe we're gonna luck out somehow, but we're clearly not in the tanking process right now, IMO. But I'm really open-minded about all of this. Maybe the next few weeks/months will clarify our situation. I just don't see the process yet. Heck, I don't even see how MB can pretend he has an actual plan.

We are tanking this season. The team was 5th worst last year and all they did was trade AG and pretty much trade Max. Now Weber is out for half the year too. We even took a cap dump. And look what Hossa cap dump got. I don't know much about the prospects but I think the habs did pretty well with taking Mason.

What happens next year will be adjusted on how the team does this year. MB will probably be fired. And a fresh start the team could try to start building a championship team with back 2 back top 3 picks (and hopefully the number 1 pick).

 

[ECWHSWI]

We are tanking this season. The team was 5th worst last year and all they did was trade AG and pretty much trade Max. Now Weber is out for half the year too. We even took a cap dump. And look what Hossa cap dump got. I don't know much about the prospects but I think the habs did pretty well with taking Mason.

What happens next year will be adjusted on how the team does this year. MB will probably be fired. And a fresh start the team could try to start building a championship team with back 2 back top 3 picks (and hopefully the number 1 pick).

this GM was still trying to acquire guys like RoR and Stastny while he already knew Weber was out...

so mybe you are tanking, but this GM ? he's not, he's just reacting...

 

[NotProkofievian]

I don't see how any of you guys think we are actually tanking/rebuilding.

Were we rebuilding, Price, Patches and Weber would have been gone already. You can't tank with these guys around. And even if you do, you're stuck with large contracts to declining players when your team is getting better.

Look at what Toronto and Edmonton did: go in for a few years with zero defense, mediocre goaltending, and a bunch of young guns at forward.

The 'process' worked, in the sense that they got to draft some serious talent. But even then, we're still waiting for the actual results. Same with Buffalo.

Maybe we're gonna luck out somehow, but we're clearly not in the tanking process right now, IMO. But I'm really open-minded about all of this. Maybe the next few weeks/months will clarify our situation. I just don't see the process yet. Heck, I don't even see how MB can pretend he has an actual plan.

The way for us to tank is to cripple our scoring, given how terrible our offence already is. Weber, even a healthy, prime Weber, can't stop a tank. His team scores way too few goals when he's on the ice and always has. He's not able to be a decisive part of a win often enough to get in the way of being awful.

I do agree that I don't see a plan from MB, though. Being that I think we should cripple our offence, why the f*** is Pacioretty still a montreal canadien? Being terrible is just the first, and most crucial step in a rebuild. Acquiring extra futures is the next part and he hasn't really done that. 7 years later, and he still has yet to acquire an extra first.

 

[Omar]

this GM was still trying to acquire guys like RoR and Stastny while he already knew Weber was out...

so mybe you are tanking, but this GM ? he's not, he's just reacting...

He was told early that Stastny and Tavares wouldn’t come here. That’s why he went the way of the rebuild. If he wasn’t rebuilding he’d have taken ROR for the 3rd overall pick, which he didn’t. He wanted ROR because he’s a #1 or #2 center and he was trying to acquire him for players he wanted to get rid of, not trade draft picks. While building through the draft and retooling you still have to acquire important players through player transactions.

 

[Lafleurs Guy]

How many teams are in serious need right now - real contenders - to make the leap?

St. Louis. Maybe Anaheim...

It's not just contenders who'd be interested. Islanders desperately need goaltending. Without it they missed the playoffs last year and it may have cost them Johnny T. Edmonton has been outside the playoffs forever... Any team that needs goaltending would be interested, esp if we're going to eat some cap space.

 

[NotProkofievian]

Everyone needs goaltending. Nobody needs a 10.5 million goaltender with an injury history coming off of...whatever the hell that season was.

 

[habsfan909]

He was told early that Stastny and Tavares wouldn’t come here. That’s why he went the way of the rebuild. If he wasn’t rebuilding he’d have taken ROR for the 3rd overall pick, which he didn’t. He wanted ROR because he’s a #1 or #2 center and he was trying to acquire him for players he wanted to get rid of, not trade draft picks. While building through the draft and retooling you still have to acquire important players through player transactions.

This simply isn't accurate... Not giving up the #3 pick isn't rebuilding. It's being smart.
Especially since he tried to trade Max for another 1st round pick so he could use it to trade for ROR. MB is not in rebuild mode. He is in the same mode he was in last summer and that is failure to sign good players mode.

 

[OldCraig71]

He was told early that Stastny and Tavares wouldn’t come here. That’s why he went the way of the rebuild. If he wasn’t rebuilding he’d have taken ROR for the 3rd overall pick, which he didn’t. He wanted ROR because he’s a #1 or #2 center and he was trying to acquire him for players he wanted to get rid of, not trade draft picks. While building through the draft and retooling you still have to acquire important players through player transactions.

Wait, what? Molson even slipped out something about John Tavares at the end of the season. Please don't give these fools this type of credit. They only went to the microphone and talked about the future when they absolutely struck out at every turn and had no other option. Neither of these guys is a fan of rebuilding and frankly, neither should be in charge of rebuilding a team that they both(Molson&Bergevin) destroyed for no reason.

 

[Omar]

This simply isn't accurate... Not giving up the #3 pick isn't rebuilding. It's being smart.
Especially since he tried to trade Max for another 1st round pick so he could use it to trade for ROR. MB is not in rebuild mode. He is in the same mode he was in last summer and that is failure to sign good players mode.

You’ve given no explanation how it’s not accurate. If you can’t see the plan is different from last summer you don’t have a clue. And I want Bergevin gone.

Wait, what? Molson even slipped out something about John Tavares at the end of the season. Please don't give these fools this type of credit. They only went to the microphone and talked about the future when they absolutely struck out at every turn and had no other option. Neither of these guys is a fan of rebuilding and frankly, neither should be in charge of rebuilding a team that they both(Molson&Bergevin) destroyed for no reason.

Oh I agree. They were forced into this because all these guys said no to Montreal. It’s good for the future.

 

[theghost1]

How many teams are in serious need right now - real contenders - to make the leap?

St. Louis. Maybe Anaheim...

Calkgary for sure need a goalie now....they are going for it ...Hanifin trade,Neal signing they have Mike Smith mid thirties last year of his contract.

 

[The Great Weal]

10.5 is absolutely not worth it, no denying that. But retaining 2 million makes him an 8.5 goalie, which is pretty much worth his play.

 

[HockeyDBspecialist]

10.5 is absolutely not worth it, no denying that. But retaining 2 million makes him an 8.5 goalie, which is pretty much worth his play.

Fleury just signed at 7M..... fleury who has been a god the last year and didn't went ham on the bank.

now I really know how miss managed the habs are. it's a shit show down here

 

[BLONG7]

10.5 is absolutely not worth it, no denying that. But retaining 2 million makes him an 8.5 goalie, which is pretty much worth his play.

The only reason he got 10.5m is the cap was going up, and his agent was holding MB by the ball$.

 

[Habs Icing]

Pacioretty's currently in the same situation as Matt Duchene two years ago -- a player who's been on the trade block for ages. Like Pacioretty, Duchene was still on Colorado's roster as he entered his final contract year. Despite Sakic holding out for a year, he ended up getting a 1st, 2nd, and 3rd round pick, plus prospects & players, for him. Pacioretty is a bit older but has a better resume, so Bergevin better demand at least as much. Teams pushing for respectability like Edmonton or Buffalo would be good targets.

I don't think Captain Ready's resume is better than Duchene. He may have scored more goals but his reputation precedes him. His resume has a lot of red flags aside from those goals. Even with a sign and trade deal no way does he get us what Duchene got for the Avs. His playoff performance against the Rangers coupled with the image of Torts berating him on the Team USA bench is just too big of a hurdle for NHL GMs. May explain why MB has had trouble trading him. If we get a 1st and a middling prospect, I'd be surprised.

 

[Lshap]

I don't think Captain Ready's resume is better than Duchene. He may have scored more goals but his reputation precedes him. His resume has a lot of red flags aside from those goals. Even with a sign and trade deal no way does he get us what Duchene got for the Avs. His playoff performance against the Rangers coupled with the image of Torts berating him on the Team USA bench is just too big of a hurdle for NHL GMs. May explain why MB has had trouble trading him. If we get a 1st and a middling prospect, I'd be surprised.

Pacioretty's last playoff performance was a huge disappointment for us as fans, but GMs aren't looking at one series, or one event on Team USA when assessing his value for the next five/six years. Fans get worked up over single events; GMs evaluate the whole picture. Pacioretty is a captain who's been one of the most consistent 30+ goal scorers in the league (notwithstanding last year). He'll be traded on that basis.

The only factor that's worse than Duchene is the remaining length of his contract.

 

[Habs Icing]

Pacioretty's last playoff performance was a huge disappointment for us as fans, but GMs aren't looking at one series, or one event on Team USA when assessing his value for the next five/six years. Fans get worked up over single events; GMs evaluate the whole picture. Pacioretty is a captain who's been one of the most consistent 30+ goal scorers in the league (notwithstanding last year). He'll be traded on that basis.

The only factor that's worse than Duchene is the remaining length of his contract.

I only mentioned the last playoff series because it would be the upper most on GM's minds but he has been a flop in almost every international and playoff series. The sole exception would be his first playoffs years and years ago. If you're expecting in return what Duchene fetched you'll be disappointed.

 

[montreal]

I don't see how any of you guys think we are actually tanking/rebuilding.

Were we rebuilding, Price, Patches and Weber would have been gone already. You can't tank with these guys around. And even if you do, you're stuck with large contracts to declining players when your team is getting better.

I don't know what they are doing, likely tanking/rebuilding by default since our GM sucks at his job and our owner is too cheap to do anything about it.

But I don't agree that Price/Pac/Weber still being here means anything one way or the other. Price has a NMC, so he goes nowhere until he wants to. So the Habs could in theory have figured out how f***ed they are and said we need to focus on the draft, picks and prospects. I don't know if they are smart enough to do that, but it doesn't matter cause if Price says I don't want to go, he's not going anywhere and there's nothing we can do about it. Weber has been injured for almost a year, so he can't be traded as his value has to stink seeing that he'll miss over a full year to injury. Might as well keep him around to show he's healthy and can contribute to up his trade value. Pac who knows maybe he gets traded at some point.