Where in the world is Filip Zadina?

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WingsMJN2965

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Oct 13, 2017
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Are you meming?

I believe he's mocking the genius in the Zadina thread that spent several pages trying to explain how Zadina's production was irrelevant because he scored points off lucky rebounds/deflections and f*** ups by the opposing team.

As if every player doesn't get these kind of points...
 

Section88

Kaner? I hardly know her
Jul 11, 2017
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Love to see people sour on an 18 year old... give him some time. He womt be a star from day 1
 

Sensmileletsgo

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Oct 22, 2018
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Yeah but have you seen the points he’s gotten? A lot of them are rebound goals or not very pretty. He doesn’t really deserve any of them.
haha that sounds like Tkachuk although we praise him for getting all the dirty goals
 

Snippit

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Alex Nylander similarly struggled adjusting from the CHL to AHL.

I think it's best to leave kids in the juniors for as long as possible unless they can make the NHL earlier.
 

Rhaegar Targaryen

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Jun 25, 2016
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What a ridiculous thread.

He's 18 years old and the AHL isn't a cakewalk. When I saw his production in the OP, I was actually impressed. That's around what I'd expect from him.

With that being said, it was also ridiculous for all the 'experts' on this page who criticized Ottawa, Montreal and Arizona for passing on him before anyone had even played a professional game yet. Especially considering guys like Tkachuk are looking pretty good in the NHL.
 

WingsMJN2965

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Alex Nylander similarly struggled adjusting from the CHL to AHL.

I think it's best to leave kids in the juniors for as long as possible unless they can make the NHL earlier.

I don't think Zadina gained anything from going back to Juniors and dominating kids.

His skill level is far superior for juniors, the issue is his fitness level is pretty lacking for pro, adult hockey. Still feel that he needs a significant offseason in the gym. Hopefully playing against men gives him that wakeup call.
 

Snippit

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I don't think Zadina gained anything from going back to Juniors and dominating kids.

His skill level is far superior for juniors, the issue is his fitness level is pretty lacking for pro, adult hockey. Still feel that he needs a significant offseason in the gym. Hopefully playing against men gives him that wakeup call.

I think there's always room to take your game to the next level. The juniors, especially in the 2nd half of the year and playoffs, gets pretty competitive.

It's not like Zadina was putting up 2 points a game.

Just personally am not a fan of kids going to the AHL at 18/19. Especially undersized skill forwards like Zadina and Nylander.
 

Pia8988

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NHL careers are not a sprint. Being the first there doesn't mean the most.
 

WingsMJN2965

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I think there's always room to take your game to the next level. The juniors, especially in the 2nd half of the year and playoffs, gets pretty competitive.

It's not like Zadina was putting up 2 points a game.

Just personally am not a fan of kids going to the AHL at 18/19. Especially undersized skill forwards like Zadina and Nylander.

6' 200 lbs is undersized?
 

Snippit

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6' 200 lbs is undersized?

Read 196, but point taken. Undersized probably applied better to Nylander.

Let's just say neither were really physically fit enough for pro hockey.

In Nylander's case, I believe it hurt his development. Zadina was/is a better prospect so he might have a better time of it, but it's just not my preferred route for teenagers still eligible for junior hockey.
 

WingsMJN2965

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Read 196, but point taken. Undersized probably applied better to Nylander.

Let's just say neither were really physically fit enough for pro hockey.

In Nylander's case, I believe it hurt his development. Zadina was/is a better prospect so he might have a better time of it, but it's just not my preferred route for teenagers still eligible for junior hockey.

I rounded up. As for the fitness, I definitely think it's lacking, but I don't think it hurts him to get that experience and push him toward improving on it.

I don't think having him continue to dominate kids in Junior would pressure him to get better in the gym. Having guys blow his doors off in the pros will, though. For what it's worth, summers in the gym is what really blew up Cholowski's stock.

Also, as for his production in the Q, aside from Lefreniere, he was the only player in top 10 production who wasn't previously drafted or draft eligible. (Two 2017 draftees, several 2016 draftees or 20 year old players)
 

Snippit

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I rounded up. As for the fitness, I definitely think it's lacking, but I don't think it hurts him to get that experience and push him toward improving on it.

I don't think having him continue to dominate kids in Junior would pressure him to get better in the gym. Having guys blow his doors off in the pros will, though. For what it's worth, summers in the gym is what really blew up Cholowski's stock.

Also, as for his production in the Q, aside from Lefreniere, he was the only player in top 10 production who wasn't previously drafted or draft eligible. (Two 2017 draftees, several 2016 draftees or 20 year old players)

His production was good for a draft eligible no doubt, but there's always room to improve your overall game with another year.

You see guys like Mitch Marner, who put up 2 p/gp in junior in his draft year, come back just to do it again. Doesn't look like it hurt him at all.
 

WingsMJN2965

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His production was good for a draft eligible no doubt, but there's always room to improve your overall game with another year.

You see guys like Mitch Marner, who put up 2 p/gp in junior in his draft year, come back just to do it again. Doesn't look like it hurt him at all.

Sure, but I think Marner was more complete than Zadina is. I think Detroit's goal is and has been to round him out. Don't think he'd do that ripping one timers from his office in Halifax.

Also worth mentioning, don't believe Marner was AHL eligible. Otherwise the Leafs probably would've sent him there, like they did Nylander.
 
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93LEAFS

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His production was good for a draft eligible no doubt, but there's always room to improve your overall game with another year.

You see guys like Mitch Marner, who put up 2 p/gp in junior in his draft year, come back just to do it again. Doesn't look like it hurt him at all.
People exaggerate the need of immediately graduating guys all the time. It's not like it has been a great track record of CHL guys being rushed forward on the loan loophole. I'm not sure it helped Julius Honka or Alex Nylander. I obviously hope it works for Sandin (like Wings do for Zadina), but I'm not delusional to what has happened. But, it would also be insane to draw firm conclusions on 2 players.

People think prospects always need to be challenged. I sometimes think to perfect the flaws in your game, you need to play against lower competition so you have the opportunity to refine them. Now, I do get the counter-argument is, that if players don't take that advice to specifically work on weaknesses, they will develop bad habits because it's easy to be productive in juniors while ignoring these things for high-end talents. Now, getting guys with your development staff has its pluses. But, I do think staying back in junior tends to be exaggerated. For example, I don't think it would have made a difference with Marner like you cited, and I don't think it would have helped Barzal have a better rookie year.

Zadina's production in the QMJHL was good and high-end, but its not like it was something crazy. It was in line with someone like Timo Meier.
 

93LEAFS

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Sure, but I think Marner was more complete than Zadina is. I think Detroit's goal is and has been to round him out. Don't think he'd do that ripping one timers from his office in Halifax.

Also worth mentioning, don't believe Marner was AHL eligible. Otherwise the Leafs probably would've sent him there, like they did Nylander.
They couldn't. William was sent due to being from Sweden. But, I would look at the case of Alex Nylander who had great CHL production but a flawed game, and was pushed into the AHL (partially due to his dad falling out with Sauga, but that's another story) before he was ready. I personally think its easier to round out your game against lesser comp if you are willing to work specifically on those areas without cheating for easy offence. Tough to stay disciplined though.
 

puckpilot

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WingsMJN2965

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They couldn't. William was sent due to being from Sweden. But, I would look at the case of Alex Nylander who had great CHL production but a flawed game, and was pushed into the AHL (partially due to his dad falling out with Sauga, but that's another story) before he was ready. I personally think its easier to round out your game against lesser comp if you are willing to work specifically on those areas without cheating for easy offence. Tough to stay disciplined though.

Eh, I would look at Larkin as a recent specific example of somebody who was thrown in the deep end and was in way over his head, and became a better player for it.

Granted, that's a character thing, but I think Zadina has the work ethic to find his flaws and improve on them.
 

93LEAFS

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Eh, I would look at Larkin as a recent specific example of somebody who was thrown in the deep end and was in way over his head, and became a better player for it.

Granted, that's a character thing, but I think Zadina has the work ethic to find his flaws and improve on them.
Larkin was in the NCAA in his draft +1 and had one of the best freshman seasons in recent memory compared to prior levels. Now, Zadina is a late-birthday compared to Larkin being an early birthday which stops it from being a like for like comparison. I would also add, Larkin was an extremely well-rounded player at the NCAA level.

My main point was

That harder comp doesn't always=Better development situation.

You can argue either side, as there is no clear sign one is significantly better than the other. I like the idea of playing at lower levels allowing you to focus on your weaknesses (and its easy to play a player in a situation that challenges it), whereas at higher levels you can be focusing on how to just survive. Now, it requires a prospect (and his junior coach) buying into this approach. Now, I also know, that a player could just play the same game without working on those things and tear up the league possibly leading to bad habits that stick. There is no perfect solution.
 

Snippit

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Eh, I would look at Larkin as a recent specific example of somebody who was thrown in the deep end and was in way over his head, and became a better player for it.

Granted, that's a character thing, but I think Zadina has the work ethic to find his flaws and improve on them.

I'll throw in another example to the fold...Casey Mittelstadt. Like Zadina he's not undersized but he really lacks strength and IMO fitness.

You can see the talent but maybe he would have been better served in the NCAA for another year, or even the AHL.
 

Acallabeth

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Jul 30, 2011
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17 points in 28 games in the second best mens hockey league in the world as a 18 year old? I'm not worried about his career
Me neither. The travel from Grand Rapids to other KHL teams must be exhausting.

By the way, about the KHL. We're witnessing another example of a prospect going from a professional league to torching inferior kids in the QMJHL and then needing time to adapt back to the professional level. A wasted year, but hey, he got drafted #6 instead of maybe #10. Should have stayed in the Czech league or play in the K instead.
 

WingsMJN2965

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Larkin was in the NCAA in his draft +1 and had one of the best freshman seasons in recent memory compared to prior levels. Now, Zadina is a late-birthday compared to Larkin being an early birthday which stops it from being a like for like comparison. I would also add, Larkin was an extremely well-rounded player at the NCAA level.

My main point was

That harder comp doesn't always=Better development situation.

You can argue either side, as there is no clear sign one is significantly better than the other. I like the idea of playing at lower levels allowing you to focus on your weaknesses (and its easy to play a player in a situation that challenges it), whereas at higher levels you can be focusing on how to just survive. Now, it requires a prospect (and his junior coach) buying into this approach. Now, I also know, that a player could just play the same game without working on those things and tear up the league possibly leading to bad habits that stick. There is no perfect solution.

Larkin was pretty brutal in his second season, where he was unprotected against players much better than him.

And as a pretty strong parallel, his added strength this season has gone a long way toward his improvement. He's outmuscling guys a lot now.
 
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