When injury ruined run for an individual Trophy or record

[alko]

Clear example Mario Lemieux in his 1992/1993. Man can only dream, what could we see in full season.

Connor McDavid has 3 hundert points seasons, but if there wasnt an injury in his rookie season, he could have 4.

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[daver]

Clear example Mario Lemieux in his 1992/1993. Man can only dream, what could we see in full season.

Connor McDavid has 3 hundert points seasons, but if there wasnt an injury in his rookie season, he could have 4.

If McDavid reached 100 points that year, it would rival his other seasons for his career best; no other player in NHL history who has won an Art Ross came close to putting up a career best season as an 18 year old rookie. It is more likely that a full season from McDavid as a rookie sees him maybe reaching 80 points (a solid Top Ten). Let's not forget that Mario was barely a Top 10 producer in his rookie year.

Mario likely adds another full peak season that rivals Wayne's best if not for injury.

Any one of Crosby's 10/11 to 2013 stretch of seasons is an obvious one. Perhaps the best player in history lacking a full season at their peak.

 

[The Panther]

Clear example Mario Lemieux in his 1992/1993. Man can only dream, what could we see in full season.

Connor McDavid has 3 hundert points seasons, but if there wasnt an injury in his rookie season, he could have 4.

I kinda disagree with both of these.

What trophy or record was Lemieux going to get (that he didn't already get) in 1992-93? His stats went nuts during the Pens' 17-game winning streak at the end of the season, which wasn't sustainable. Actually, if you add in his 11 playoff games, he scored 178 points in 71 games, which is probably a more realistic pace for his season. Almost no doubt he would have cracked 200 points, however (same in 1988-89), so too bad about that.

Then, McDavid paced for 87 points in his rookie season, so he might have finished around 3rd in scoring -- which would have been incredible and a slam-dunk Calder -- but I don't think he was hitting 100 points, no matter what.

Some ones that come to mind:
-- I wonder if Bobby Orr missed getting his fourth-straight (and, as it turned out, last) Hart trophy in 1972-73 because of missing 15 games. His pace was for 125 points, just a few behind Esposito for the League-lead. He might have won the scoring title again, and if he'd done so, voters would have had to give him another Hart.
-- Wayne Gretzky might have missed officially winning the Art Ross as a rookie in 1979-80 because he missed 1 game... he needed only 1 point to surpass Dionne in scoring, as it turned out. Gretzky also certainly lost the Art Ross (to Mario) in 1987-88 because of 16 games lost to injury. Had he not missed that 1 and those 16 games, he'd likely have had 9 straight scoring titles for 9 seasons in Edmonton.
-- Crosby clearly lost an Art Ross in 2013. Wasn't he only surpassed in scoring in the last few days of the (short) season, and he missed 12 games?

 

[daver]

What trophy or record was Lemieux going to get (that he didn't already get) in 1992-93? His stats went nuts during the Pens' 17-game winning streak at the end of the season, which wasn't sustainable. Actually, if you add in his 11 playoff games, he scored 178 points in 71 games, which is probably a more realistic pace for his season. Almost no doubt he would have cracked 200 points, however (same in 1988-89), so too bad about that.

He was at a 230 point pace after 47 games in 88/89 and finished at a 210 pace. He was at a 210 pace after 40 games in 02/03 so it definitely seems unreasonable to think he could have broken the 215 record.

 

[Midnight Judges]

If McDavid reached 100 points that year, it would rival his other seasons for his career best; no other player in NHL history who has won an Art Ross came close to putting up a career best season as an 18 year old rookie. It is more likely that a full season from McDavid as a rookie sees him maybe reaching 80 points (a solid Top Ten). Let's not forget that Mario was barely a Top 10 producer in his rookie year.

Mario likely adds another full peak season that rivals Wayne's best if not for injury.

Any one of Crosby's 10/11 to 2013 stretch of seasons is an obvious one. Perhaps the best player in history lacking a full season at their peak.

Crosby has multiple full seasons at his peak (age 21, 22, 26, 27, 28, etc.). They just aren't that great. It's not a coincidence that his pace fell every time he had to play a full season. Many other players have demonstrated precisely the same pattern - Auston Matthews most recently.

 

[The Panther]

Maybe Ray Bourque? In 1981-82, he was 2nd in Norris voting to the Hawks' Doug Wilson, but Ray missed 15 games. Had he played all 80 games, he'd have had around the same number of points as Wilson and a much better plus/minus.

Same in 1982-83. There was considerable hype over Rod Langway's defense and the Capitals' accordant improvement, but Ray again missed 15 games and was pacing for 90 points and a +60 rating. Langway scored 3 goals and went -2. Oh yeah, and Boston was 1st overall. What possible justification could there be for Langway winning the Norris if Bourque had played the full 80 games?

(Bourque probably had a chance to also win the Norris in 1988-89, but he missed 20 games. However, this season is a bit less likely, I think.)

I'm thinking Bourque has seven Norris trophies without those two early-career injuries.

 

[Pominville Knows]

He was at a 230 point pace after 47 games in 88/89 and finished at a 210 pace. He was at a 210 pace after 40 games in 02/03 so it definitely seems unreasonable to think he could have broken the 215 record.

Don't compare 2002/03 Mario with the 1988/89 one, buddy.

 

[Voight]

He wasn't hurt, but if Ovechkin doesn't miss 3 games for his grandfathers funeral in the 2009-2010 season, he walks away with the Hart/Pearson/Art Ross/Richard.

He did that in 2008, and in 2009 he was only missing the Art Ross from his haul.

So in a 3 season span he would have ended up with a Howe/Gretzky-esque haul of 3 Hart's, 3 Pearsons, 3 Richards/goal scoring titles and 2 Art Ross'. Quite historical.

Also worth noting that in 2009 if he plays an extra 3 games (can't remember if he was Hurt or why he missed those games) he likely beats Malkin for the Art Ross.

 

[Voight]

He was at a 230 point pace after 47 games in 88/89 and finished at a 210 pace. He was at a 210 pace after 40 games in 02/03 so it definitely seems unreasonable to think he could have broken the 215 record.

Really doubt a 37 year old Lemieux scores 200 points or anywhere close to that, considering his younger self wasn't able to and really only came close once. That is part of the "on pace" problem.

 

[BigBadBruins7708]

Tim Thomas's hip in 2009-10.

Without the injury he likely has 3 consecutive Vezinas and is probably in the Hall despite the short career.

Would be:

3x Vezina
Cup
Smythe
Potentially 3x led in GAA and sv%
Potentially 2x Jennings (considering Rask led the league in GAA in 2010)

 

[tony d]

I think Lemieux gets over 200 pts. in 1992-1993 if he stayed healthy. The run he was on that year was awesome.

 

[frisco]

Lemieux in 89-90 almost assuredly wins the Ross, Hart, and Penguins make the playoffs if he doesn't hurt his back. Also, at only five games to the point scoring streak (46 to Gretzky's 51) when he was hurt he probably gets that record.

Pierre Turgeon at 1.27 points/game for a full 82 beats Jagr for the Ross in 2000 (assuming Jagr is NOT healthy and still misses his games).

My Best-Carey

 

[bobholly39]

I kinda disagree with both of these.

What trophy or record was Lemieux going to get (that he didn't already get) in 1992-93? His stats went nuts during the Pens' 17-game winning streak at the end of the season, which wasn't sustainable. Actually, if you add in his 11 playoff games, he scored 178 points in 71 games, which is probably a more realistic pace for his season. Almost no doubt he would have cracked 200 points, however (same in 1988-89), so too bad about that.

Then, McDavid paced for 87 points in his rookie season, so he might have finished around 3rd in scoring -- which would have been incredible and a slam-dunk Calder -- but I don't think he was hitting 100 points, no matter what.

Some ones that come to mind:
-- I wonder if Bobby Orr missed getting his fourth-straight (and, as it turned out, last) Hart trophy in 1972-73 because of missing 15 games. His pace was for 125 points, just a few behind Esposito for the League-lead. He might have won the scoring title again, and if he'd done so, voters would have had to give him another Hart.
-- Wayne Gretzky might have missed officially winning the Art Ross as a rookie in 1979-80 because he missed 1 game... he needed only 1 point to surpass Dionne in scoring, as it turned out. Gretzky also certainly lost the Art Ross (to Mario) in 1987-88 because of 16 games lost to injury. Had he not missed that 1 and those 16 games, he'd likely have had 9 straight scoring titles for 9 seasons in Edmonton.
-- Crosby clearly lost an Art Ross in 2013. Wasn't he only surpassed in scoring in the last few days of the (short) season, and he missed 12 games?

Regarding Lemieux in 93 - lumping in playoff with regular season totals doesn't make sense. Scoring usually goes down in playoffs. Also - i'm sure his health took a toll on him towards year end, he obviously wasn't at 100% in those playoffs.

As to what record Lemieux was going to get in 93 - the answer is obvious. Both 215 points and 92 goals are up for grabs. I'm not saying he for sure gets them - but he absolutely would have made a run at them.

Edit - Also - we can spend the next 20 pages worth talking about Lemieux and missed opportunities to injuries and health. I think everyone here knows about him - probably more fun to talk about other players.

 

[bobholly39]

Carey Price - 2015-2016 season.

He was coming off a Hart/Lindsay win in dominating fashion, almost a unanimous victory. He started out the next season even stronger it seemed - granted it was only 12 games but he was surpassing his numbers from the previous year, and Habs started the year out crazy something like 18 wins and 2 losses in first 20 games.

Always curious what could have been. This was the year Kane had his flagship season, winning the hart and lindsay in dominating fashion. I'm not saying after only 12 games it's fair to say Price would have held on all year and topped that season by Kane - but I do wonder if he could have repeated his success from the prior year and how that would have stacked up at year end for award season.

 

[DannyGallivan]

Paul Kariya's legacy was hurt big time because of Suter's cross-check to his face. I think he had a legitimate shot at the Hart, Art Ross and Maurice Trophy's in '98... and his injury likely cost Canada a gold medal in Nagano. He was second in Hart voting in '97 despite missing 13 games, so that's another one he could have had.

 

[NyQuil]

I would have liked to see Karlsson’s season if the Cooke Achilles slice never happened.

He was playing at a level we hadn’t seen before or since.

 

[daver]

Don't compare 2002/03 Mario with the 1988/89 one, buddy.

Meant 92/93

 

[TheGuiminator]

In the cap era :

Ovechkin (2008-09) : missed 3 games but I do think he would have won the Art Ross.

Ovechkin (2009-10) : not an injury, but I think he missed games because of his grandpa’s funeral. He’s definitely winning the Art Ross and the Hart had played 82 games.

Crosby (2010-11) : it’s a no brainer, without the concussion, Sid is winning the Art Ross, Hart, Lindsay and possibly the Rocket.

Crosby (2012-13) : again, wins comfortably the Hart, Art Ross adding to his Lindsay

Kane (2014-15) : I think Kane had a legit chance of winning the Art Ross that year. He was 1st point leader when he got injured and i think he could had outpointed Benn relatively easy.

 

[Florbalista]

Paul Kariya's legacy was hurt big time because of Suter's cross-check to his face. I think he had a legitimate shot at the Hart, Art Ross and Maurice Trophy's in '98... and his injury likely cost Canada a gold medal in Nagano. He was second in Hart voting in '97 despite missing 13 games, so that's another one he could have had.

Kariya missed the first 30 games of the 97/98 season because he wanted to be filthy rich. And no, he wasn't gonna outscore Forsberg, Selanne, or Jagr playing 30 fewer games. Suter or not.

As for his absence having cost Canada a gold medal in Nagano... That's pure fantasy with no place for 'likely'.

 

[quoipourquoi]

Paul Kariya's legacy was hurt big time because of Suter's cross-check to his face. I think he had a legitimate shot at the Hart, Art Ross and Maurice Trophy's in '98... and his injury likely cost Canada a gold medal in Nagano. He was second in Hart voting in '97 despite missing 13 games, so that's another one he could have had.

Kariya’s season didn’t start until December 12th because he was a contract holdout.

 

[quoipourquoi]

Kariya missed the first 30 games of the 97/98 season because he wanted to be filthy rich. And no, he wasn't gonna outscore Forsberg, Selanne, or Jagr playing 30 fewer games. Suter or not.

As for his absence having cost Canada a gold medal in Nagano... That's pure fantasy with no place for 'likely'.

Winning the Richard Trophy (though it didn’t come around until the following year) would especially be tough; Selanne had 24 goals in 32 games while Kariya was holding out.

Selanne’s injury at the Olympics (and then the Ludwig hit later in the season) may have cost him, as he was at 41 goals and a league-leading 68 points in 56 games at the time.

 

[quoipourquoi]

Eric Lindros in 1995 is an obvious one, as he lost the Art Ross Trophy in a tiebreaker while missing the final two games of the season.

 

[JackSlater]

Injuries probably cost Bergeron the Selke in each of the last two seasons. Either win would have given him a record five Selke trophies. Pronger was the favourite to win the Norris in 2001 and 2007 before injuries caused him to miss games.

 

[DannyGallivan]

Kariya’s season didn’t start until December 12th because he was a contract holdout.

Ah... then we'll add "contract hold outs" to the list of things that hurt legacies. Let that be a warning to you RFA's out there.

 

[DannyGallivan]

As for his absence having cost Canada a gold medal in Nagano... That's pure fantasy with no place for 'likely'.

Canada's top shooter absent for a shoot-out game. No... it definitely sways things (especially when you add Sakic's injury against Belarus that prevented him from playing).

Conjecture? Yes. Fantasy? No.