When Hasek was a Sabre...

[Rhiessan71]

Probably more a result of him playing more games than anyone else, though.

Roy GP-247 W-151 L-94
Brodeur GP-181 W-99 L-82

66 more games played yet only a mere 12 more losses. I think it is a little more than just playing more games.

 

[GuineaPig]

Roy GP-247 W-151 L-94
Brodeur GP-181 W-99 L-82

66 more games played yet only a mere 12 more losses. I think it is a little more than just playing more games.

Oh, I'm not denying that Roy was a phenomenal playoff goalie. He's probably near the top of goalies in GVT per game. But it definitely helps that's he's played significantly more games than anyone else.

 

[Rhiessan71]

Oh, I'm not denying that Roy was a phenomenal playoff goalie. He's probably near the top of goalies in GVT per game. But it definitely helps that's he's played significantly more games than anyone else.

Dude, again, how many games he played has little to do with it.
If it makes it easier for you to comprehend then break it down into his Hab years and Av years. It doesn't matter which way its presented.
Just use one or the other against the goalies with less games played and it amounts to the same dominance.

Habs GP- 114 W-70 L-42
Av's GP- 133 W-81 L-52


Lets put it another way, with JUST his Hab wins he would be 9th and with JUST his AV wins, he would be 5th on the all-time list.

You're trying to use the "Compiler" argument and it quite simply does not apply here in the slightest.

 

[tombombadil]

That´s probably the list I´ve seen that´s most accurate to my view on things. That´s because I didn´t get to see Gretzky in his Edmonton-years and not enough of Yzerman in his greatest producing years I would guess. Would even consider putting Lindros in the top layer for his play cirka 93-97, a true force on the ice... Maybe even Forsberg during some runs... Best way to measure could be how scared you are when a player is on the ice while playing for the opposite team.

And to answer the question:
Was there a more dominating goalie youve ever seen?
I would say no. Roy is close and some of his playoffruns would probably make my answer yes on occassions. On the other hand Roy had some "downruns". Especially on the ones he had a knack for fetching the puck on dump ins. Roy was no Brodeur with the stick...

Did he get into players heads?
He would make the softest of hands stiff up when given a scoring chance (must be a joke in there...).

Would have loved to see Prime-Hasek in todays shootouts. Prime-Datsyuk v.s. Prime-Hasek...

Thanks, man.

On the topic of "getting in heads"... I'm paraphrasing, but I remember a Gretzky quote where he said, "A goalie comes into the league, and he stops everyone, until, after a while, everyone gets a book on him. The worst part about Dom is that, not only do I not have a book on him, but I think he has one on me."

That's praise.

For the guy bashing Hasek. All of what you are saying is a bunch of ******* but the one thing that stood out the most is saying that the Sabres were good without him. They weren't. They were **** [mod edit]

 

[nik jr]

How good or highly regarded was Hasek in Chicago? Did he outshine Belfour many times?

The improvement in SV% and GAA from 92-93 to 93-94 is enormous.

One of my favorite players of all time for sure, I started following him in 1994 or 1995 when I saw him make a great save in TV's sporting news on Finnish national television.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dominik_Hašek

i think hasek probably improved a lot by being exposed more to butterfly goaltending. i have not seen very much of him from before buffalo, but he seemed to stand up more.

...and did so a bunch of times.

Oh, and Dom's bail job on Detroit, the Ottawa years, and getting benched for Ozzi are all greaaaat additions to his legacy.

hasek did not bail on DRW (retired), only played 1 season in ottawa, and was 43 when he was benched for osgood.

i don't see how being an NHL goalie at 43 could be a bad thing. hasek was probably one of the worst goalies in '08, though.

LOL Hasek fans would have you believe that he achieved his glory behind expansion teams. Those Buffalo teams were very good without Dom.

buffalo '94-'01 without hasek in net: 64-76-13

how many very good teams are 12 games below .500?

 

[GuineaPig]

i don't see how being an NHL goalie at 43 could be a bad thing. hasek was probably one of the worst goalies in '08, though.

One of the things I've always wondered about: Hasek posted a 0.928 EV Sv % during 2007-08 (for comparison's sake, that was the same as Miller when he won the Vezina in '09-'10). His overall sv% was brought down by a pretty bad PK sv % (0.822), and less by a thoroughly mediocre PP sv % (0.848).

I don't know whether Detroit had a particularly bad penalty kill that year (I doubt it; Osgood's numbers were pretty good), or there are some issues just due to sample size, or whatever. My theory is that while Hasek's aging left him still in the elite tier of goalies at even strength, his quickness and side-to-side movement left him somewhat vulnerable while on the penalty kill. This, plus perhaps some bad luck or a really weird variance, was responsible for his overall low save percentage that season. EV Sv % is usually the best (unadjusted) single indicator of goalie skill, but I think there's a little more at work during Hasek's final years, especially his last.

 

[nik jr]

One of the things I've always wondered about: Hasek posted a 0.928 EV Sv % during 2007-08 (for comparison's sake, that was the same as Miller when he won the Vezina in '09-'10). His overall sv% was brought down by a pretty bad PK sv % (0.822), and less by a thoroughly mediocre PP sv % (0.848).

I don't know whether Detroit had a particularly bad penalty kill that year (I doubt it; Osgood's numbers were pretty good), or there are some issues just due to sample size, or whatever. My theory is that while Hasek's aging left him still in the elite tier of goalies at even strength, his quickness and side-to-side movement left him somewhat vulnerable while on the penalty kill. This, plus perhaps some bad luck or a really weird variance, was responsible for his overall low save percentage that season. EV Sv % is usually the best (unadjusted) single indicator of goalie skill, but I think there's a little more at work during Hasek's final years, especially his last.

imo, hasek was just old and not very good.

DRW had great team D in '08, and i would guess allowed the lowest quality shots of any team.

 

[Gobo]

Patrick Roy > Dominik Hasek

 

[RECsGuy*]

Patrick Roy > Dominik Hasek

But, but Roys didn't put up teh pritty statz!

 

[Rhiessan71]

But, but Roys didn't put up teh pritty statz!

He can't hear it anyway, he has his 4 Stanley Cup rings and his (record) 3 Conn Smythe Trophies plugging his ears

 

[tjcurrie]

The only thing more amazing than his regular season stats is that he only win one Stanley Cup, and did so on a sickeningly stacked Red Wings team over a laughable Hurricanes squad. Literally took a perfect storm for him to win a championship.

You could say that about Ray Bourque, Ron Francis, Brett Hull, heck even guys like Mario Lemieux, Joe Sakic, Mike Modano, Steve Yzerman, etc etc etc the list goes on and on. These guys didn't just walk on to a team, put them on their backs, and waltz them to championships. It took the right mates and the right situations. Even look at Gretzky as others have mentioned. He won on stacked oiler teams. He never won again. Was he a loser or a bum or did he lose the ability to win all of a sudden when he went to L.A. ? Of course not. Even look at how many players never even won once: Marcel Dionne, Petr Stastny, Pat Lafontaine, Dale Hawerchuk, Brad Park, and on and on. Of course you need to be on the right team to win, but that goes for everybody and anybody, you can't knock a guy because of that. There's no denying that Hasek gave his Buffalo teams a chance to win and made them better than they were. And it's pretty much unanimous that the Czechs do not win that gold medal in 98 without him.

 

[LeBlondeDemon10]

When Hasek was a Sabre...

He was overrated. Dead puck era, gigantic, lumbering forwards, over sized equipment, peak of the trap and crease rules all play into his stats. He was good, but not as good as his stats suggest.

 

[GuineaPig]

When Hasek was a Sabre...

He was overrated. Dead puck era, gigantic, lumbering forwards, over sized equipment, peak of the trap and crease rules all play into his stats. He was good, but not as good as his stats suggest.

And so all the other goalies weren't as good as their stats either?

Because there was a massive gulf between Hasek and everyone else.

EDIT: And for the record, his Buffalo teams took many more penalties than average. From 1993-94 to 2000-01, the Sabres went 22nd, 9th, 4th, 3rd, 3rd, 4th, 8th, and 26th in the league in power plays against. This suggests that his stats were lowered by his team.

 

[Fire Sweeney]

When Hasek was a Sabre...

He was overrated. Dead puck era, gigantic, lumbering forwards, over sized equipment, peak of the trap and crease rules all play into his stats. He was good, but not as good as his stats suggest.

Yet Brodeur, Roy, Belfour, Joseph and others in their primes in the same era weren't even close to him.

 

[MadLuke]

When Hasek was a Sabre...

He was overrated. Dead puck era, gigantic, lumbering forwards, over sized equipment, peak of the trap and crease rules all play into his stats. He was good, but not as good as his stats suggest.

It's the ridiculous delta between him and the others that give him is status, not the absolute stats, and all the others were in the same situation.

 

[tjcurrie]

You can't go just by stats anyways. SO saying his stats are what they are because of the DPE isn't really the whole story. Comparing his stats to ther goalies of his era and he's tops as another boardie just posted. Any one with an unbiased opinion who watched him knows how he more often than not he completely shut the door and seemed unbeatable many a times.

 

[Corto]

When Hasek was a Sabre...

He was overrated. Dead puck era, gigantic, lumbering forwards, over sized equipment, peak of the trap and crease rules all play into his stats. He was good, but not as good as his stats suggest.

Absolute joke of a statement.

As the above posters mentioned, how'd you do explain the giant chasm between Hasek and everyone else then?

...

Pfft. Nay-sayers.

 

[pluppe]

Dominik Hasek > Patrick Roy

fixed

 

[arrbez]

So yeah, to answer the question, Hasek was the best I've seen. He was into my head, not just the players. I knew Canada was already dead going into that shootout in 1998.

Yup. If you ever want to see an example of a goalie dominating his opposition mentally, watch that Canada-Czech shootout in 1998. Lindros was the only one who made Hasek react to him (as opposed to letting Hasek dictate the play), and he hit the post. The other guys looked really tentative. You just couldn't beat Hasek down low, but still great shooters like Nieuwendyk and Shanahan tried deking him instead of shooting. The Shanahan deke in particular was really sad.